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A bulldogs hold

Discussion in 'Breeder Discussion' started by cottonmouthcur, Feb 6, 2015.

  1. I'd like to know yalls opinion on how a dogs figures his/her go to hold do you feel its genetically imprinted or did they learn it from which hold caused the most pain in the schooling process
  2. Fritz

    Fritz Big Dog

    It is, at least initially, "genetically imprinted," as you say. We've seen this tendency many times, one particular line tending toward front leg dogs, another toward ear dogs, etc. I say "initially," however, because there are instances where, say, an ear dog might be turned into a leg dog merely by virtue of having been beat up badly enough by a leg dog. It doesn't happen often, a dog's changing his/her style that way -- his/her "genetic imprint" being overridden by a learned experience, specifically one that caused serious hurt. Any others here knowing of or having heard of this phenomenon?
  3. TDK

    TDK CH Dog Staff Member

    I think that if a dog is having its way, or at least, close to that, it will stay with what it does. I believe there to be a little of each aspect mentioned here. If a dog is bred heavily on dogs that prefer one certain style more than other styles, it would be considered a bit hereditary.

    I also believe that some experiences in schooling and in some dogs' maturity, they may change and/or become more versatile in style(s), just from the progressive learning experience. I've seen certain dogs that have exhibited these things, albeit not in a major way but to a slight yet necessary degree. I've schooled enough dogs to realize that things change with experiences. Otherwise, the stages set in its progression would be for naught.

    I also attribute some dogs' versatility in style to box savvy. Some just are more adept to it than others. Just the hand of mom nature, who deals out different tools to different dogs, I suppose. So, I'm sure that to some degree, that prowess is genetic.

    I have seen dogs I considered ultimate opportunists. I also consider this having to do with some natural box smarts. One, in particular that I once knew well, would go about even with another bitch until she saw or felt the other bitch "draw" just an iota. Then..........the other bitch was hers. She was very poised. In boxing we called that ring presence. As to a qb in football, we call it pocket presence. So, I guess that might be box presence.

    These are merely my views and opinions from my time with the dogs. I don't think anything is actually cookie cut with these dogs.
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 6, 2015


    ..it was good back in the day, to see one which would/could adapt to which ever hold suited..at the time...but agree about genitic/imprint style with some familys/lines...interesting ..Q..name some lines which are known for certain styles..???
  5. Fritz

    Fritz Big Dog

    I'm sure others can answer that better than I. I do think, generally speaking, that most lines tend and tended toward such "straight ahead" dogs as worked the front end. In a sense opposite to them, there were the ear dog types whose style was to hold them out. Ed Crenshaw, I think, had the two ways going for him -- some of his breeding tending to those front end dogs and others of his breeding tending toward those very clever ear dogs. It was Freddy Jones, I think, who brought those Crenshaw ear dogs to the fore.

    Another famous ear dog of those days was one Gr. Ch. Barney owned by Larry McCaw if I remember correctly. Someone else will have to fill me in as to how Barney was bred.
  6. Thanks for sharing yalls opinion as for me I think it's a little of both I've seen a ear holding dog let that hog get to it's backend and work em over his next time out little fella shot str8 to that backend and rocked that hog to sleep and before that all he did was hold that head n dance em to the dirt thanks again.


    ...yep..it was good to see a clever dog at work ..and keep himself out of trouble..a clever who could switch like ya say..can be an ideal dog..
  8. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    There can be some genetic link within some blood lines/families. Some traits go from generation to generation. Certain families are consistently head dogs, stifles dogs, some even are even 'throat checking finishers'.

    Some learn certain things in schooling. I do not think many change their styles based on schooling as they seem to have that propensity. What they tend to do in schooling is 'learn how to defend against styles', defend themselves and then revert back to what they do best.

    And like all things, at that point they can surprise you. I have seen a few that chose a plan on show night that they had never used in prior schooling. And have seen some that were all about their special skill in schooling and then not even use it when needed, and some that switched to a better plan when needed.

    Long story short, according to the old Mountain Man, the only thing you can say accurately about a dog is what he did the last time, after that any guess is as good as the next, or at least it was said that way in so many words. S
  9. bigeli

    bigeli Big Dog

    Well put slim.....


    Page 2??? another great read that should be published...
    Nice post also Slim... I agree manorisms are inherited and taught...
    Theres a family of waccama big john (redboy jocko)bulldogs that the hoghunters prefer because they go to the gut and drive in circles leaving the pig helpless unable to goar the bulldog whom works together with a solid running catchdog on the nose... A couple of siblings as well as an uncle were utilized for this style of catch and some bulldog cattahoula crosses were said to be showing promise to, most hunters dont like this style beacause it leaves the bulldog open for serious damage from the tusks, but if effect its a great style of bringing home the bacon... naturally being a fan of ourstyle bulldogs i doubt the cross as a cat cross might not shoot to the spot so quick and risk loosing them, but I respect what they breed for... It didnt suprize me that the bulldogs did it as it was part heridtary, but it did siprize me for the cattahouls to be gut twisters... Which reminds me of an old saying, you can breed this bulldog to a fence post and still get a bulldog, but in those carolina woods stranger things have happened like the local indian folklore of a meteorite creating the lake of waccamaw...
  11. bounty

    bounty Big Dog

    Did you go visit dons grave or something and get some of his writing vibe...LMAO
  12. the.peon

    the.peon Top Dog

  13. bounty

    bounty Big Dog

    how well and where a dog holds a pig is mostly genetic but experiences especially when they are young can influence them either positively or negatively. The other aspect of holding is how well they can actually hold and this comes down to a few things, again, genetics, grip strength, desire and overall body strength.
  14. bootsbjj

    bootsbjj Banned

    Damn, I'm glad I clicked this thread! Good stuff...

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