Breeding to a well bred cur?

Gringo & Sadie, good job! It is rather refreshing to see a CIVIL debate on this forum. It is obvious you both agree on the same main issue, and that is the betterment of the breed.
I agree with Gringo that you should NEVER breed to a KNOWN cur. I believe most everyone on this board would agree with that. But I also agree with Sadie, that if the dog had proven itself in the past, I would most likely give him a second look before automatically culling him. And as it has been stated in earlier posts, every one of our dogs has untouched, unproven, and maybe even known curs in there pedigree. So I think it is obvious that most of the old timers had more of the "do as I say, not as I do" philosophy than we would like to think. But I also believe that the best of them had an almost uncanny ability to just know what works.
Gringo thanks for taking the time out to elaborate on your position. For a second there I just thought you where cold blooded! LOL

 

i dnt think it should be given the chain/kennels space if it cured

 

I think alot of people who are talking here are hypocrits. I doubt that all of you hardcore cullers have or have had a dog of bullys caliber on your yard. BUT I do agree with what has been said about not breeding to a known cur..

 

I wanna kno how many folks on here have culled a dog!

If i want a history lesson, i know who im going to lol

 

Sorry I thought I made it very clear where I stood I think it's pretty self explanatory that no one knows for sure what happened with bullyson as none of us on this thread has come fourth to state they were there and saw it happen therefore I can't really form an honest opinion on bullyson as far as what type of dog he was. That doesn't change how I feel about dogs in general I believe they can all quit for one reason or another because everything in life has it's limits dogs are no different. But I can't deny those that haven't quit because the proof is in the pudding. If I had a dog that stopped for any other reason beyond it's control and you checked the dog again with the same results than the dog shouldn't be bred. This doesn't change the fact that curs and untested dogs were bred with good results that's not justifying the act of breeding curs it's simply stating it's been done. I have no other choice but to believe the men and woman who chose to breed this way maybe saw or knew something that we didn't even though it tends to go against the rule of thumb. Doesn't matter if I think it's right or wrong those guys did what they felt was right for them and who am I to say they were right or wrong? I am conflicted about Bully-son because of all the stories that were posted on this thread about him that doesn't change how I feel in general about how we should treat a dog who was proven to be game and than quit. I made it very clear that I would be looking for other reasons for why the dog quit before I assumed it was an Automatic cull. How I would choose to cull a dog that gave it's all to me and than quits later on might be different than someone else here. I think those type of dogs deserve a little more respect than a dog who never tried at all. I would have difficult time taking the journey with a dog who proved itself to me time and time again and then suddenly stopped I couldn't just off a dog like that. When I stated bullyson should live out it's life as a stud dog on another yard that's assuming his reason for quitting or getting picked up was outside his control and that he had some other issues going on. I will never know what really happened with that dog so I could never fully say one way or another but the fact that he is spoken of today speaks volumes to me there were plenty of dogs that were game and easily forgotten the ones that stand out today I have to believe there was something good about them or they played an important role in the breeds history to even be acknowledged by other dog men across the world even years later. To this day as controversial as Bullyson is he is still spoken of that says a great deal to me.

 

and eliots post agrees withy me his back end gave out so that means he physically could not go hpw many more facts do you need. so there they add up like this bullyson had an extremely low blood count he also was bit by a rattlesnake, then he got into it with a bigger dog and had his teeth stitched back into his gums so take all that and add in the fact he was matched three ot four lbs over his pit weight into his younger son who bit just as hard was just as fast and was stronger, now add in it was 105 degrees, and every acount says bully was slipping in and out of shock so how can you ignore all of these historical facts written by the ppl who saw you got to be kidding me if you ignore all these facts

 

both those posts prove my point clayton said he saw dogs worse scratch but all dogs are different and he was bad enough off he died so he was prety bad and he even says bully was not right that day so thank you for proving my point

 

gringo no one said breed a cur all anyone is saying is that not all dogs that quit are curs. there are reasons sometimes for these dogs stopping that are caused by us and all we are saying is that look at the big picture and realize that a dog like bullyson was no cur ha had the odds incredibly stacked against him and was stopped due to human error

 

if u read the post i comment on then u would know it was a scenerio i was makin a comparsion i dont have a 7xw sadieblue said if a dog quit they would try and find some medical reason why it quit then then would match that same quitter again and if it quit again they would retire the dog to they yard and i said lets just say u had a 7xw on ur yard u mean to tell me u could feed that dog that quit twice the same food or show the same respect that u would ur 7xw time winner i dont know anybody that could do that

 

can u stop puttin words in my mouth read ur post that i responed that way to

 

That's because you don't see dogs the way I do you look at them as straight machines as long as the dog performs to your liking than it gets fed if it stops or quits on any given day you would be the first to point the finger at the dog other than looking at yourself or finding another cause. I can say that even if a dog fails as a game dog that it most certainly can become a house pet and most of them do well at that it's not the dogs fault not all of them are cut out for it. I didn't say go breed the fuck out that cur dog for quitting I said let it live it's life out as pet somewhere most of them even the curs will make decent enough pets.

