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Pat Patrick's yard raided

Discussion in 'Dog Discussion' started by shadyridgekennel, Feb 19, 2008.

  1. Suki

    Suki Guest

    by means of placing an animal in a cadaver bag, (what vets typically use)= or, by means of a trash bags, (what the average person may use), doing so helps to prevent the spread of potential infections. didn't know that was so news worthy,,,:confused:

    and as far as the dead puppies go~
    no doubt, some of them could have died from some sort of medical condition, or,
    an exposure to a disease, or even from an abnormality they were born with..... many variables are plausible and should be considered.
    a ruling should not be made nor based on assumptions, as is typical, when it comes to APBT's.
    if authorities want a definitive answer, then do a necroposy on the dog in the " black plastic nag". this way, the cause and manner of that animal's death will then be based on factual evidence, dependant uopn what is discovered in that exam, thus eliminating the "guessing".
  2. ghost 1

    ghost 1 CH Dog

    i'm sorry if i offended you,,, and by anymeans we agree to disagree,,,

    they so worried about these dogs,,,, did you see the video's of the slaughter houses,,,, and they want to talk humanely,,,,lol,,,, these dogs are nothing more but a publicity stunt for them,,,and to tact a 13000 feed bill is rediculous,,,
  3. Dixiegal

    Dixiegal Pup

    I agree about the feed bill - legalized extortion is what it is. Totally sucks.
  4. purplepig

    purplepig CH Dog

    Dixiechick, just to let you know, I have tried the kennels, and they are no good for the dogs. Most of the dogs you will hear about(apbt's anyway) are kept on chain spots. And a well bred bulldog will get more than enough exercise with that alone. On another point, I do way more than feed, water and clean my dogs. I dont have a whole lot at the moment, but I have had up to 80 at a time, and they were... my life. I didnt go to movies, I didnt take vacations. I spent my time with my dogs. It takes a great passion for something to give up everything else for it, and maybe allot of folks cant understand that.

    As far as someone else saying "stop breeding", I know those who are pumping out 1000 dogs every 6 months arent able to do what I am about to say, but well, I'll share this with you.

    A young man and his soon to be wife wanted a bulldog, as he wanted a dog in the house while he was at work. Well, her father found out they were getting one, and he threw a fit, and said,"dont ever bring that dog to my house!!", well, 1 year later I get a call from him, and he wants to come to see my yard. He comes over, and likes what he sees(he was already won over by the dog his daughter had got from me), and he ends up with a pup, who(and dixie chick you'll like this) is spoiled and lives like a queen. Of course the pup was spayed, and he had been taught proper containment and care. And is in love with the dog. Now, they live in another state than I do, how many people do you recon they will be able to convert?
    That is just one of many examples. I hear things like this all the time, but I am a person who doesnt just want money from someone, I develop relationships with people, and speak to them regularly, and do anything I can to help them be great breed advocates. Once they really get attached to the dog, I began to share with them things they can do to help the dog's name to get back to what it should be, the all american dog.

    Now, I realize allot of folks dont do this, and am not saying it is the only way, it is simply what I do. Bash me if you want to, one of the keys I see is not letting them disapear, but is to teach people to be responsible owners, and great breed advocates. At least I am adding to our numbers, instead of adding to fools.

    On a side note, I, as a breeder, have pretty strong contracts that I have signed stating that if the dog is found to be used for any illegal activity, it will be confiscated. This, from what my lawyer has told me, will aid in my defense should someone try and accuse me of breeding "fighting dogs". Of course, that is only if the constitution is upheld!!
  5. Dixiegal

    Dixiegal Pup

    I agree - the constitution is at risk from all sides these days. But kudos to you for being a breed advocate - I have a great deal of respect for that. And yes, I have heard of "bulldog fever" - I even know a few people who have it. There's no cure, they say. ;)

    On another note, you might like this - it is a video of Luke, a pitbull who was a movie star back in the 1920's. The All-American dog indeed. :)

  6. miakoda

    miakoda GRCH Dog

    OT- Dixiegal, I'm curious as to where you're located. By your screenname, I would think it's somewhere it the south. And by living in the south, most are accustomed to hunters.

    For instance, one of the vets I worked with for years (& my good friend) has approx. 55-60 hunting dogs (Running Walker Hounds) at all times. Her husband is an avid hunter and those dogs are his life. But those dogs do NOT sleep inside. They do not eat out of ceramic bowls. They do not wear expensive collars with their names embroidered on them. They do not go to doggy daycare. They do not get Kongs, & frisbeees, and other such toys to play with. Instead, they are properly fed, watered, medicated (dewormed, heartworm prevention, etc.) and have a shelter over their heads. But according to you this is animal cruelty and these folks shouldn't have so many dogs. But you are failing to grasp that not all dogs are pets. Nowhere is there a law that says a dog must be a family pet. On the contrary, these are working dogs who have a job. And to be perfectly honest, those that don't do the job properly or well get culled. And it's not cruel. It's vital to the breed and vital to the owners that those dogs perform the job they were bred to do and perform it well.

