Feeding during a keep?

there is a difference between reading some book and reading scientific journals. these journals are comprised from years of research and tons of money finding out what works and what does not. and i know dogs are different but not in such a way that most of what human athletes use can be transfered into dogs. prety much the main difference is that dogs utilize carbs differently. and besidesd reading it. i was taught by someone who if you new lemm than you knew him, and when men like stinson and glover taught lemm and vice versa those are what i call oldtimers, and i i have been told exactly what to feed and why and how much by an oldtimer, but i am also smart enough to know that different dogs will do better with different supplements and not all feeds will require the same amount. believe me when i feed i know exactly how much i am giving because there is no guess work everything is calculated roght down to the amount of protein it takes to grow muscle in any size dog. which is roughly two to three grams of protein per pound.in order to learn you need to gather information, then turn around and put the information you have gathered to the test.

 

I am glad to see this thread get bumping. I knew it had potential.

 

it is a very extensive topic, but also like you said keep it simple, a premium kibble and a multivitamin go a long way, if you can work a dog right

 

PLEASE NEED HELP ON THIS
IN terms of working a dog = is 35 min a day on mill or waking or flirt pole or swimming, good enough for stamina. And what about strength what do i need to do and for how long. how long should i work the dog for in a day what should be the total daily workout. THANK YOU guy for your advice

 

35 minutes is not enough for a total workout, but it also depends what you are doing. there is a difference between a dog looking conditioned and actially being in shape. if you are doing this for general health thirty minutes of mill of flirt pole is great and you will have a happy healthy dog. but to truly condition a dog. you should start slow around fifteen minutes, but break it up into five minutes on the mill walk untill cool then asnother five and walk untill cool and then repeat. you need to build them up eventually you want to rech thirty minute sessions. i strongly reccomend you find the dogman 2000 thread and purchase the dvd it will show you exactly what to do step by step by someone who is one of the best conditioners ever. i know a little, but am far from great or good. so read all the keeps youi can find and go from there. you will find that most keeps are very simalar. they incorporate running and walking what varies is the amount of running and walking also some keeps add in strength work and hide work. but not every dog will work the same thing.

 

35 a day everyday is to much if thats what ur doing.Boze pretty much gave u the run down . what ever u figure out just make sure u remember that rest is just as important as the work out. Dogs r not robots!

 

now with all that being said. reading all the keeps in the world will only take you so far. trial and error is a huge part of learning, but gathering all the info you can first can greatly decrease you errors. the best thing to do is run a full practice keep on the dog and find out what works and what does not with that particular. i will also say this the hardest thing about conditioning is staying dedicated throughout the whole process. no cutting corners, and no skippind days because you are tired or angry. there reaally is no secret besides having a plan and sticking to it. this nine times out of ten will bring one in right. and if you have a dog that loves work lots is much easier. i have a dog that refuses to run the mill, flirtpole, swim, the only thing he will do is ride next to a bike. and weather can be a huge factor, no to mention riding a bike fr close to two hours broken up into sessions is partucularly rough on me, especially in real hot or cold weather

 

Having read this thread I think there is quite a lot of correct stuff written. There are a lot of statements that I agree with and some that I don`t.

I agree that almost everything from a human athlete transfers to a dog with the exception of recruitment patterns and corrective exercise because a dog walks and runs on four legs instead of two, and carbohydrate metabolism. I train professional athletes and sell supplements for a living. You can give a dog a good kibble and have a basic conditioning program/programme and the dog can be exceptional but obviously having an advanced fitness protocol with performance and health supplements will take things that much further however as much as people like to think it unless you make money from your dog then 99.9 of people that even attempt to condition their dog don`t need to be anywhere near that level.

