When is a dog considered a good producer?

Not talkin about a dog that has just had his/her first litter and the pups are hot acting. I'm talkin about a legit producer, not so much a rom or por dog.
After how many litters?
How many inbred and how many outcrossed?
Bred to bloodlines that have proved to be great crosses or not?
Do you take the quality of bitches into account?
These are some of the things i think about but i want others take on this subject

 

Nice topic. As far as a legit producer, I think something that will pass his traits onto anything. The Bitch is important. But, the real producers are those that can be bred into anything and you will still see the sire.

 

When offspring are winning!!!....it's the only way to become a good producer!!...

 

But do u consider a dog that produced winning off his/her first breeding a producer? Or do you think you need to wait a few more breedings before you can call that dog a great producer? How do u know the other dog isn't what made those off spring great?

 

.......... X2

 

no! i think said dog has to produce more than one winning litter and the other dog has a great part in it also,that's why you breed best to best!

 

IMO......When consistently producing type = winners in every litter , @ a above average %

 

you have to start with a good bitch first . then there's alot of males to choose from . she needs to produce good with different males . then you can say she's a good producer . to many people think i need this male to make it work . it's 50-50 on the genes take are past . you can't have a good litter without that special bitch .

 

:0047::0047::goodposting:

 

once the owner don't need to leave the yard anymore. that's how i judge the production of sir/dame. when they do leave the yard & breed to others outside the family & get quality offspring. that's what a legit producer is to me.

 

you know ben i have'nt left the yard in 25 years . and i have different strains . they all mix together. and are proven to mix . when you know what works then you keep mixing . this produces what your looking for .

 

There are so many directions and options when breeding that many people own good producers and don't even know it as they breed to outcrossed most times. Even if they are producing good dogs, winning dogs etc.. they overlook the most important thing of all and that is to produce a dog who can produce equal or better than their sire and/or dam. I think that almost anyone can grasp how to increase size and vigor, roll the dice on gameness and win a match with a dog they produced if they understand conditioning and start with well bred dogs. The furthar they outcross the less consistant their offspring will breed and in time all you have left is the roll of the dice as the genetics become so loose you are no longer able to predict what your going to produce.

I say you can call your dog a good producer when he/she produces winning dogs that are themselves able to produce as good or better than themselves. After a few generations you have a "Good producing strain" that shows true to its type and you can go back to the foundation dogs 2-3 gens back and with proof of their production record say "That there is a good producing dog" and continue the line or strain based on their ability to produce producers.

NGK

 

sounds about right

 

bitches make the world go round

 

consistent producer, decent percentage

 

A good producing male puts out good dogs regardless of what they are bred to. Somebody quoted SOS as to saying Deacon could produce good dogs if he was bred to a fence post or something to that effect. Patrick said bolio produced good ones out of cold and cur dogs. Dogs like this are a rarity, but are what I consider good producers. Throw away the ROM list as it is the most deceiving thing out there. Also don't look to publications for a source of good producers. Many of the best producers are dogs you only hear about after they are long gone. There are a couple of dogs I would trade my eye teeth for thier offspring, but most have never heard of them. "Good dogs are where you find them" Earl Tudor.

 

if you believe what you just said you will never see a good 1 . you can't get one from the paper and think she will produce . it just does'nt work like that . they will though good ones here and there . but it's got to be something behind them first . and then good look .

 

It's only one way to consider a dog a good producer and that's by his offspring!!...some ppl are getting off da subject and putting to much thought in it!!...if his/she offspring are WINNING and producing WINNING dogs to different lines then to me that a good producer!!...u have to find out which is really the producer male or female and breed to different males and females!!...it plenty of hounds out here that are producing and the worlds knows!..might not kno how to get in contact with the person but ppl kno!...WINNING offspring is the only way 2 tell if he is a good producer cause if his offspring isn't winning then he/she are not a good producer!!....I don't care how u break it down, the only way to become a good producer is by his offspring!!...I think ngk said the way he tell a good producer is by the offspring, offspring..that's wayyyy to much time to tell if he is a good producer!!..get u three bitches or males with different blood, stick them to whoever u think is a good producer on ur yard and see wat happens...if u get 2 out of each litter that make rank then he's producing, if u get more than 2 out of each litter then he is producing his ass off!!....look at shorty cowboy offspring!...he has 2 section of offspring and he produced something nomatter wat bitch he was bred too...look at honeybunch, nomatter wat male she bred to she produced!!..if he or she is producing winning offspring he's a producer!!....vengeance is still around and he's producing some nice hounds, alot of his offspring are still young but the ppl behind those hounds will show wat he is producing!!....u do have to find out if it's the bitch are the male!

 

Let me simplify it for you Crush.

A dog must produce performers that have the ability to produce like themselves or better.
After several generations you will be able to look back at the ped and see both performers and producers but the dog that is both is the dog I would breed to in comparison to breeding to a dog that produces a performer that CANT PRODUCE a dog at least as good as himself/herself. If you stop at 1 generation and call a dog the producer of the century but his offspring never produce a damn thing you might as well sell poodles.

I stand by my answer that a good producer must produce dogs that can themselves produce good dogs.

NGK

 

I see wat u are saying but that's to long ngk!...if he is producing winning offspring it will be a dog in one of his litters that can produce!!...name me one line of dogs that are winners that didn't produce anything???...if dog produce winners one or a couple of his offspring will be a producer!..it's up to u to find him...why do ppl breed best to best because their odds are higher in getting good offspring!!...if u have a dog and bred him to three bitches and he produced 3 ch out of each litter, are u telling me he's not a good producer??..are u saying u have to wait 2 or 3 generations to tell if he's a good producer???...if that's wat u are sticking to then that is crazy IMO!