affects of neutering/spaying

all ethics and ideas aside, i want to get your opinions on what neutering/spaying does to this breed in general. In terms of aggression, size, muscle development, drive, what does neutering/spaying change? I have heard different aspects of both spectrums but not from experienced game-bred owners. for example, i have seen a whole litter grow up with 6 males and the 3 that were neutered were averagely 4 inches taller and lankier than the other 3 with lean long muscles as opposed to bulkier more powerful muscles. this of course was only one litter though. all opinions are welcome and please don't be scared to get bashed for your response. i tried to do a search for previous topics but none were this specific to my question at hand. thanks much all in advance. (please remember NOT to discuss the morality of neutering/spaying. this is a given for this discussion.)

 

http://www.caninesports.com/SpayNeuter.html

 

holy jeez. why do these people in san francisco persecute me to neuter my boy AT SUCH AN EARLY AGE so vehemently then? can they be misinformed? they can't be. they're the smartest humans in the world!!! (severe sarcasm reminder before massive backlash)

 

Ok first of all thanks for the article; it was very interesting. I have a two and a six year old males and everyone is saying to fix them because they will be less aggressive. Also people have been saying they could get cancer. But (unless I read the article wrong) this in not true. So should I not get my boys fixed? (My fiancee does not like the idea of taking his boys balls ) I am not going to breed them but I have never had a problem with them humping or anything. The females that they play with are fixed so that's not a problem. So I guess I'm wondering what you all think. Sorry for asking a question in your thread Davilau!

 

no probs. i just don't want to get into an ethics discussion other than the factual effects of spaying/neutering. i honestly think that you do what you want to do but make the choice as a result of facts like the article that findrodhere has posted. my personal opinion is that neutering doesn't stop the pit from being aggressive but stops the other males from being aggressive to him/her.

 

IMO, I know one of the other women you bought a pup from my dog's litter. She bought a female brindle. Lexas and her brindle were the same in size. Lexas isn't spayed, but the brindle was spayed by 4 months. Lexas has more muscle mass, she's shorty and more stocky and her head is fuller.

 

Now my vet said that I should definatley neuter my males, because there is a very high risk of testicle cancer. I really dont know how it would affect any other aspect. I'd have to do some research.

 

There is also risk from a million other cancers but I doubt your going to cut off all the parts that "might" get cancer. IMO that is just a weird reason. My old dog at my mom's is spayed and she still has cancer, so if they are gonna get cancer then they will get it regardless of being spayed or neutered.

 

I never thought of it as a weird reason, but I also never thought of it like you did either. I think she just meant it to rule out testicle cancer.

 

An article I read recommended waiting until a dog was 14 months of age to spay/neuter. Which makes perfect sense to me. So if an owner is responsible, and can keep their dog from accidental breedings that long, its probably beneficial to wait. Most of the males I've seen who were neutered young do seem to have a lankier, leggier build.

 

The only surefire way to tell how a spay/neuter affects dogs is to test the theory on twins. No two dogs grow identically. You cannot compare litter mates as each dog has its own individual genetics.

It is entirely possible that the spayed/neutered dog was never going to grow the same anyways.

If it's to be a family pet, get the surgery done.

Does anyone know of any litter mate twins where one was fixed and the other was not and what the differences were after they became adults?

 

They ARE all twins, trippletts and what-not. You're not likely to get any identical ones.
The whole reasoning of preventing testicular cancer is true, by it is like Highvoltage said, just as likely to get cancer anywhere else. It is a benefit to not having the organs at all, but cancer may or may not have occurred regardless. I hope I explained that right.
If I owned a male that was not for breeding and I was pretty sure (can never be 100%) that my dog would not get out and add to the overpopulation problem, I'de just get him done. It's a distraction to them IMO to want to breed. I would even do it to my working dog if he was not breed worthy, it would make him a more concentrated worker. Police dogs and assistance dogs are neutered for the same reasons.

 

I've never seen a neutered police dog. I've spoken to a SAR dog trainer and he stated that he'd never neutered a dog (i met him on a plane, he was headed to indonesia with his dog to do some rescue work). You've seen neutered police dogs?

 

I was thinking that myself. Our police dept. dogs are not neutered and I know someone who helps train police dogs and has said numerous times most trainers wont even bother with a neutered dog and that no police dept will either unless the dog really is exceptional.

 

Well if nobody will train neutered dogs for police work, then maybe there's something to be said for all males thinking with their d***s. I guess cutting their balls off is really amputating their brain. I've only had two male dogs and neither are neutered. I personally think it's not too asthetically pleasing to have their balls swinging around, but I'm getting used to it. I have had more problems with neutered males humping than with intact ones doing it. I rescued/adopted all of my females at a young age and they were all spayed, but they didn't seem to experience any of the side effects talked about in the article-however, every dog is different. I think if you're going to spay/neuter, there's no harm in waiting a little while as long as they won't be reproducing. I'd wait until your boy was full grown just to avoid any potential growth problems, even if he is to be a family pet.

LMAO, they certainly ARE the smartest people in the world in SF. I just moved from California. Aren't they trying to pass some bullshit BSL out there? Banning pit bulls or muzzling in public? I can't remember. I wish I had my old local news out here.

 

If you have a rescued pit and you are uncertain as to his background then definitely spay/neuter. I think for the sake of the breed only the best specimans should be bred, and no offense, if you don't know whats in your dogs background then you dont know what sort of genes he'll pass on.

If you have a dog with a known pedigree then by all means, breed some good, stable game dogs that reflect what the breed is supposed to be. But again, if you don't plan to breed them get your dog fixed. We dont need your dog getting loose and breeding to some lab and having some anxiety prone pit mixes that end up causing trouble and making the breed look bad.

Fact is, breeding isnt for everyone. If its not for you, get your dog fixed. It causes no health problems and it definitely can keep males from jumping the fence to go looking for a bitch to mate

I think the booming populations of pits is bad for game dogs and I think only true dogmen/dogwomen should be breeding game dogs.

 

thanks for your remarks people. it was VERY informative. San francisco has a mandatory spay/neuter law for pits, staffs, bulldogs, and english staffs but i live in san mateo county which has no bsl. i'm fixing him at 12 months. san francisco is NOT what it used to be. no handgun law, bsl, no smoking. might as well neuter or chop off all human arms so that we don't create diseases and harm others. it's the beginning of the city of "san angeles" from the movie "Demolition Man."