why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

People produced dogs....

In reality only technology changes through time. The bulldog was a combat and as such GAME. The folks bred the dogs for purpose weren't and aren't the same as the folks attending dog shows. Show folk back then and still crossed/changed the nature and abilities of their dogs to show them.

Working folks do and did Cross some dogs but for hunting or baiting with various degrees of success. But the fastlane bulldog breeders knew their highly value GAMENESS wouldn't be enhanced by using other breeds.

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

The old bulldog type is still visible in some inbred strains.... Check out the pics I've posted previously.

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

The first terriers registered were from inbred fighting bulldogs in England around 1835 and they just put the terrier back into the bulldog. Both are one Bull and Terrier ... that is the breed. The APBT is the closest your going to get to those dogs in blood or function. Irish dogs were smaller than the english dogs and had more tenacity... Hinkle who founded the bull terrier got his pups from a litter that also had pups come to the states and go into the pit. Hinkle showbred and crossbred to get the bull terrier.. The traditional Game Bull Terrier as advertised by ConFeeley, and Colby were identical to dogs of today. Colby has dogs that were all three APBT, SBT, and AST in registery. What made them different was show standards and the []. The reason they aren't the same size is because obvioulsy in America they bred a bigger dog by norm. Pincher was 70lbs condidtioned so he was huge and Jerry was a 35lber.. that is a lot of diversity. I myself found the right crosses and fused them and got a 27lbs dog. All genuine dogs with genuine peds. Halls, Garner/Sorrell, Lonzo X Hammonds, Heinzl.. The whole litter looks like the lil irish dogs that come over. I believe its all bout the gentiecs and knowing what your doing with it. Proving game was the goal and the [] was the controlled environment, rules were set and ... now you have game dogs from 28lbs -100lbs .. the avg 40-50 .. all under the APBT banner. Takes longer and more time to keep dogs small once big dogs have introduced into the stock. Small females can't afford to be knocked up with a litter of pups from a 40lbs+ dog. Finding sure fire males 35lbs is a stipulations many don't have the patients for. Well .. commons sense tells you.. if APBT were all 35lbs and down and all were game as hell, most would still love the lil bulldogs. Its not likely a 35lbs game dog is going to kill a human. Big dogs are menacing. Little dogs are cute... that is the way of the lay-man.... hahaha

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

No, no, no. That's kinda freaky, man.
That's also the reason why I'm not able to reply to your last pm. Sorry, I'm still searching for the right words, lol.
But, this can't be true:

"The first terriers registered were from inbred fighting bulldogs in England around 1835 and they just put the terrier back into the bulldog. Both are one Bull and Terrier ... that is the breed."

And it doesn't look much better if you mention Hinkle or the, how do you call them ? traditional game bull terrier ? I mean, really ?
I guess your research goes back to the Alaunt. Is this where your Traditional Game Bull Terrier is coming from ? Do you really believe the White English and/or White American Terrier is the true game dog foundation ?
Hell no, it's not. Colby dogs don't have a pure foundation. It's crossed, mixed up, scatterbred and peddled. Colby dogs are a mix of different breeds. Sure, he used pure bred dogs and maybe even the best of it's kind at that time, but still it is what it is.

Bull Dogs and Terriers are completely different kind of breeds. Bull Dogs are a Molosser breed. Terriers are coming from dogs we call Spitz (?). That's a history over 6000 yrs old. So it doesn't makes any sense at all.

Spain ? Dogge de Bordeaux ? Original old american fighting dogs before 1600 ? And still kept pure ? LOL Come on.
Still sounds like I.M.'s own version about the history of these dogs. And I'm still sure that the Alaunt or the Hinkle dogs are in no way the original or true bred fighting dog.

I love these little red Terriers ! lol

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

Wow I can't belive I read this hole thread from start to finish.....

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

Lol that's hilarious gpys! Lmao!

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

Not for my eyes lmao I could fry an egg on them.

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

If you look at most Americans (the people) involved with these dog you will notice that most of them (Americans) still have British surnames and origins so the people working with the dogs now are like the same people that came over to America and started calling themselves American. Don't forget your origins now.

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

Hey blue paul those pics you put up the last one is of my sbt Rudy. Much regards Perry

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

Mine too, great thread though. I disagree yet agree with virtually everyone. Fascinating topic & some proper, proper, knowledgeable people.

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

Does it really matter that they look diff?? They look different bc until 1976 there was no breed standard so that's 100 years of breeding for personal stuff.... Gamedogs are bred to be game... Not look a certain way..... If you want dogs bred to look a certain way there are hundreds of mofos peddling RE dogs that are bred to look a specific way....

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

Man lol I swear look at the pics of dogs of the past and now and you'll see that there were variances then and now..... There is a range of sizes and colorations and all that..... Ppl always try discern the pure ness of certain dogs.... Man they are a mix of the bulldog and terrier.... So it was a mix to begin with and if Colby or Feely or any of the guys from back then did add something else in geuss what I thank them guys bc we have a great breed of dogs on our hands now

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

Man breeds dogs and has done since the iron age..... but they have been bred for purpose. The old Britains had large mastiff type war dogs used against the Romans who coincidently had their own large war dogs. These dogs were the ancestors of all domestic dogs. The closest living working "pure bred" dog living that has direct linage is the greyhound. The sight hounds have been selectively bred to catch quarry for millennium. The rest are outcrosses including our Pit dogs. The colours of the greyhounds are manifest in fastlane game dogs with the exception of the OFRN & solid white dogs. This is due to greater inbreeding in box dogs for gameness as it is a recessive trait which is not naturally selected for in nature. It serves the game dogs well that there is wide variety in the dogs that win which is remarkable considering the uniformity of sledge dogs, sight hounds, catch dogs, etc.....

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

who is this 'hinckle' fella?..

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

or hinkle?...

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

James hinks founder of the english bull terrier aka the big white dogs with the bulgy face.

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

i would not cal it perfected but improved .......
usa made from staffs ..pitbullterriers ....then they made the gamedog after that ....
staffs are not to compere with gamedogs

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

....thats b-cause ya never had one ks,,,,,,,,lol...lol...a game staff i mean ...........or a pit....come to think about it....lol..lol...:rofl:

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

bleu stil in the dark lol

 

Re: why don't apbt look like the dogs that first came over from england & ireland

Even I know that Keystone has owned staffs bfore.Correct me if im wrong Key but your first dog was a staff?And i am not makin fun of key at all for owning them.