As far as strength training goes, strength is the mother skill and makes everything else easier the stronger the dog is the lower percentage of it`s maximum it is working at. If you think making a dog stronger will make the dog bulkier and make it`s muscles bigger than their optimal size then this is incorrect. Working with resistance to increase strength and power is totally different to working to change body composition ie. adding muscle or losing fat. As far as the length of the workout goes, no matter what dog it is, as long as it`s clean (steroid free) then testosterone levels with level off after 30-45 mins so a training session should not be longer than 60 mins (not including warm up or cool down). Short high intensity sessions can be very beneficial and can be done several times as day as long as good post workout nutrition is used.

Much of the conditioning stuff I have read on some threads that do hours and hours of endurance work would be perfect for a Husky about to enter a cross antartic race but if your goal is to have a strong, fast powerful dog then they are only making the dog slow and weak. Yes the dog needs endurance but it`s anaerobic endurance not aerobic, the dog needs to be powerfull time and time again. Training for anaerobic endurance or doing energy systems training in the form of resistance work or intervals will enable the dog to also improve it`s aerobic fitness because it will recover aerobically during the rest periods.

 

very well put. These r my beliefs also when it comes to training, i dont have the patients to put it all together in words. Most people dont understand how a dogs body functions. i believe that one needs to learn how to condition himself to really understand.

 

Ok, this will be a good debate and I mean no disrespect but conditioning humans for battle is nothing similiar to conditioning dogs for hunting. Nothing similiar. That is what I thought a long time ago and boy did I learn the hard way!

 

Peak performance 2

 

Well said.

 

Yeah absolutely. Remember though that while bull breeds can be good for hunting it is not why they exist just as you could train a fox hound to be strong, fast and dog aggresive but it would lose a percentage of the exceptional qualities that make it good at it`s original function and it could never be an equal to a pit or any other fighting breed at it`s new function.
I`m doing an interview at the moment for conditioning human fighters i`ll put up a link when it`s done if you are interested.

 

Alot of people like to compare human conditioning to dog conditioning. It's like comparing ping pong to tennis. Both have a ball and a net and rules are similiar but being a good ping pong player doesn't make you a good tennis player. Humans on a good diet eat every 3-4 hours and dogs eat once or twice a day depending on the conditioner. Humans have a lot more choices as far as what you can to do work out, spar, hit the bags, run, ect. Dogs have a limited choice of condtioning forms do to them being dogs. Dogs and humans are very different. Being good at one doesn't make someone good at the other.

 

Very true but being good at none makes you exactly that
I'm still working out what doesn't transfer from a human to a dog and apart from what I mentioned can't find anything. I have found someone to teach me about faulty recruitment patterns and corrective exercise in dogs as even tho I can correct these humans don't have the knowledge to correct them in dogs. Fibre types, somatotypes, energy systems are the same. If you can inform me of more differences between human and dog conditioning then please tell as the goal is always to know more. And as far as forms of conditioning for a dog you would be very surprised what human exercises can be transferred.

 

The thing is just cause a dog looks in shape doesn't mean he is in combat shape. You can see pictures on here from dog shows and they can look super fit but then they go into battle and are gassed in :30. People say keep it simple but keeping it simple doesn't equate to optimal performance. I have a few friends who are super good conditioners. I would consider them to be arguable some of the best conditioners. one feeds semi cooked meat while the other doesn't feed any meat. the one who uses meat doesn't use as many supplements and the one who doesn't feed meat uses a lot of suplements.

 

humans are exercizing for anything but a hard hunt . dogs are doing it for 1 reason . the food brings them to peak . the power work you do will help you the most in a long hunt . you need air and smarts to get you though a hard time . dogs and people are different . but you can use thing humans use on dogs but you better know how and how much .i don't know anything about the technical stuff only so you got me there . i saw dogs that used rf1 . but i never even seen it . you don't need it if you feed good food and know what food they need .

 

Of course, that's the same for anything, there's been times where I've looked like a world class athlete but would have been f*cked running up a flight of stairs.

 

MMA is as close as your gonna get to training for a similiar event as a dog which is why I am using the contrasts.

 

Of course, that's the same for anything, there's been times where I've looked like a world class athlete but would have been f*cked running up a flight of stairs.