game dogs and conformation

Form follows function is the way to say it best, a matter of looking at the best functioning dogs and building the conf. Standard around that , not the other way around. My first books were Stratton books and he really puts it out there that the game is what made the dogs the dogs they are, so if you are acquiring an apbt for anything show , pull, hunting, the best choice is a gamebred one. If you consider your dogs anything other than game they should not be bred, and if they are shouldn't be called American (pit) bull terriers. Personally I'd buy a farrari to do everyday driving if I could afford to, bc it's still that much better at handling and exceleration etc bc it was made to higher standards.

 

There is nothing wrong with going to conformation shows.
It is the breeders mentality that wil define the animals worth.
Just like in the stafford world, many that breed only for conformation, some look like the real deal but put in the box and it wil curr out.
I always say that someone should not breed for the general public, it is alwasy nice if someone wants a dog out of yours but that should not be the reason behind your breedings.
The least thing a breeder could do is, test the dog good and breed it to the best proven dog you can find.
Cause even if you up hold the adba standard in your breedings, you wil have nothing more then mutts if you do not test them and after a couple of generations they wil be no different as an AM staff, jmo

Please let us not trash every conformation show breeder, cause some wil be better in breedings than some game people.
They know just what to do to keep that certain type/colour or behaviour in their dogs.
Wich lines throws the best, i really could not awnser that b/c i never cared for that and even i get blinded sometimes by a dogs performance that may not be the best in conformation wise

 

many bulldog breeders used to show there dogs also actually some of the best to ever do it showed there dogs and sopme of the best bulldogs like the ones people sought after were multiple time conformation winners

 

Couldnt have explane'd it ne better there Nobody!


now to leave all the bs and get back on topic, i was wondering if in the history of apbt was there ever a breeder that bred for conformation but still was verry confident about his dogs when it came to the box ?

 

don't think they did breed for both during the days WHEN the dogs work was LEGAL.
Either you like steak sauce on your steak or you don't. ;o)

 

Could you tell me untill what time that was?

 

untill what time the dogsport was legal that is.

 

I think conformation and performance go hand in hand. Now i'm not saying all the great performance dogs had great conformation but i havent seen any with terrible conformation. Fact is that these dogs were bred based on performance and they ended up looking the way they look because thats the build of a canine athlete. There is plenty variance as far as appearance but the things that are called for are that way for a reason jmo

 

That's the truth, right there.

 

Elmo I doubt if matching dogs was ever legal in the U.S. Pre 1976 it was legally classed as a misdemeanour but the law was rarely enforced.

 

That's not quite correct. Matching dogs was perfectly legal in the US. Hell, the UKC used to promote matches. What do you think the registry was all about?

Depending on where you lived it could be legal until the '76 federal law.

 

http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Public&file=printPedigree&dog_id=294938

 

@ Tamthebam & HighCoastHiker
Thanks for that info,

 

Gb dogs are bred for their abilitys not conformation duh

 

Did you seriously not read this thread at all?

If they have the function, they usually have the form.

 

cliff if you would have seen their post that another mod had to edit you'd understand how fucking retarded they are.

 

Ok my 2 cents on this matter. let me start of in saying that the ADBA standard is the one and only, no matter if your in the show ore go bisenis.. little diferends are alouwd consirning the quality of the varius famelys who are spesific in go traights.

Having said this i used to go to varius dog shows al over the world, as im a working dog lover. going to these ""confermation"" shows i quikly notished umongst other breeds that confermation on itself aint worth anything as wel.
when i was at a show in the UK called Crufts manny manny years ago, with is considerd the nr 1 show in europe, i came to talk and became frinds with a greyhound breeder. He got into a argumend with a greyhound show breeder, who was heavely upost to the working dogs of the man i was with.
He claimed that his kind was culling 1000,s of raceing dogs who couldend ore would not make it in the profesional race scene and that he could NOT call himself a fan and care taker of the breed nor love his dogs.

The man i was with said yes your right dogs are culled just like the weak in NATURE. and 90% of them are culled the right way IF we cant find homes for them. he then said there is a flip side to what you just said , and he told the other guy .

