Fight Prevention

I liked the post...and was satisfied up until this:

"Do not bring an adult Pit Bull to an off-leash dog park or any other area where it may come into contact with other dogs running loose."

SERIOUSLY? I like to think that as a pit bull owner it is my DUTY to show the world that i have a DAMN GOOD DOG. when i say come he comes. when a dog growls at him, he walks away with his head high. he is NOT aggressive, he is smart, he is sweet, and he is the best fucking dog I could have hoped for.

I've been taking him to the dog park since he was 8 weeks old, a full year later and it's his favorite place to be. The socialization is exactly what made him the dog he is. That park has made my dog capable of being around other dogs. Literally.

Not to mention teaching FEAR is what got our amazing dogs where they are in this world. The rest of the article is about precaution, careful observation, respect for lineage, respect for power and the potential, and OF COURSE in order to be a responsible dog owner you have to worry about ALL that stuff. And of course, that's especially in the case of strong breeds.

BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN YOU SHOULD MAKE THEM LIVE SOLITARY, OR IN ANY WAY LIMITED LIVES!

It's all about observation. Does your dog EVER exhibit aggression, and if so when, and with what, and with who? Figure these things out and focus on them and FIX them. If they aren't fixable, then prevent them. It's your responsibility. But give your dog a chance, let them be happy, and let them live their lives, and (of course, as long as they're safe/in control) don't ever let paranoia and fucking stereotypes take away from their enrichment. Please.

[/biased response]

 

Kaya, its not a matter of "if" your dog shows aggression. Its a matter of "when". Dog parks are NOT for the APBT. Thats not opinion. Its a fact. Its just a matter of time. You have to understand that as much as we would love for our dogs to be able to play with other dogs, its not in there chemical make up. Remember where these dogs came from and what they were bred to do. YIS, DJ.

 

Never trust a pit bull NOT to fight! How many times do I have to say this in my lifetime?

Even if he is fine now, doesn't mean he will always be okay with other dogs. He hasn't even reached full maturity yet, and there will be a day when he does become DA (assuming he will) and shows the whole dog park what a pit bull combined with irresponsible owner is capable of. He may not start the fight, but he damn sure ain't gonna back down. That is the reason we are against dog parks.

There are plenty of other ways for us to show the world how good these dogs really are. Dog parks are not one of them.

I do not teach FEAR into people by not going to play with other dogs. Rather, I educate those who DO take their dogs there to prevent another news headline. These dogs are KNOWN to be DA, they were BRED to be DA...why try to fight that now? After you already got one?

The park did not make your dog that way, he is still young. I just got another dog (9 1/2 months old) and he is still fine with my other pup. One day, I know he won't be.
Nurturing and socialization cannot, and will not override nature and genetics.

My dogs are happy not going to the park. They go on hikes, they go swimming, they drag weight, they run, they eat and sleep. What more do they need? They do not live in solitary and their lives are FAR from limited. I am almost positive they are happier with their routine now, than the dog park.

Not to mention it is also filthy, disease brewing, and parasite infested.

 

You know...I've spent all day reading articles on pit's, and I'm realizing how common an opinion this is, and I can respect it...I guess.

Why don't you take a stroll through your local dog park. See how many pits are there, playing alone, playing together, HAPPY. Now look around, see how many people are having conversations. A responsible owner watches their dog while they talk, and a reasonable dog owner will understand if the conversation ever needs to be put on hold for a minute. Througought the numerous talks I've had with dog owners of all breeds, including many many many many MANY PITS (and mastiffs, dogo's, dobermans, rottweilers, you name it) I've heard once of a dog fight. And it wasn't a pit. They were two small dogs. So if it's as DEFINITE as you say it is for all our pits to become the vicious dogs the newspapers display them to be, wouldn't I have heard of a fight or two by now?

Now, I've heard many things about dogs and their inclination to alter dispositions later in life, and I've accepted it as a possibility. And I never for a moment doubt the strength and power my dog possesses. But my heart and my mind tell me that as long as I always take the time to observe my dog, and that every MOMENT in public is SEEN by me, that Louie, our dog park, and I are going to be okay.

I KNOW my dog is not possessive, over food, or toys. Every dog fight has a trigger, doesn't it? As long as I know these triggers and prepare for them, I have faith Louie won't start a vicious dog fight at the park.

HOWEVER I also know it's possible he won't always be this mild mannered. I know there may come a day where he starts to develop aggression. I also know that there will be SIGNS, and that's why I'm so careful to WATCH him. So that I KNOW him.

