Dog fighting Ring

I know I'm new to the breed and new to be an owner of this breed. But I have to agree with Luvin' and Cesar.. everyone on here seems to be blaming the media and immediately saying its false and that its made up. Sure the broken stick wooden dagger thing is crap we all know that. And I am the biggest believer in innocent unitl proven guilty, I work around enough people who have broken the law to fully respect the innocent until proven guilty. But what if the media hit it right? What if the owner was fighting the dogs, treating them horribly, and the fact that he cut and ran on them makes it look even worse for him. But the dead dog and the pit, I mean come on.. anyone with the sense God gave a billy goat can see that it was used for fighting. But maybe I am the odd one that doesn't believe in fighting dogs on here, or one of the few that doesn't see the video and think that the condition the dogs were living in wasn't the greatest in the world. But then again I am a fan of PetBulls and leave the Pit to someone else. I hope they bust his ass so hard it bounces myself, and anyone else who would take these dogs and let them fight/kill/maim each other to make a quick buck. But thats just my two cents. We've only got 1 inmate where I work that was busted for dogfighting and he says there's just too much money in it not to do it. I've seen pictures of his yard and dogs.. and he had some beautiful dogs, its ashame really... Again just my two cents.... flame away....:eek:

 

I am actually mixed on this one. In part it seems that he was wrong. However the stick they call a dagger and its use to make dogs mad is over dramatization. When they do that it is hard to determine if the rest of the story is also over dramatized. It makes it very difficult to buy any part of what they say as fact or fiction. However there was the shoody pit. Dogs with scars isn't proff of much. I hunt with mine and some times sticks, downed fencing and injury from game happens. some of us have mills and such but don't fight our dogs just show and compete in pulling. However they also call a mill evidence of pit fighting. I see it as evidence that someone is trying to keep their dog in shape for show. Maybe he did fight the dogs sorta looks that way with the pit but that is all I could see that could have been concrete prof that at some point in time there was intent on fighting dogs. Or chickens. They just need to be educated on what is and what is not dog fighting prof verses any other conditioning program for hunting, show or compitition in pull or agility. It is just you can tell a thousand truths but if you lie once in each it is a lie altogether. A half truth is a whole lie as far as I can tell. If they are going to report it make it fact and not any fabrications. But I hear you. I don't think he was innocent either. But the story has some holes too.

 

You think "baitdog" schmate dog......suppose you do.

I didnt personaly attack you,I made a point and valid one.....I'm not new to this game. If I personaly attack you, I'll make No bones about it.

I dont support your cause, you know this....you through it out there and made refference with the post I responded to....you get No sympathy for your cause from me....I dont care what your doin, your not bridging the gap...your movement creates laws....I dont support that!

What I did was draw that paralell line between the 2

I havent deffended the owner of those animals, from what I saw those animals didnt appear to mal nurished ....yep its tripple diggits, its Hot! those dogs could have been waterd 1-2 hrs prior to the HSUS showing up...you dont know that they werent. You are commenting on what was reported ...as do many....I made it clear what my interest was on this topic. HSUS involvment

 

I like that. I always say believe only half of what you see and none of what you hear. Had the story not included the video, I wouldn't have even responded to the post or threw in my two cents at all. "Dog Fighting Ring Busted" headlines very rarely get my blood pumping because I know the ignorance of those doing the "busting." But this is blatant owner irresponsibility - take any and all "dog fighting" insinuations out of the matter, the guy has created another reason for people to make up these stories.

 

i kinda understand what ur saying LB but what you must understand is ,,,you have to look within the bigger picture of this,,,one of these days these dogs will be illegal to own and with all the bsl going on,,, it not only the hsus,,,ppl make less take home money now days than they did back in the fifty's,,, so what's the workin man to do,,,who's the real villian,,,a buggy of grocery's used to be 50 or 60 dollars but now easily 110 to 120 dollars,,, if you met this man and saw his dogs and knew how he felt about them,,your feeling would diffenantly be different,,, at least he didn't pawn his dogs off for someone else to care for,,,he might not have been politicaly correct but at least i know where he stands,, and as far as the hsus is concerned,,, do you honestly think they don't know what a break stick is,,,come on,,, they deal with pitbulls dayly,,, so who's masking the truth?

 

Where are you folks seeing deplorable conditions on them dogs? The one negative thing I seen about the video was, if anything, the dogs were too fat to be healthy in the summer heat! 10+ foot chains, sufficient dog houses, no visible debris in the chainspaces....what more can you ask for? Ghost said the man hunted hogs with these dogs, remember, just because your dog is a pet-only, doesnt give you the right to judge others who use canines in productive ways such as feral hog hunting. I am not debating the ramshackle "pit" in the backyard....who knows what it is. I'll be honest my feeling innitially was it is a pit. It could be a whelping pen, it could be anything, hell, with how it was peiced together from old scraps of wood, it could be his kids old sand box! The fact of the matter is, the dogs looked healthy, they had adequate living conditions, and the only "evidence" of dog-fighting is a couple scared up hog-hunting dogs, and a "wooden dagger" LOL, and whatever the hell that is on the back acre. If you do not catch someone in the act, or on tape rolling dogs...there is no proof any ever took place. The rest is circumstansial, and bs at that.

