Merle Pit Bulls

I work at a small humane society and recently came across a red merle pit bull. She was fairly well put together, but I've never seen merle in a pit bull. Is this a result of a mutation or of bad breeding? She was a very nice looking dog and had a good temperament. The breed standard doesn't really mention it, so I hoped someone in here might have some insight on it.

 

these two links should answer all your questions!

http://www.game-dog.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6938&highlight=merle

http://www.game-dog.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7831&highlight=merle

Merle is a disqualification from the standard..

 

Thanks for clearing that up!

 

I have had merle APBTs for almost 10 years now. Only recently were they made a DQ & that was b/c of the poor quality offspring of one breeder, not b/c the color as a whole. If you would like to know more about merle bullies feel free to e-mail me or PM me, as merles are not well liked here & you will get a lot of negative feedback, mainly from ppl who know little to nothing about them. In the meantime, here are some pics of merle pit bulls I have owned over the years. Maybe they will help you.

Trey: blue merle


Cody: blue merle



Lucha - red merle



Riley - red merle



Pasha - chocolate merle



Little Dozer - chocolate merle


Hope these help!

 

And we've had merle Catahoula Bulldogs which look identical to merle "pit bulls" around here for more than 50 yrs. When they became popular, that's when merle "pit bulls" began to spring up.

 

Lets not make this a bashing thread!

The Fact of the matter is Merle is a disqualification from most registries. They will not even register them anymore

think about it.. Why would a registry who could make lots and lots of money, not to mention their clubs make more money at shows, not want to register the merle anymore?

Does any of this affect them being good pet dogs? No. But there is so much controversy over them being mixed that the registries would choose to not allow them registration anymore..

 

*sigh* See what I mean Jessie?

Mia ... firstly, merle CatBulls do not look identical to merle APBTs. They do favor one another, but both are bull breeds! ABs & APBTs favor one another too! So is every white APBT an AB?? Of course not! And I wouldn't say they're identical. For example, my dogs average about 45lbs c.w. CatBulls are double that.

And I must ask - if merle pit bulls are a recent creation due to a fad why have I (among others) had merle pit bulls years before the fad??? I had them when most fanciers didn't even know what a merle was! That right there sinks your creation via fad theory.

I will say this however - there are some merle APBTs out there that are mixed. But not all merle APBTs are.

Rocksteady: I agree we should not make this a bash thread. But it will be. We might as well brace for the worst now. I'm grabbing my kevlar helmet & flak vest now b/c I'm sure the bomb throwers are yanking out those pins & warming up their throwing arms!

As for acceptance, most registries do accept merle. the only ones that do not are ADBA, UKC & AAPBA. But they are accepted by all others.

And as to why ADBA enacted the merle DQ I have covered this many times. It was not b/c of the color, but b/c the actions of a bad breeder.

 

I love the merle color and it really looks good in pit bulls or pit crosses, whatever they are, but I don't like the colour being introduced into the breed. There are so many health risks when you start breeding merles. As far as the existance of the colour before it became popular, there were Cocker Spaniel-Poodle mixes long before there were Cockapoos. It could just have been an accidental mix that looked just like a pit bull. Some one may have liked the colour and bred the dog back to pure pit bulls.

 

Only if you breed merle x merle. Merles from a merle x merle mating are called homozygous merles & they do indeed have problems. But merles from a merle x non-merle breeding (called heterozyogus merles) are as healthy as any other color.

As for the introduction, who knows? It may have been introduced, or it may have been naturally found in the breed. No one knows for sure either way & to muddy the waters further, there is proof to support either theory. It could be one, it could be the other or it could be a little of both.

All I know is that both the ADBA & UKC have accepted merles from the very beginning & I myself can verify the breeding on my merles. How can I verify that? (I know someone is asking) I can verify that b/c the Lord has blessed me to know the merle bullies in the pedigrees of my dogs for seven generations & counting!

