Vise grip's dogs

most the great producers were great performers. Look at the rom list, for every sub par dog that produced well there are thousands that didnt.

 

But some of the best producers should have been culled....we'll start w/dibo for example, mom was cold and shouldn't have been bred but was and dibo was 4 before he turned into the beast that he was. By your standards or others we wouldn't have what we know today. Could it have been better?? Maybe maybe not. Who's to say that guys haven't culled dogs out of their program before they even knew what thay had? Our predecessors knew that if they had good bloodlines from winning families they would eventually produce winning dogs. Percentages is the name of the game

 

And by all means I was not there to experience that but it is well documented. Just wanted to clear that up cause I know some people like to answer w/so you were there to see this?? Lol

 

And people use the few examples of cold and cur dogs producing as an excuse to breed their sub par dog. So yes i believe that if we didn't breed those acceptions to the rules that produced well along with the millions of sub par dogs that didnt produce well that we would have better dogs. That means less BS and more bulldogs. I guess those days are done so it doesnt matter anymore huh?

 

There are more than a few acceptions to the rule dream that have been bred and produced. Not much has changed except the volume that it's done in these days because of the growing population and popularity of our dogs.

 

But not before great advice. A question I have been trying to piece together has just been addressed.

 

Thanks for advice benthere, I never said I was gonna breed untested animals to one another. I was pointing out that according to a strict culling program we wouldn't have had some of "our greats". That's all. I read somewhere once before that if you breed unproven animals to one another that eventually you'd have a yard full of german shepards. Lol.....originally this thread was about vise grip dogs. I personally love the PP dogs and most that have descended from his yard. My opinion PP was a genius, it was said he didn't hunt w/his dogs but consistently produced bulldogs. I did recently say he wasn't a man of integrity because of confusion w/peds. But definitely a smart man.

 

Ol Ca Jack yeah I remember that guy we never bought a dog from him but he had good knowledge about health and his dogs/yard always looked good.But when it came to schooling/testing and winning well thats a differnt story !

 

Some dogs are not equipped enough. Why by dogs you immediately have to breed away from? Makes no since. Breeders selling breeding stock? That is not much of a breeder persay. That is someone hoping to stack genes and confusing vigor production and performance. JMO

 

So I heard of that many dogs of Ca Jack didn´t work........
How about the ones that work? Just being curious!
Some have also dogs that they consider to be of decent quality.
Y´all know Jack is bragging about percentages etc., so what´s his (proven!!!!!) record and not what he just states.
Also wondering why the hell serious dogmen are trying his blood anyways?
Have they just been curious and gave it a try anyways or have they been fooled by hyped stuff?
Please be patient as I never really had my eyes either on Ca Jack´s propaganda nor his dogs, so some dogs already have been discussed but how many dogs came down from Vise Grip Kennels and how many of them showed to be worth a bet?

 

Go to archives look in breeder discussions and read hard culling or genetic redirection by cali jack. Since this thread is about his dogs his words should have some impact. I don't know him or own any of his dogs but he seems pretty knowledgeable.

 

he's trying to sell dogs . of course he's going to make it sound good lil mayhem .

 

http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Public&file=printPedigree&dog_id=391294

Pretty stoked about this one....it's my dog Belle's first breeding.

 

old goat for President! ^

 

good looking dogs man...good luck Belleeeeeee mum to be.

 

@deadhank, Nice breeding. Hope they work out for you.

 

Thanks....she did real good with the pups. They're 3.5 months and crazy as hell....