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If you could have mentored under anyone...

Discussion in 'Dog Discussion' started by CHUVALOFAN, Jul 26, 2015.

  1. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    That was a great book and at the time it was cutting edge. Although a lot has changed since then the dogs have not evolved so much so that Mr. Steven's book could do the same today.

    I have an signed first copy that I bought form him what seems like a 100 years ago. When he went before the high courts and won, that book was selling for a ton of money. I must have been living in a bubble because I read about the entire deal at the tail end. Pretty much when the 'value' of the book dropped.

    I think the fact he was a runner and he boxed and worked out and put his over all abilities against another he had some insight to working the dogs. He applied it simply and did not over apply or over think the work.

    This is another that made "Hall of Fame" like contributions.

    S
     
    bamaman, oldguy and AGK like this.
  2. AGK

    AGK Super duper pooper scooper Administrator

    I never really had a mentor per say. Though a lot have helped me here and there over the years when I needed it. Wardog I would consider somewhat a mentor in the beginning days. He introduced me to handling etc. BBD helped out a lot early on whenever I needed it as well. If I could be anyone's protégé I'd of wanted my mentoring to come hands on from BBD. He may not be all famous like a lot of these other guys are but if you was across from them, you'd better have something top notch on your end coming over or it was curtains.
     
    oldguy and tomjones2 like this.
  3. bamaman

    bamaman GRCH Dog

    I find this to be true alot .The guy that taught me the most ,I've actually only met one person online that knew him.
     
  4. benthere

    benthere CH Dog Staff Member

    Rick and Les Fowler to teach integrity
    Sonny Sykes to teach cunning
    Bob Lowery to teach breeding and care
    Robert Lemm to teach conditioning
    Sparky Hermès to teach gambling
    Iron Mike for history both past and present, he knew who was good, who was bad and where the bodies were buried.
    There were many more who’s names I won’t mention out of respect but I will mention a man called Gump who learned it all from Bert Clouse and Don Mayfield
    The above weren’t what I would call mentors, they were friends and dogmen.
    It was a two way street, the one thing all the above men had in common were they were WAY wiser than the average dog man, they knew knowledge wasn’t limited to what they had, what they knew, or what they had seen. They were always looking for something better.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2020
  5. GK1

    GK1 Big Dog

    that's no small compliment. i have the red hard cover I ordered in the 90s. care and feeding of the canine athlete subject matter always interested me. on the other hand, I refused to pay $100 on the big book that came out around that time from wild side kennel? I think. Looked comprehensive...still relevant like velvet/steel?
     
    oldguy likes this.
  6. GK1

    GK1 Big Dog

    ^^^^^oh that's great - a mentor to teach "cunning".
     
  7. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    The Complete Gamedog was a good book, then came the PitBull Bible. All good reads and all have their place.

    The next "BOOK" has every opportunity to be better as it will have the advantage of having the latest and greatest.

    The three 'books', Velvet and Steel, Complete Game dog and Pit Bull Bible all contain extremely useful information. All three have had their methods upgraded with time and an advancement.

    In books like these the best compliment maybe is that it can be used as a reference, meaning, it has stood the test of time.

    S
     
    bamaman, oldguy and david63 like this.
  8. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    And if they wanted to make money they should write the same book and make it about a Beagle or Poodle where main stream America would reference it. (rest of the world too).

    Tag it to the pit bull community and all of a sudden the canine information is not useful to the other canines.

    Amazing to me how that works.

    S
     
    oldguy and david63 like this.
  9. benthere

    benthere CH Dog Staff Member

    If you weren’t cunning several things could happen, most all of them bad
    Google the “Missouri 500” just to get a taste
    Sonny was one of the sharpest men I’ve ever met
    “If you wanna play by the rules join a county club”
    was something he told me more than once
    When you are in the sights of the highest levels of State and Federal law enforcement it can really pay to be “cunning”
    Not to mention how to avoid being cheated, ripped off or even murdered by the lowlife human scum that has always infested the dog game.
    I can’t count how many kids, young men and women, I saw get into these dogs and then completely lose their minds. Some ended up in prison, some ended up dead, some lost their livelihoods, some survived with a few good dogs.
    The survivors had one thing in common, they were cunning.
     
  10. tomjones2

    tomjones2 Pup

    I purchased the digital copy of Dogs of Velvet and Steel for a couple bucks. Will be happy to share.
     
    oldguy likes this.
  11. Holocaust

    Holocaust Match dog


    Make a thread with the pdf attached
     
    tomjones2 and oldguy like this.
  12. oldguy

    oldguy CH Dog

    I think owning the 3 books you mentioned - Velvet & Steel, Complete Gamedog and Pitbull Bible probably the best mentoring anyone could reasonably ask for when they start out.. Personally I'd add Zinetti's 'Dogman's Handbook' to the list, the info contained in them books is proven science, compared to the complete & total shite I've heard come out of the mouths of some UK dogmen.
     
    Finito, david63 and slim12 like this.
  13. CockneyRebel

    CockneyRebel Big Dog

    The ones who were honest to others and themselves.
     
    oldguy likes this.
  14. david63

    david63 CH Dog

    Oldguy those three books you just mentioned are like collectors items.
     
    oldguy likes this.
  15. 80BOWTIE

    80BOWTIE Big Dog

    I learned a lot from Stratton books. A lot of blood line info. I used to have them all. Made mistake of loaning them. I like Mayfield
     
    oldguy likes this.
  16. tomjones2

    tomjones2 Pup

    Unfortunately the file is to big(71mb) to upload.
     
    oldguy likes this.
  17. oldguy

    oldguy CH Dog

    I heard them books are rare now, although I think you can still get the updated Zinetti book somewhere? I owned all them books, loaned them out and never got them back (usual) but for me, getting out of the dark ages was when I bought ' Velvet & Steel'.. Even the people who already owned bulldogs in my area were clueless as me.. My first show was against the Limeys, Should have just stayed at home and sent the money in the post, even they said my dog was better, but the owner was an idiot (me.) I was feeding them new (Danny Burton in a bag) baked wheat kibbles for working dogs, thinking everything in there would make my dog the next Pit General, years later I asked Springview what he fed during a keep and learned he only used time tested methods of the old miners & steel workers from his area who owned Sporting Staffords.. Tripe, beef, chicken, veg, whole meal bread & broth.. Wish he was in my camp when I met the Limeys, they'd have got scalped!
     
  18. CockneyRebel

    CockneyRebel Big Dog

    Yep when you think about it kibble is a pretty modern diet for dogs. Back in the day the old pit dogs would have probably ate the leftovers of the family dinners.
     
    david63, oldguy and Soze the killer like this.
  19. billbulldog

    billbulldog Big Dog

    I've always mixed kibble with real chicken small veg some aded vitamins for breakfast ive always fed scrambled egg with goats milk
     
    oldguy likes this.
  20. oldguy

    oldguy CH Dog

    In the 80's I only fed a kibble called Wafcol 14% Protein, nothin else that was it, dogs just about managed to maintain a pulse, but when I worked one, they was going catabolic in a fortnight, the dog was wrecked, I'm driving a skeleton on, too stupid to know I'm killing my own dog, poor fckr had nothing left, drained and sore & couldn't recover because I'd be there next day wanting more work.. It was 'Velvet & Steel' put me on my way and I was grateful for it.
     

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