Now I will say again - there are merle bullies out there on whom the breeding cannot be verified & even some who are not pure. I'll put that out there from jump street. But not all merle bullies are mixed. I know this b/c I know my own dogs.

Well guys, feel free to bash away. As for me, I'm going to retire for the evening. Lord willing I'll read y'all tomorrow.

 

If there are full blooded APBTs that are merle (something I personally doubt), you should make it clear that the vast majority are mixes. If there are some that are not crossed, it is a one in a million chance. If this weren't true, there would have been more knowledge concerning their existence. Merles are not associated with this breed because nobody ever saw them in the past. Now, all of a sudden there are merle breeders all over the place. It seems pretty apparent that they must be crossed. You should really clarify this instead of just saying that "not all merles are crossed". Even if you do believe that your dogs are not crossed, you know damn well that the chances of a merle APBT is extremely rare and it is fair to say that you can put your last dime on the fact that every one of them you see is crossed and bred for that color, whether it is homozygous or heterzygous. Merle dogs are a disqualification for a reason.

Also, you can't say that the reason the registries stopped accepting merles is because of one breeder. If that was true, they would have stopped accepting blue dogs and white dogs because of their flaws and the breeders that were breeding these dogs with one another. Therefore, I truly doubt that it had something to do with one breeder. It goes much deeper than that.

 

ADBA, UKC, AADR, are 3 of the top APBT registries (considereing AKC doesnt accept them) CKC is a joke, along with APBR, and a few other (Im not including any of the "Game type registries as I dont think they hold conformation shows like BFKC)

None of them allow for merle registration anymore.

As tommy stated, they simply wouldnt ban them because of one breeder.

 

Is The Temp The Same Or Is It Different Because There Merle?

 

My father owned a Merle for about 10 years. And he or any of his pups never had any health defects. The pics I posted are of one of his daughters. She is ADBA registered and 5 years old.

 

I Have No Probs With Merle Dogs But If They Are Not Allowed To Be Registierd Adba Ukc And Aapba Thats Saying Something And That Is That They Are Curs With A Defect Because If Your Most Well Known And Respected Registieres Wont Allow Them Then There Is Defiently Something Wrong With Them.

 

i agree 100% tommy couldn't have said it any better

 

Well here is a link to what the ADBA had to say about it : http://www.adba.cc/p_pdetails.asp?fpid=50&pg=50Personally, I think they look very similar to Catahoula Bulldogs.

 

I think they are crosses of cataholas

 

well that clears up this whole argument the merle has been around for a long time, some have cross bred with other breeds to get this color pattern, and merles do contain genetic flaws so everyone was partially right

 

Ok guys I'm back. I will try to address everyone's comments/questions. If I miss anything, ask again.

Tommy: I have always pointed out in every convo I've been in about merle APBTs that there are some w/ unverifiable pedigrees & some that are outright mixes. ALWAYS.

As for purebred merles, I personally know breeders who have them as well as know at least one breeder who had a merle pop up in a litter out of 2 non-merle parents.

Merles became popular "all of a sudden" b/c $$$ minded breeders decided to cash in on the color. Just like blues. Anyone remember when blues were little seen? I do. Then $$$ minded breeders got a hold of them & "all of a sudden" they were everywhere.

Merle was little seen in the breed b/c according to the dogmen I talked to many culled merles b/c of the defects homozygous merles produce. It was almost culled out of the gene pool completely, but a few merles survived however & are the ancestors of some of the merle APBTs (purebreds) we see today.

And yes, merles became a DQ in the ADBA b/c of one breeder. I have covered this many times before, but it looks like I will have to go over this yet again. A breeder named Howard Madison of Platinum Kennels began breeding merle x merle as "experiments." He used some of these "experiments" in his program, but the others he sold to unsuspecting & uneducated buyers. As most everyone knows merle x merle produces a litter of at least 25% defective animals. It wasn't long before the pups he sold began having problems. The buyers went back to HM & he refused to help, even telling one to never call him again & hanging up on them. Many of these ppl came to me. The one HM hung up on said told me they were going to the ADBA & all of a sudden 2 weeks later merle is a DQ! Coincidence? I doubt it.