 

What a bunch of ignorant bastards. You can plainly tell they have no idea what or how to spot a dog fighter.
What they said about the break stick was funny!!!
Big heavy chains? I will show them big chains, look at what the bluffs have around their necks..

 

amen brutha

 

Believe me they would show cruel pics if they had the chance to do it....

 

The HSUS did not state that, it was the narrarator of the news segement. Sounds like something juicy they would throw in.

HSUS orgs. are often blinded by anger. They actually have entire work seminars to help employees deal with the stress and built-up hate they go through. They take abused, neglected animals in of EVERY breed and often assist in ending their pathetic lives because the owners don't want them anymore. They are animal lovers who's jobs are anything but pretty. They take thier jobs home with them at night and tend to abuse drugs and drink more than average ( I learned this at a seminar held by the HSUS ). This is something I find comparable to cops, they tend to become angry, unstable people because they see and deal with horrible things on a day to day basis and it haunts their personal lives. I'm not defending outrageous ARA's or wife beating cops, but if you've labelled these groups as your "enemy" even though they do indeed save thousands of lives, no matter how insane they may become. You might want to consider why they are the way they are. Most of these groups are NOT this way, but there's a reason you see a pattern.

I don't think you anti-HSUS members fall that far from the tree because it is your anger and frustration that causes you to improperly judge ARA's. They are not all bad and most of them love this breed, which is why they get a little crazy if they feel someone is abusing them. Most of these groups absolutely LOVE people who work their dogs and if one of you went in to apply for an APBT, they would love you. Irresponsible owners cause grief for both the HSUS and fanciers. To me it is clear where the problem really lies.

This guy in question will have his opportunity to defend himself, they should not have brought in camera's prior to his sentencing. That is wrong. They guy owns this breed and had a " pit-like structure " in his back yard while he was away. Whether he was fighting dogs or not, why the hell would he leave that there unattended, knowing full well that if people like the HSUS, the media or neighbors found it, he would be in trouble? I don't care what it was used for, that's just stupid and that combined with the dead dog and all the other hype, made this story news worthy.

 

I dont hate all HSUS members, far from it. I feel alot of them really are in it for the good of the animals, and are being exploited by the higher authorities who are leading people to believe they are in it for the animals-when they clearly are not. I can appreciate anyone who truely loves the animals the way I do, and will dedicate their job to picking up after other peoples mistakes. The part I do not like is that they care more about politics than animals once they reach a certain level, and that so many people are profiting under the radar while leading you to believe they are tire-less animal saviors....I think alot of people that join up have good intentions at first, and are corrupted by the organization the longer they are involved. This goes for HSUS, PETA, ALF, ELF, and all the other animal, and wildlife extremists.


"This country is ran by extremists because normal people-have shit to do." -Jon Stewart.

 

Quick question, Ghost:
I received a press release stating he also had a horse and a donkey confiscated on his property, but they were never shown. Do you know how they were kept? While dog people often have debateable views as to how dogs "should" be cared for, there is absolutely no dispute with a horse. The horse should have adequate weight, hooves somewhat trimmed (a lengthy or even cracked hoof isn't too big a deal if the horse's walking isn't compromised), and access to water. That's about it. Room to walk? At least the size of a stall. 10' x 10' should do. Shelter? A tree would suffice just fine, or even afternoon shade from the side of a building.
My point is, if they removed a fat and happy horse stating it was being cruelly kept, it says something a little different about this guy. If they removed an underweight, crippled nag and a dilapitated donkey from his property- then it shows a clearer picture as well.
Slightly OT- but I was just curious because I feel the question relates to this guy's profile as an animal owner.

 

Excellent!!!

 

The HSUS needs to be held accountable for false accusations ......concerning an ongoing investigation. They are not above the law.

I could give 2 shits, about ones anger or emotional problems or substandce problem ....esp when you throw work in as an Excuse. IMO they need to be excused from thier duties to find a more suitable palletable position in this world.....

I disagree the HSUS is not in favor of the APBT ....Not localy or on a federal leval. The HSUS wants your money and your dog if they can get em...Not to mention that if your animal does end up in the care of HSUS it is likely to be miss handled, fought, starved and yes be exposed to desieses ....the condtions of most facilities are deplorable .....it's not due to lack of funds. But the worst thing that can happen to your animal in the care of the HSUS is....they can dissapeer, they are not held accountable or liable and you are left to wonder the fate of your animal.