    Personally, I've seen more large groups of hunting dogs that live happier lives than some pampered pooch that is treated like a disabled human child rather than like a dog.

    As for other social animals, I wonder what you think about those who keep their horses stalled all day & all night? According to you (based on your feelings about dogs), these people are doing things the right way. Because we all know 800+ lb creatures love to be kept cooped up day & night with nice straw/shavings bedding and fancy halters than be allowed to run loose in a pasture enjoying the rain and the sunshine and the mud and the grass....... My horses are pasture horses. 2 of them have NEVER been stalled. And yet, I'm called an irresponsible horse owner and a cruel horse owner by many who choose to inflict their own misguided and personal feelings onto a horse (by saying that the horses would prefer it & blah, blah, blah).

    As for shelter work, kudos to you for volunteering. But come check out the East Baton Rouge Parish AC where there are 300 dogs and over 100 cats held at all times. Those dogs get hosed down with their kennels once a day and have food & water thrust at it once a day. That's it. It's not heaven, honey.
  7. Dixiegal

    Dixiegal Pup

    I live in New Orleans. Our shelter is pretty good, in that lots of people come to walk and socialize the animals, and they have a very high adoption rate. But we're lucky, and not all shelters are that way at all.

    I may come to a show sometime (there is supposed to be one here in March, I think?)- if I do, we can continue this dicussion, which is a long one. :)
  8. misterdogman

    misterdogman CH Dog

    Yeah your so right!!! Lets talk about PIGS for a minute. Did you know their the 10th Smartest animal in the world. And this is including a list of about 5 monkeys. So lets take out the great primate variable and Pigs rank in the top 5.... surpassing dogs, horses and even dolphins and elephants in IQ tests. Pigs have also even been showing recent glimpses into the way they think by way of playing video games and in a wide open and spacial world when asked to do certain commands.... they even surpass chimps in understaning of a 3D environment. Pigs can idealize how long to hold their breath in an under water swim. Monkeys cant. Pigs understand human speech better than any other mammal and can be trained to do almost anything on command. Their scense of smell & hearing are better than any canines, and this in the end is an animal we huddle together in the 1000s in filth and slaughter savagely...just to make our breakfast bacon and dinner pork chops. If you gave a pig a enclosed field with a clean pool and a mud pit to choose from they would NEVER lay in muddy water. They like to be clean and would always choose the clean water to wallow in. Naturally pigs would not look like they do to us either, THEY ARE NOT NATURALLY "PIGS".... the pigs we see and know are all also ADDICTS to food caused by a drug we give them to make them get the munchies .....its called "pig crave" and makes them have the starving feeling 24-7, naturally any pig would be built more like their feral cousins and be well built, thick, but still athletic and not very fat. But when its about $ and the industry I guess these things can all be looked over, SO what are we all gonna do when we find out Dogs taste better than pigs? Start farming them? I dont see why not... their not as smart clean or evolved socially but in our heads it seems so backwards how we could do this to such a smart animal.... and with others we kind of take them under our wings and coddle them away from these dangers of the world. Makes no sense to me but I guess it may have to do with the fact in early days the dog came to us to help us catch the pig, if it was the other way around we probaly would be eating dogs and living with pigs. Dont get me wrong I love Bacon and am having Pork CHops for dinner tonight, I dont deny their deliciousnous....I just think its fucked up how we treat them and after knowing as much as we do about them we dont cry for them and try to change these unfair practices before worrying about more inferior animals in far better situations....
  9. Dreamer

    Dreamer Big Dog

    Yeah, after I realized what pigs went through as meat animals in this country, I quit eating it.

    I do think though that you CAN get meat from more appropriately raised animals -- I'm looking! I've seen the beef, so.....

    I agree with what you said about the pigs; but still, they have never had the place at man's side throughout history that the dog has had....no doubt it sounds like you could make "dogs" out of them, but hasn't happened yet/!

  10. Excelsior-Mom

    Excelsior-Mom Big Dog

  11. Dreamer

    Dreamer Big Dog

    Oooh - in my case anyway, you'd be wrong about my feelings about keeping horses cooped up in stalls. That has always bugged me. Horses and dogs both, ideally, should have a good amount of freedom every day (it's actually prolly more important for the horses for their foot health). It bugs me when they don't get much......because I see every day how much they enjoy it...I do not have horses anymore and do not have the number of dogs I want because I cannot give them what I believe to be important -- to run in the sun and the mud and the grass!

    I grew up in Wyoming and HAD horses -- I have never heard anyone call someone irresponsible for keeping their horses in a pasture!