ITS people like ""you"" in the long runn are ""killling"" the breed bij breeding a hollow shell a bullit without gun powder.
The bone strukture of those dogs are un tested , when these animals DO feel like running there legs and wrisks snap of at there feet at the first turn they make on the grass ore beatch, there mussles tear of when the brain pushes the body behond its capabilety.

The dog you became to love was a product of the sporting racing man like ME in the first place .
Evolution selection hase it that the body fallowed the mind. The growing rings in the bone structure are mutch denser muscle fibers and atachments are geneticly sound lung capasety hase been raised, the recuvery rate afther bone ore muscler injury hase been raised 4 times over unselected""normal"" bred dogs.
to put it out mildly the racing aspect created the confermation!! of this dog you fell in love with in the first place. And produced a all round sounder healtyer beter breed!!.

Now if YOUR kind dont race these dogs, then i sirguest you dont BREED them, and buy ore get the dogs that dont make the grade in the racing scene.
insted of breeding your own geneticly decraded dogs and distroi the breed we have been building for 100,s of years.

This way YOU people help us, and at the same time we help you in securing this breeds future....
now who of the two of us do you think loves the breed more!!. the one who can sat aside his persenal feelings and do what HASE to be donein order to keep this breed healty, ore you THE WEAK who is mentaly not capable of doing so.
we both have the same love for this breed but it is the WEAKER man who love these dogs and at the same time is distroing it!!..
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Now i dont thingk every thing above gose for our dogs but lots of it thuse!!!!!.

Bij the way A GAME bred animal is NO garanty that he ore she actualy IS sutch. for those who actualy been there they know that only a handfull actualy make that grade
. confermation thuse go hand in hand with performance and the other way around.

I have NO problem with people who whant to buy a game bred dog and just use it as a show dog !. at least in this way some serius game bred gene pools are still having""some"" influens on the show breed!!. who ARE judged upon the ADBA confermation standarts!. and we know where that came from!!! .

You only have to look at the AM staff to see what happend!! and ore is happening. they are bred ""out"" of perporsions!! they became to big headed to big to high, to fat to wet!!.
they start to breath more heavely (like SBT do when they fart). they alredy HAVE become that Hollow shell like the SBT and the show greyhound ecetera ecetera, sure there are ëcseptions, but they are ""not"" the rule .... With consirn and anger im looking at these discusting Rapper ore Bully pits and these XXL Pitbulls who tent to be the novise man,s trent today they are just as mabye iven worce then the above mentiont..

 

Well put Limey, very well put.

 

Would you also sell one to someone who says he wants to do confirmation only @ limey ?

You can choose from lots of nice bloodlines from parents with nice confirmation who havnt been tested. Or only 1.

Dont get me wrong. If you bought one for another purpose, i dont see why you cant show them. Why not.

Maybe you guys would love to see gamebred breedings only. That way you cant go around it, but will that ever happen..lol

 

Bas WE are NOT in the dog selling bisenis(yet)never have been, we might in the future, about confermation. long time ago we did ones in a while took a dog to a confermation show. needless to say, the dogs we enterd where the best they had seen.One aczample was the Terror dog we had. he was 14 months old. a prominend(SBT) guy at the time ask us if whe woud show our dog i said hell no i know he,s the best dog here anyway and i dont have the time im selling stuf at my stand(dog food and coloors at the time). The guy said thats a bold statemend do you mind if i show him for you. i said whatever il see you with the nr1 award. he came back and said wel we where to late for his class. so i you don mind im going to put him in the 14 to 20 moths class i said ok he win there as wel.
45Min later he came back with the first price. And later in the day he whent back for overal winner of the day.
he became second over a total of 350 dogs shown. he was bij far the best dog but the organisation could not posibly make a 14 month old the winner over the grown dogs.
they gave the best overal to a guy from eastern europe(poletics) with a dog that was 4 years old
. we have never bred for confermation. because when people use proven stock that is aczackly what you are getting top notch confermation dogs!!!!!!!..