I do not support any fraction or group that has the intent of creating more laws pertaining to AR. Animals have no rights! Rights does not = welfare. We as a society need to take back our rights and have the right to handle those who tresspass against us.

 

Want to help animals? We have plenty of suggestions. For starters, you can join The Humane Society of the United States and be a part of our work to help companion animals and wildlife, as well as animals on farms and in research. You will be funding our educational, legislative, investigative, and outreach projects in the U.S. and across the globe.

Or perhaps you'd like to make a memorial donation in honor of a pet, friend, or relative? You can through our Kindred Spirits program. And if you'd like to contribute in a more structured way, our Planned Giving Office has suggestions about estate planning, annuities, and even gifts of stock that avoid capital gains taxes.

Maybe you have land that you would like to preserve as a lasting habitat for wildlife. Our Wildlife Land Trust can help you. Perhaps the land you want to share is a backyard—that's enough. Our Urban Wildlife Sanctuary Program will show you how to create a habitat for your wild neighbors.

If you want to be more active, try speaking out for animals. Our web site will always have action alerts about national, state, or county matters that affect animals.

So you see, it's easy to help animals. And The HSUS is here to help.

 

Simms- I gotta hand this one to you! I've read that page before and thought- huh? My sister in law joined last year and she was absolutely outraged when they sent her a coffee mug, key ring, and paperweight. She said to me "Is this what our money goes to?!"
Just for the record, I do not belong to HSUS, but I do help our local HS place dogs in fosters.
Our local HS is a completely non-traditional. There is no facility because they sink most of their available funding into a local low cost spay/neuter program. They do not want a dog housing facility/shelter because they would have to waste that money on overhead. Instead, local members and volunteers foster the dogs in the program. They only have one paid employee -The Head Director- and she was hired only last year. I have their spending sheet for last year, and no one is getting any kick backs at our level for sure. The entire board is made up of volunteers. Our local HS's main cause is to spay and neuter dogs, and go on outreach- that is where I come in as a DDB rep, and where the rest of the available funding goes. We buy dog houses, flea preventative, food, runners, 30' tie outs and as a DDB rep I help people build fences for their yards. I NEVER had a gestapo "no chains under any circumstances" POV, but it is nice to get a dog off a 3' chain onto a 30' one or runner, or physically build a fence for people who cannot afford one. One guy offered to buy a dog house from us, and we refused his money- we told him we'd give it to him if he took advantage of our low cost spay/neuter program. We gave him the dog house, and his pit mix got neutered for 25 bucks. Win/win.

Simms- I do get you. But I sincerely hope you don't think we are all bad. The corruption in the higher ranks? Yes it stinks. They are getting kick backs while we work our asses off. But great things are being done -at least where I live- for the right reasons. As you and I have very different POV's, I also have very different views from many of the people in rescue.
AR? I don't consider myself fitting that profile, but I do work hard for the welfare of animals. You are very right- Rights and welfare are not the same.

 

No I dont think that all rescue is bad....I "rescue" occasionaly. However I am a firm beleiver in bridging the gap. Glad to hear that your group is doing actual outreach work....that's where the small differences are made

Some ppl have to be shown the eras of thier ways, but the Idea behind that should be to keep the pet in the home.

 

You big softy!
I'd buy you a beer, but it would get a tad hot on its way to Texas, so I'll just say something really nice about you on your reps.

 

Wherever there's a butt load of money there's a butt load off a$$holes. I don't have any personal experience with the HSUS other than the local branch which seems to be a great facility. There are a lot of non-profits that are currupt, I can name a few. There's a shelter in NM that I hate which somehow raised a ton of money and built a friggin church on it's property! There's a couple small kennels, a 4-H arena for horses and a friggin church! The shelter I worked for somehow spent $30,000 on a new computer program. Which all employees knew was BS because the program was only slightly different from our old one and the two ladies who bought it ( director and admin. ) were sisters. Obviously they took a cut. So, I get what you're saying.

They do save animal's lives though. Even though the shelter I worked at did this, the director was fired ( for other reasons though ) and there is a new policy. So, it did change. Even before that though, the employees on the floor, dealing with the animals and the adopters were fantastic. There was an obvious love for pitbulls, no breed discrimination on adoptions and these breeds were not adopted out to anyone. Everyone was interviewed while interacting with the dogs and many were directed at another dog.

I choose not to support PETA or that damn shelter in NM ( there are a few other reasons I don't like that place, I could go on and on ). I think people who save dogs are wonderful, I don't think animals should have equal rights or anything even close to that, but you can judge a person on how they take care of animals and I adore most rescuers... Even you Simms!