I'm blessed as can be to have gotten so lucky with Lou. Unfortunately, you all apparently don't have the same luck. My only fear is that if you DO, and you have a dog as sweet as mine, that you'll take the time to know your dog well enough to have confidence in letting him or her enjoy their life to the very fullest.

 

It's your duty to keep your pet safe. Taking your young dog to a dog park is not safe. Dog parks are not a controlled enviorment.

The desiese factor should steer any responsible owner away from dog parks. Wether you are aware or not you are putting you and your pets at risk for zoonoses type parasites and desieses by directly and indirect exposure.

 

Sorry, but I disagree for the same reasons (in the far-far future) my teenagers will go to rock shows, and occasionally ride in cars with boys. I know that once in a while my daughter will go out without a raincoat, and she might catch a cold. My son might get so drunk that he blacks out. They'll probably do all the things my parents told me not to do, told you not to do, and that our grandparent told OUR parents not to do! It's living in fucking fear, and...I just disagree. I'll be sure to be back in two years when Lou's 3 and still the best dog ever. And that's not gonna be luck. That's gonna be ME.

 

...and not to get mean, but I don't take advice from people who misspell the two subject words in a paragraph.

 

I have been to my local dog parks. Yes, they are polluted with pit bulls. Everyone in Gainesville thinks they have to have one.
I have also witnessed several fights there.
I went with a friend and her JRT. A small female pit bull comes in and is running around. Friends JRT (who is a b*tch) starts fight with pit. No trigger at all, just pit bull walks by, JRT doesn't like and growls and attacks the pit bulls face. Hmm...what do you think happened next?
After everyone frantically tries to separate the two, and the screaming subsided we were left with a torn up JRT, two owners bitten by the JRT, and the pit bull being hauled off by it's scruff with the owner. Then the talk begins...I always knew those dogs were viscious. That dog shouldn't have picked on this poor sweet little girl. They shouldn't allow those dogs here. Blah blah blah. Meanwhile all the other pit bull owners are being looked at in disgust.

The dog wouldn't have been that torn up if A. pit bulls didn't go to dog parks. B. if the idiot bringing his dog to the dog park had a break stick, which just IMO, anyone who goes to the dog park with their APBT--they don't have a break stick.

One more story and I'm done (since I have quite a few). Another friend of mine, has a bullmastiff/something else mix. Went to the DP for the first time, small dog bites his face several times, he decides to bite back. She was sued. She paid 3/4 of the vet bills.

I have a young dog, who still gets along fine with all dogs. You want to know why I don't take him there still? Because he might decide one day not to. And I plan to keep this breed 'til the day I die. I hope you change your mind before it's too late.

 

Best you can do is hope your dog shows you signs. An APBT doesn't hackle or growl tipicly . Yes they will wag thier tales in holds. Fact is you will have the happiest pooch in the park if the moment suits him lol.

Get a parting stick and learn how to use it!

 

Take it or leave it, doesn't realy matter.

 

Your dog is a yearling (ie: a puppy)..As he matures he will more than likely become aggressive towards strange dogs(animals)..Maybe he will be what we call "stone cold" and never show any inclination to fight,but chances of that are slim..Hopefully for you those chances arent "that" slim..

If/when that(aggressivness towards other animals) comes into play are you going to be ready to handle that situation (ie: do you carry a breaking stick?.) or is the situation going to turn really ugly?.
Uneducated owners that are trying to promote a positive image by letting their "pit bulls" "play" with other dogs are like a bomb with the fuse lit waiting to explode..

Read as much literature as you can regarding this breed BEFORE you go out and get one or two..This is probably the best advice I would give to someone new to the dogs..

 

I can't say I agree with this at all.. If you are in your backyard watching and waiting for the dogs to turn or quit, the cops could pull up and you my friend are now a major dog fighting ring busted.. They always say that even when it isn't a big deal but I promise they will make it a big deal and that is the sort of thing we are trying to stay away from right now.
Also if your dogs get on a cur although it may be a piece of shit to you if it belongs to someone else you are going to catch some trouble so my advise it to read about how to break up curs and work on every prevenative so that hopefully you will never have to do it .. IMO

 

You know, I hear you, I do. But the onset of OTHER breeds' aggression isn't going to phase me about my dog. He will always be exposed to small annoying nippy dogs...so that his whole life he'll know the story, and I'll know how he'll handle it. I will say this, every time I bring him to the park, he will be growled at by a dog. It's usually only one, maybe two. This is the very moment, where I am paying attention and I'm calling him away. I've seen this happen so many times, and eventually I started to have faith that Louie would walk away. And he does, every time.

now say I were to stop bringing him to constant socialization...and i'm walking him down the street one day, or exercising him in a park i think to have to myself, or taking him to the vet, or a dog barks from a distance and the door's open...believe me, i can think of thousands of potential triggers for dog fights. when i socialize louie, i'm making certain that these aren't NEW things that he hasn't yet been exposed to, that these aren't scary things that would flip him out like the vacuum cleaner used to. louie is an experienced life liver. that's how i protect my pit bull.