Many ppl were going to the ADBA & there were murmurings of a lawsuit if the ADBA didn't do something. I think the last fancier I talked to was just the straw that broke the camel's back. The ADBA launched an investigation on HM's merles (but no one else's!) & found that his foundation merle Venom had a hung ped. They then banned all merles.

This was the easiest & most expedient way for the ADBA to calm the waters was to get HM's defective animals out of the gene pool. Just banning HM's dogs wouldn't work however, b/c all ppl would do is hang papers from other merle lines on HM bred merles & the defective animals would continue to be a problem. Plus, most merles were off HM's yard (he sold over 200 dogs bred off his Venom stuff), so they just banned all merles. Unfair, but simple & easy.

You ask why they haven't done it w/ blues, whites, etc. Good question. If health is their true agenda why haven't they banned blues, whites, big dogs, etc.?! If they were truly concerned about health they'sd have banned those dogs too, right? I'll tell you why they haven't banned blues, whites, etc. B/c health wasn't the issue! If it was, blues, whites, etc. would be long gone too! They're just using health as an excuse. They don't care about health. They care about their bottom line.

Rocksteady: AADR holds shows & accepts merles. In fact, my own merles are dualed AADR/BFKC.

Jeepdog: Nice looking merle! A lot of ppl don't understand that it is only homozygous merles & their offspring that are defective. The UKC & ADBA are howling about merles being unhealthy as a whole to deflect attention. As a result they're scaring ppl half to death & spreading a lot of skewed information. But the truth is that heterozygous merles are as healthy as any other color.

Texas Pit Dogs: Curs w/ a defect? What about the 4xw who was merle? Or the ones that never missed a scratch? As for defects, how about the dogs that have passed every health exam they've ever had?

As I noted before, the ADBA banned merles to save their own butts. UKC banned them b/c of something to do w/ a dog named "Resident Evil." I think they alleged she had a hung ped. And as for AAPBA, we all know Booker is a moron.

puregame: Here is an AB:




Looks like a pit bull, no? So is every pit bull who looks like this an AB mix? Of course not! Is a black pit bull a mix b/c Labs are black? Or is a brindle pit bull a mix b/c Mastiffs are brindle? Of course not! In fact, it sounds rather absurd doesn't it? Yet this is what is being done to merles!

As for what the ADBA has to say, that is some cock-&-bull they copied from the UKC to deflect attention. When they 1st banned merles they said it was b/c of Venom's ped & didn't mention anything about health whatsoever. If merles were banned for health reasons, why wasn't it mentioned? If health is their true agenda, why aren't blues, whites, blacks & big dogs being banned? I'll tell you why - b/c they're just using health as an excuse, b/c if the real reason they banned merles came out they'rd be a ton of mess coming down on them w/ their name written all over it. It's just easier for them to claim health issues & call it a day.

Stillwater: A lot of folks think they are CLD mixes. And some may be. I always thought Great Dane myself as the merle line that has a hung ped (Venom line) had some big females (80lbs!) & some real flewy looking males.

But there are also merle APBTs that are purebred as well. Wreaking Yard Knls, a man who has 20 years in the dogs had a purebred blue merle APBT pop up in a breeding between 2 of his Nigerino dogs in 1999. I believe the ADBA conf. CH. Steel's Polka Dot was in a litter bred by the great dogman Glenn Wise.

Well, I think I got everything. Now, I know most of y'all don't like merles & yes, some are mixes. But not all of them are. I can't vouch for everyone's dogs but I can vouch for mine, as well as ppl like WYK & Glenn Wise. So please don't lump us all together.

 

I agree.

My understanding of this, it was a rare gene found in APBT and to make it no longer rare they crossbred.