 

Most of the "Currs" like bullyson dont need to be culled they wont last threw the night, most within a few min it just was there turn and they dont go but you can be sure of one thing that curr is a dead dog he just aint crossed the river yet. LOL the best thing any one could done for a curr like that was send him to the happy hunting ground Once a dog currs like that he is done even if you save him some how he will never be the same hince the term RUINED . but alot of the Smarter than a 5th graders will just sit around with ther dick in ther hand asking there selfs Why you think he did that LOL Some of the dumbest things I have ever seen were done to dogs by dog men., I seen a guy take a dog out 4 weeks after his dog went over 2 hrs a hard on now the damn dog has still busted up he didnt have any more lips left and he had a damn blow hole still but this fool takes this great lil dog out again the lil dog falls out around 50 they said, Done in shock, and he had the balls to call me up and say I sold him a curr. So I aint got much for the curr talk unless I seen the whole deal. Dog men do stupid shit even the so called pros most of the time they are the worst. In my time with the dogs I stoped two 2xw from two very Big time dog men I stoped the dogs they had becouse they thought ther was no way a kid would woop ther 2xw and both of those men took me light and paid dearly for it they even said so after. so Dont think Mr Carver would not do the same thing

 

Tripple J I really like how you think about these dogs it's good to know there are dog men out there who think this way... People make it seem like it's all so cut and dry when it's not.... A lot of what you said in this post I have been told by mentors and just people I look to for help and advice dog men while we like to believe they are perfect in every way are still just human at the end of the day. They make poor choices and sometimes it can cost them a good dog.

 

im just goin to have to agree to disagree

 

I have no problem with that.. I know everyone has an opinion and I can respect that completely...

 

Bullyson was the betting favorite. I had seen Bullyson win before but really didn't like his actions so I bet a little on Benny Bob, anyway it started off even for the first few minutes, then Benny Bob took the lead, being a little stronger. Bullyson started to get winded and hot at about the 25 minute mark and started to look at the sky and leaves of a tree with his tongue nearly a half foot out, I guess he wondered what happened to the cooler weather he'd seen a few months earlier. It seemed almost instantly Bullyson quit biting and turned for a savior. Carver gave up the fight. The hot sun brought out the cur he was.

Scotty Nelson

I know my friend Boze has been waiting for this account. Sorry to it took so long my friend. Now I will let y'all go back to philosophizing and self promotion

 

And scotty is the same man when we were sitting around bullshittin when I was kid he is the one who gave me the tip that helped me win my times. and you can bet we use the sun and heat. he was the one that told me how to work my dog in the heat and try to set it up hot to help bring the curr out faster in theother one. he said the sun and heat would stop a good one faster than the other dog would lol. No one is saying bullyson didnt stop. what we are saying is its old ass news and he has still went on to make a damngood mark on the game, and dont feel UN Happy just couse your dog may have a little bullyson in him (I would want more than less) Thats what we are saying. Some are acting like if your dog has some bullyson it sucks,lol (Man I wish they would just let us have one week a year to test our dogs we could stop all this bullshit. I am from the school of they are all currs some get it bit out some get it brought out by human some it nevercomes out but belive me it is in every one of them sumbitches and it is up to you as a dog man to keep that shit down, weather you are the breeder who only breeds the best you can to hope the are too far back to pop up (lol) or the best way is care taking the better your charge is inshape health and the strength that helps keep it down , but one thing is for sure it is like a lil beast just waiting to pop out and its all up to the Man to keep it down.

 

so far you showed me one acount calling bully a cur i would say out of the five that were shown that was the only one where h was said to cur or did you not want to reply to the other posts u made that proved my point

 

It just goes to show people pick and choose what they want to believe regardless of what's been presented. If only one account out of 5 state that bullyson didn't cur I would say there is way more than enough proof to support that fact. Not to mention Ice pick posted the first match report which would most likely be the most accurate of the 5.

 

Yea he may have not stoped befor the count but he did stop or was stoped, Thats what we allways said and it was not a bad thing so and so stoped it happened it sucks, so what, it was allways a good thing to hear a man say you are going to have to STOP his dogs they are good. and as far as bullyson loosing to his son that is what SHOULD happen, When I breed dogs I allways Pray to my god To give me a dog that is just as good or BETTER than what I am breeding. its just the way it is. everyone acts like its a big deal a sickly black dog lost to his son 35 years ago. if you dont like em dont use them.