    And I DO have a real big problem with the numbers of animals kept in shelters, rescues, and for evidence for too long, living in crates, isolated -- for months and years at a time. That is not right either.

    Again, not telling anyone how they should keep their animals. I've learned that doesn't work. I just want them to think about what it is they DO do. I promise, I will think about what *I* do!

  12. Dreamer

    Dreamer Big Dog

    Totally agree. I do not agree with the "humanization" of dogs.

  13. Dreamer

    Dreamer Big Dog

    Yeah, darn dogs....guess they needed us as much as we needed them!

    It COULD have been PIGS!

  14. brindle

    brindle Big Dog

    Pretty sad... they are already offering up for "adoption" the other animals taken from the Patricks:


    Animals Seized in Dog Fighting Raid Ready To Adopt

    by Leasa Conze, KOLD News 13 at 5 Producer

    Some of the dozens of animals seized in the bloodsport bust earlier this week are now ready for adoption.

    The Humane Society has geese, goats, and chickens looking for new homes.

    They were seized from property in Avra Valley Tuesday, along with 110 pit bulls.

    Investigators think the operators of the West Orange Grove kennel bred and trained the dogs for fighting, then shipped them out across the country.

    Another 40 pit bulls were seized from two other locations Tuesday.

    None of the dogs is up for adoption while they're part of the criminal investigation.

    Six people face charges. They were released on their own recognizance after making initial court appearances Tuesday night.


    I was told this case is similar to the Patricks' arrest:


    Yet I don't see the HSUS involved at all, even though these dogs were kept in far worse conditions.

    These puppy mill type breeders were given plenty of warnings before their animals were taken. They had from Nov 2006 until Dec 2007, over a year to fix bad conditions of their dogs. Were the Patricks or any of the others given a year to rectify supposed poor living conditions?


    And this video states that they will NOT adopt out any of these dogs:


    Ugh... what a mess. I would hope the dogs could be spared, but it does not look too promising
  15. Last edited by a moderator: Feb 26, 2008
  16. Bullyson

    Bullyson CH Dog

    Here ya go...

    <TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD>Related Links


    A bust on pit bull fighting lands what police call one of the most notorious breeders in the nation. And investigators say his work is tied to dog fighting here. Police believe this latest arrest for dog fighting in Arizona is a big one because it takes off the street someone considered among the top three breeders in the country for pit bull fighting.

    The dark underworld of dog fighting is getting a bright light cast on it, the most recent example is Mahlon “Pat” Patrick arrested in Arizona this week charged with dog fighting. But the Humane Society says he also breeds pit bulls to fight worldwide.

    Lieutenant Mike Frost with the Saline County Sheriff's Department led an investigation into possible dog fighting and animal cruelty last month when several dogs were taken into custody.

    "There are dogs coming in across state lines. It's quite a problem with these major breeders around the country," Frost says. "I know the dogs that we have confiscated during the search warrants, the information we have is a good number of them came from Tennessee."

    Police say those dogs came from a breeder who calls himself ‘California Jack’ on his website. When users check the pedigree of his dogs they find the generational bloodline. Many of them go back to Pat Patrick, the same man arrested in Arizona on charges of dog fighting. Dozens of pit bulls were taken from pins near Tucson where Patrick was raising them.

    "They are going to ship the dogs out,” Frost says. “With the authorities taking him down and arresting him, I use the analogy of drugs."

    You take down one dealer and you hurt the supply, but you don't stop it.

    "I look and think of the crime that is being brought into SalineCounty. The element that is brought in, you have drugs, you have gang members coming in with it," Frost says.

    FOX16 News spoke with the dog breeder ‘California Jack’ by phone. He said he knows some of the dogs he breeds are bought by some to fight, but that he can't control what people do with his dogs.

    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 26, 2008
  17. cheese

    cheese Top Dog

    They think PP got his dogs from Ca. Jack?
    And that drug dealer analogy seems pretty far stretched but i guess this whole thing is.

    JRSPITS Top Dog

    OK, let me get this straight, according to the article: if I breed a few litters and a few generations down the road someone fights their dog and I am held accountable? That is the craziest thing I ever heard!!!!!
  19. Bullyson

    Bullyson CH Dog

    The drug dealer analogy is what people see. They're grouping the professional breeders like Pat in with the common street thugs in movies like OTC. They're all the same to JQP because ignorance runs rampant through the media and thats whats being bottle fed to America. Education took a back seat to propaganda. They want our dogs dead, period.
  20. bulldog426

    bulldog426 Big Dog

    wonder if these "killers" will be uthanized "spelling" too?? and yeah there is nothing humane about the humane society, and it's pretty messed up that animals have more rights than us. you are suspected of dogfighting, not actually caught in the act you go to jail, all your dogs are killed, you pay a bunch of fines, and have your name slandered all over the media. while a rapist or a murderer goes free, or only serves a year and a little probation.

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