APBT= Bulldog or terrier

was that the one with the to pugs lmfao rofl that was the funiest shit ive ever seen in my life hands down... theye were so intense(for a couple of curs that is) yet so fuking retarded with there stupid over bites and suked in faces theye couldnt even get a hold of one another omg i cant stop thinking about how retarded theye were that is a must see for anyone who owns a game bread animal see some true intensity lol

 

ok this dog in the pick with good old don R.I.P looks very bulldogish to me whereas the dog in the other picture "finleys ch bo rom" seems to be more of a terrier looking dog agree guys??? some bulldogs i see definantly look more bulldogish then others and vice versa

 

but i will say this these dogs have 10 000 times more gameness loyalty courage tennacity inteligence strenght character and are more athletic and lovable then any other breed bulldog terrier hound or whatever theye are far superior (in my eyes anyway) to any dog or person ive ever met just an opinion

 

Alot of breeders over the years (since 1880) have made their own crosses. {Bulldog, mastiff, Patterdale... etc. (other breeds no one would admit to)}

(On another ridiculous sidenote (having nothign to do with the topic), I believe the AKC should have a class of dog called bulldog and included the many types from mastiff down that go into making today's bulldog mixes and take the amstaff out of the terrier category its unfair. I dont have AKC dogs but I hate watching the show's with the big pits next shitzu loking ass dogs.)

The mix is prob 70:30 for 29-35 pound dogs and less than 15 percent for everything else. JMO

 

if terriers arent game(not my opinion) and the smaller bulldogs have higher percentage of terrier blood then how come i see more game apbt that weigh only 30 to 40 pounds then 45 t0 60 pounds ???

 

if your talking about 1XLG... I believe it's because little dogs dont cause as much damage... Less deaths and longer matches...like boxing. Game is game 30 or 65 pounds.

People liked (pre 76) little dogs in the pit cause they were easier to handle and matches were more athletic/technique oriented and longer. More likely to win best in show. I personally would've liked to keep bigger dog's. I'm a bigger guy, I could have strangled a 75 pound mutt left handed. Handling no problem and i would've wanted to see some heavyweight classics (if I were around in pre-76)

 

good point i like smaller dogs but im not a big guy so maybe thats why lol wat ur saying does make sense though

 

hi!

i'm new in this forum and i'll try to explain my opinion about this topic...sorry for my bad english...i'm from italy!!!!

i don't believe in an half and half between bulldog and terrier to create the american pitbull terrier...in fact for me this name it's extremely wrong because these dogs are BULLDOGS!!

the blood of the apbt today and in the past is used like improver for many others bred...think about lurcher or cross with malinois...

to improve some carachteristics we have to use a best bred,so why the breeder of the past should have used terrier to improve bulldogs??

blood terriers doesn't improve nothing,because bulldogs of the past were the best dogs of the world,they were game, strong, they were hard biter and they were able to catch...think about the bulldogs of the staffordshire that were the strongest in badger driving...

with these dogs what terriers could improve???

in italy, but i think it's the same in the world, we can see a lot of apbt similar to little terrier or to whippet...but i think that this decrease of size is only an extremism like the increase of size of apbt of show...this extremism is caused,my opinion, only by grip consanguineity..


in true bulldog we don't see carachters of terrier..think about boudreaux dogs, hammond's dog, hollingsworth dogs...or in the past...colby's dogs or carver's dogs...where is terrier?????

god bless true bulldogs..

 

OK my 2 cents.
Being closely related to the british island , i can tel you a bit of history that i learnd from old dogman when i was yong.
The dog known as the APBT is NOT pure bulldog. Its a cross between Bulldog x terrier x everyting that fought and had valiuew.
People today tent to forget that in them days LONG befor the pictures of the dogs shown on this topic,That there was a time in our history that people where sirviving a very hard and toughf life, they didnt live they where sirviving!!!!. 4 out of 6 kids died befor they reatchst the age of 10 ore someting.

Dogs where not pets but animals that where used to get food on the table and to get rid of pests ecetera.
In those days dogs NEEDED to have some sort of strong caracter in order to sirvive ore to be fed!!!!.
The bulldog was NOT a fighting breed but a blood sport Bull Baiting dog selected over the cours of hunders of years.
To submit the bull . In those days it was belived that the fless of the bull would only be good for consumption if he was put into a rage that made his blood BOIL(everybody knows the fraze My blood was boling, meaning poeple are pissed of)
The bulldog was alredy selected for a long time specificly for that peurpose.
The only thing he needed to do was creep up in position leap to the nose of the bull and hang in there for dear life!!.
the longer he could hang on and the more brutal force of the bull he could take being horned trampeld having broken limps and open wounds ecetera. The beter the bull was raged the better the fless of the bull was going to sell bij the butchers!!!, who not sirprising ""where"" the breeders and keepers of the bulldogs in general!!.

Some historicel aczamples are known of a butcher who had a old and ageing crippeld bitch witch had pups, and to make a ecstra buck
he put her on a bull. When victories and the bull submited he took a knife and cut her guts open and ore cut her feet of to show how GAME she was when she took her death!!IN HOLDS.

In that aspect the bulldog was the gamest breed of the day. but by far not the BEST overal breed of the day.
when the english King banned te bull baiting blood sports, these butchers bulldogs wher getting obsoleat.
try out fights umongst them where oginized as they where known to be very agresif as wel.
Unfortunatly. they where NOT spectavulair as they would bite them selfs in hold and just hung in there.The specticel of the bulldog vs the BULL was him being trown around!!!. witch did not acured when they where hung into echother!!.