 

I do carry a break stick, and I've raised mine with my boyfriend, who's never not had pits. My mom's a vet, and I've never not had dogs. And education is my middle name.

And I totally agree with dogs being bombs with lit fuses, especially the strong breeds, WHEN in the hands of an uneducated OR irresponsible owner.
That is why I do absolutely everything I can to be educated about dogs and dog psychology, and to be responsible with my dogs. Everything I've said is ONLY valid if these are the owners I'm talking to. I acknowledge that.

 

From the sounds of that your last name sounds like it should be CLUELESS.

I was going to try and be nice but after reading all of your posts there is an awful lot for you to learn about this breed.

Now why on gods green earth would you need one of those with your super friendly dog park dwelling dog ? If you truely understood why you need one in the first place then this conversation would not need to be taking place however here we are talking about it.

Lets think about that for a minute shall we, there are many of breeders and throughout the years these men who made these dogs what they are always had them seperated from one another.....why do you think that would be ? I'd imagine it would involve the use of that breakstick you say that you carry. Whats your thought on that ?

kaya shae , it sounds like you are here to teach instead of learning which is clearly evident you are in serious need of. These dogs are k-9 gladiators that have been bred for over a 100 years for dog on dog combat, no socialization is going to change that any time soon no matter how bad you want to its just not going to happen.

Sure these dogs can co-exist but should never be done unless under proper supervision. The dog park is by far the perfect place for such an experiment to ever take place. The quicker you learn that the better off you and your dog will be. There is a reason why the folks here are against it, between all of our members and the many years of experience is at hand here should be speaking volume....please do not let it fall on your deaf ears.

 

if little yippy dogs(that do not come down from fighting stock) can manage to get into a fight at the dog park, you can bet your bottom dollar that a breed of dog that WAS bred for fighting is fully capable of getting into a fight...no matter HOW much you socialize them. remember-as much as you try to humanize them, these are animals with baser instincts. and all the training, doggy day care, dog whispering, and what ever other mumbo jumbo is the flavor of the month is NOT going to change that.
be smart
be prepared
keep your dog out of those situations
there are ways to let your dog enjoy life other than going to a dog park.
the rest of us thank you, because this not only affects YOU and your dog, it affects ALL OF US and OUR dogs

 

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=758 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=h5_orange colSpan=3>pbrc.net

Pit Bulls & Dog Parks
</TD><TD></TD><TD class=h2_blue background=images2/bar3.jpg>Respect</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top colSpan=3 rowSpan=2><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" align=left border=0><TBODY><TR><TD>Some people bring their pit bulls to off-leash dog parks because they want to show the world how wonderful their dog is and dispel the rumors and negative media hype. They trust their dogs because they haven't (yet) shown an ounce of aggression towards anything. This is irresponsible and here's why...
It is a fact that our APBTs, ASTs and pit mixes come with a built-in fighting heritage. It doesn’t matter where we get them from, whether it be the pound, a stray we pick up, or a puppy we buy from a breeder. The majority of pit bulls will, at some point in their lives, exhibit some degree of dog-on-dog aggression. This type of animal aggression is completely separate from human-aggression; a well-socialized pit bull is very good-natured with people. Yet, chances are that a "normal" pit bull will not share his affection with other animals. We cannot predict when or where it will happen and we can’t love, train or socialize it out of the dog. Pit bulls may not start a fight, but they will finish it.
It is common to see one dog running out ahead of a pack. This game of chase can easily escalate. Sometimes small scuffles erupt over a toy or tug-o-war, or several dogs gang up one dog, or a wrestling match gets out of hand. This kind of action will be hard for a pit bull to ignore and walk away from.
If your pit bull is involved in a fight at a dog park, it gives purpose to breed-specific legislation and affects the rights of others to own these amazing dogs. Don't set your dog up to fail.
Responsible pit bull owners:

• Research and understand the breed
• Don’t put other people’s pets at risk
• Keep their dog leashed at all times in public places
• Clean up after their dogs (yes, that means pick up the dog's poop!)
• Vaccinate and license their dogs
• Spay and neuter their dogs
• Train their dogs

Other activities you can enjoy with your pit bull:

• Play fetch in an enclosed tennis court or baseball field
• Ride a bike and have your pit bull jog along
• Walk, jog or hike with your pit bull. Don't forget her bandana!
• Take an obedience class together

Respect your dog and the dogs of others...don’t learn the hard way
what your pit bull is capable of.
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

 

She seems to have a masters degree in fool you. She's owned 2 APBT's in her time and the oldest isnt even an adult yet. The lack of respect in her tone in obvious as well. I'm done trying to teach people who could care less about learning and are more concerned in blowing sunshine about how they already know everything. Lesson over.

 

I just realized you are the person with the pup to pup issue on the other thread. In this one, your words sound like you believe to be an expert on the breed. If not that, you sound like you have "succeeded" in something. Lady, your male is merely a year old. I HOPE with all my strength that your dog ends up being a "cold".

I will try my best to educate you on what is AND has been the consensus in how to handle this breed in its "true-to-standard" form:

I agree with you 100%! It is everyone's duty to show the world that you have a DAMN GOOD DOG. When i tell my dog come, he comes. When i tell my dog, "move back" he moves back. When I tell my dog wait, he waits. The people that see me practicing my training smile and continue walking. Occasionally, I even get the "wow, his a good boy" remark. All my dogs are sweet and I feel lucky to own them. This does not blind me into thinking that my dogs will treat every living being like they do me and other fellow humans.

First, it was not the smartest thing to take an 8-week pup into a dog park. You are assuming all other dog owners are as responsible as you in giving vaccines. At that age, any little thing can make him very sick. You were lucky not smart in this regard. In addition, you talk in "has made him" when the dog is still a pup. His mind has not been made yet. Today he walks away with his head high, tomorrow, he will show the growling dog who is alpha. His testosterone has not reached the maturity level. You used your family as an example so i will do the same. Your son did not like girls until his hormone levels began to increase. Your son began maturity process. Your dog will go through the same thing. Genetics will determine IF and how much animal aggressive your dog becomes.

Your pup will act like a pup while he is a pup. When he becomes a [mature] dog he will stop doing things as a pup and act like an adult. Do not raise your hands in victory when you have not yet started the "fight". Again, i honestly hope your dog is scatterbred off random "pit bulls" bred for no intended purposes. I have seen them and they are but a shell of the true APBT although just as aesthetically beautiful.

Fear of the unknown or uneducated/misinformed fear is what has our breed in our current predicament. Educating the public means giving honest information on the breed TRUE-TO-STANDARD....not YOUR particular situation and making it sound like the norm.

Of course not! These dogs need our company and attention. They seek us humans and all that we can give them. As long as they have your time, love, and attention.....they are living fulfilling lives. Animals unlike humans are simple beings.

Yes, observation serves us well. That said, this breed may or may not exhibit aggression. For example, one of my dogs will not make a peep....just stand there looking at the other dog and wagging the end of his tail slowly. I assure you he will bite despite not giving signs of aggression. Another of my dogs is the total opposite. He will go nuts at the site of another dog. I like this better because strange dogs are made aware of his true intentions. Unfortunately, you cannot "FIX" genetic drive. In fact, forcing them to suppress their bred-for purpose might be deemed "animal cruelty" by many people.

We do not take dogs to dog parks because the small amount of "socialization" does not outweigh the plausible potential for catastrophe. Do you not think that your ONE YEAR of teaching people how "good boy" your dog is will go down the drain with one accidental fight at the park? Especially when you have "educated" people that dogs are only aggressive "if you train them to be"? It is more likely that you will cement in these peoples mind that these dogs "turn" on you "for no apparent reason".

Again, i hope that yours end up being cold. Otherwise, you will be the example your neighbors and other dog park attendees will reference when mentioning "vicious" pit bulls.

 

A lot of dogs will be ok while they are young. BUT the age that Ive seen alot of dogs Come into Is around 16 to 18 months some younger some later some never do and are cold as ice. My point is Most well bred apbt WILL turn the heat up and when they do its all they way up. SO one day she will learn that "bad boy" "stop eating that poodle" just aint going to work any more. Then it can be another headline for us to say we told ya so. J