The Staffordshire must remain a multi-purpose dog

no idea what you're on about m8 but i aint trying to justify my dog as game at all. she's a family pet thats friendly to other dogs and gets a little lively around cats and wildlife. if i wanted a game dog i know exactly where to get one but thats not my thing.

if you want to define game your own way then grand but gameness exists in many animals in many forms. the definition of the word should be enough to satisfy anyone as to what it means, it doesnt just apply to the dogs we own.

 

Thats what i was on about mate ha

 

so show me where in that paragraph i mention anything about my dog being game?

dictionary definition of 'gameness'

gameness is defined as a determination to master any situation and never back down out of fear. this applies to animals and humans alike.

if you wanna argue with thousands of years of the evolution of language then be my guest.

 

im sure you've heard of 'an teastas mór'. here in ireland, up 67/68 it was issued for dog on badger trials. you actually couldnt have a champion terrier unless it possesed the cert.

no mention of dog on dog in it.

 

but no mention of it making the dog game either.

i liked what Oxstaf said about racing against a lesser beast, it made a lot of sense. like 12 gauge said, it's usually just fun for a dog on things like coon and similar, dunno would the irish badger cause problems because it's illegal now so can't find out.

 

again it all depends on what your definition of game is.

if someone rolls dogs then they have your own definition that applies to their needs. but thats within a certain community and a minority in the working dog world.

in the broader scope gameness is far beyond the pit. there are plenty of game terriers that work the fields but can co-exist with other dogs. infact many need to be worked alongside other dogs so DA isnt desired.

im not disputing what gameness is when it comes to the pit. but i will dispute anyone saying it can only be displayed in the pit when thats only one side of game.

but if your dog backs out of a task due to fear, no matter what the task is then you cant say your dog is game.

 

"Teastas Mor was a certificate of gameness issued to a dog by the IKC."

 

i have never thought a dog fighting a wild animal showed a high degree of gameness ,always thought the dog could sense fear emanating of it and its opponent was only fighting for survival nothing else .. just my opinion

 

Oh, i see.

 

but the game in a dog isnt about the fight in it. its about the willingness to keep at it.

i would assume in dog/dog world a 5 time winner that has never been properly tested by a real opponent isnt game, no matter how many easy wins it has.

in the same reasoning, a small dog that goes at a badger, gets hurt but wont back down, can be considered game. its willingness to finish the task at hand, inspite of proven danger, is pretty much the definition of game.

 

ding ding ding ding ding, we have a winner people.

In theory.
A dog fighting a wild animal and specialy a dog bred too fight is more for the entertainment of man then dogfighting wil ever be.
At least in the last situation you wil have 2 dogs bred for competition, in proper condition and handling.
In the first situation you are talking about a wild animal that wil only fight for it's survival.

 

yes but the dog is gonna keep at it if he can sense his opponent is fearfull of him ,once the dog gets smashed bad by say a badger then keeps on it then yes game for sure ..

 

again, thats in the dog on dog sense. but there are a lot of dogs, not bred for competition that are worked and proven to be game.

i guess its just different ways of what the word means to a given person. farmer joe that works his patterdales has no need for a competition dog but still wants a game dog that wont back out of a hole.

 

thats exactly what im talking about. im certainly not talking about some idiot throwin his staffy onto a swan to see some carnage. that kinda BS is definitly for human entertainment purposes.

 

Dear friend, I never said that my dogs are game ... and I don't want to justify anything because who want to justify knows to be in error or in bad faith ... and I'm not the one and the other.

Aur selection is based on the test of strength (10 & 20 miles to trot) and on TAG test as I also wrote above:

"In Italy the IKC ave a test called TAG and is a test that assesses, in 3 or 4 minutes, the most important genetic behavioral characteristics of a bulldog: hardness and the desire to face a situation that requires physical confrontation. Do not tell us whether a dog is game, but it certainly tells us if a dog has is balls. The test is very selective and 70% of the dogs subjected to it can not pass it. I have seen many breeds crying to the hardness test, and also pit tested in the box to cry at the TAG. This does not diminish the value of the pit if it is right for the box, as well as hunt the badger or pass the TAG does not diminish a Staffordshire."

Then you tell me where I want to justify the "game" of my dogs ...

 

My previous message is for Oxstaf!

 

in italy you have a test called the TAG in the rest of the world we have a test called the PIT each to your own buddy ...

 

Can we not just end this conversation (at least i am), we are talking too a man who has is own line of dogs, his own registry, he has 2 champion staffords who are also ROM but every offspring belongs too the bulldogkennel and offcourse under his own registry.
Don't think that normal logic about how these dogs came too be wil ever hit them.

 

a frame champions ???

 

in Italy there is also the pit test my friend ... But if I wanted to do that test ... I would have raised adba from proven lines and no the Staffordshire.

What rightly writes BmSBT is that the game is not just dog against dog ... but you can see it in many other works. Maybe it's a kind of game different from the pit but equally difficult to select and maintain over time.