It was only logicel to use the fast and smaller rat and hunting terriers who where mutch more sufisticated and smarter and more agile to be crossed in to creat the BULL and Terrier (not to be confused with the bullterrier)

the word PIT comes from the RATTING pits used bij the terrier people, Who took there terriers in the working coal mine PITS to get rid of the rats and there for the diseases that came with these roadence.

As a side show and to make money and ore to be chozen bij mineing companies to get rid of rat infested pits(caol mines).
These terrier breeders orginized ratt pitting contests where individual terriers where able to kill as manny rats in the shordest times posible. side bets made gambler money and the terrier people as wel.

These terriers where used to creat the PIT dog(remember where that name PIT comes from) later know as the Pit bull terrier!!.
Later know as the Yankee terrier and iven later the American Pitbull terrier. when brought over bij the english and irish imigrands

Belive me when i say that every dog/ that came out of a bulldog cross ore terrier cross that could fight in the PIT was used to breed of.
In those days of the eurly divelopmend of the fighting breed there was NO understanding how and what to be use to breed off, but EVERTYTING that won was used.

Where do you guys think the black dots in SBT ore wite pitbull terriers come from!! yep the dalmatier. where do you think al the varius type,s in our beloved breed comes from??.
from every breed that was used in the creation of our breed.
I have seen manny a pitbull dog that nearly rezambeld a fricking labrador with long hairy tails, ore greyhound ore terrier type ore bulldog!!.
Fact is many breeds where used, but practily ALL where crossed with the bulldog of the day.
Terriers bij far where the best crosses with bulldogs because they added iven more to the fighting dog then what the bulldog diliverd,and there gamenes was ecstraordenary as wel, but the bulldog had the most of that quality in him, and was as toughf as nails.

i have a book called the Stonege on the dog printed in 1849, witch can still be bought pretty cheap on the internet.
They discribed the Bulldog being bred in the GREYHOUND and they show that it took 3 tot 4 breedings back in the greyhound to get the greyhound back. They probely did that to get a more eager dog to hunt and to race.

iven today there is still a problem umongst greyhouds while racing because they fight like crazy umongst them when hypet up(hensh the muzzle when racing)..
fact is the pitbull terrier is NOT 100% bulldog. i would say about 50% bulldog 25% terrier and 25% of other breeds that workt out. lets put up some pictures of our dogs from where you think another type of breed is shown tru. let me start of with GRCH Mammy at 26/27 lbs ore so she is real bulldog in the sense of gamenes but she aint no bulldog
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secomd picture a dog i bred
thats a bulldog in hart but also a bulldog in his trowback

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hi, i'm k ok with you about the condition of life in the past, and that dogs were animal...just like a pig or a sheep...they m ust to be helpful...

i agree with you about the fact that is possible that a % of blood of the past become from terrier, but i don't think that this % is sufficient to say that apbt is bulldog-terrier...

obiously if i need some carachteristics and i'm a sportman,i can cross two dogs that i consider helpful to me...for example to budger biting today it's so difficult to find dogs that can go down in the hole for just 1mt-1,5 mt bite strong and wait to catch and to pull out badger from his hole...so i can cross lines...or breed in grip affinity(like irish and apbt)...

but if i need to catch rats...i need dogs smaller...and here become terrier...ok...

but how much this % of cross has influenced modern apbt??

if you see the old pics of boxer, you can see that they are the same breed...

obiously bulldogs of the past have been influenced by the sports of the place and by their use...but there is an high % of homogeneity between bulldogs of continent(like german bulldog, netherlands bulldog(brabante bulldog, that were smaller than german) ) anb english bulldog or irish.

 

http://pitbullfamily.topicboards.com/t416-the-history-of-the-american-pit-bull-terrier -
There is a link I liked a lot. Very well tought out, and put together in a way that has humor, with some good history. Sure some have seen it. At this in history, speculation is getting the best of our loved DOGS.

 

sorry...in the last post, i said pics of boxer but i did't mean modern boxer,and neither boxer of first year of '900...i meant the ancestors of boxer...the german bulldog!! sorry!!!!!

 

I tried to PM Limey, but you are full......lol obviously everyone is glad you got back on.

 

hahah unfortunatly due to me being dislectic and partly tempararely blind ( right eye diabeties needs lager surgery) i have a big problem with this pm and incoming frinds stuff ecetera and messages im getting.. ones in a while my son clears stuf up for me. you have a pm

 

PS im not sure they are all glad because for the sour grapes people i used to be the man they love to hate!!!.. hahahahahhahahahahha

 

take care of yourself with that diabeties there limey that shit ain't no joke the wife has it and it can do some bad shit if you do not take good care of yourself she has damn near died from it before luckily we have got her on the right meds and i make sure she takes them on time and stuff but it is dangerous alot of people take it to lightly

 

take good care of yourself as i"m sure you do limey ! respect

 

I will say this
Today's APBT is the final and best expression of a bulldog use to be.
I dont think its a 50/50. I think at the core its a bulldog that has been made better
by using the terrier. Like an awesome custom car yeah you can put all you want on a chevy
paint it race the motor out and but some custom wheels on. Its still always going to be a chevy.
They should have named it Emperor bulldog. lol
ok that's my 2cents

 

My two cents,I belive our breed of dog is of Bulldog/Terrier blood, what % I have no clue.Back when this breed was being developed only certain classes where alowed to own certain types of dogs.The serf's could not own a hunting dog they owned Terriers,when bullbaiting was out lawed many a butcher's dog was crossed to obtain combat dogs as Limey said.The dogs where named becaused of what they did not for looks or color.Not all of the butcher's dogs where so called Bulldogs but most where.If the APBT is all Bulldog we would not have so many colors,no black's,black an tans,reds,buckskins ect.

 

very true, def where the fire comes from