New to group and patter dales

[killjoy]

Hi all,
my name is Mike and i live in san antonio texas.
i just purchased my new best friend about a month ago, a wire harie patterdale, the dog is 5 months old now.
i am an avid hunter, but not in a traditional way. i am a falconer and i use a hawk to hunt with instead of guns or arrows. i hunt, rats, rabbits, squirrels, birds and other small game like that.
so i need to get my bird use to a dog and a dog use to a bird.
so i took my dog to the field with a wild rat i caught, i wanted the dog to bark at the rat causing it to run and the bird to catch the rat, it was going to be very controled and the bird would associate the dog as a hunting partner.
but the dog was absolutely terrified of the rat in the have-a-heart trap.
the rat left a pee stain about 1 foot in diameter, so it was scared also.
but i was suprised that the dog was trying to run away from the rat, i mean absolutely terrified!!

so i need some pointers on how to get this dog into game mode. it doesnt have to kill anything, but i dont want him running for his life if a mouse pops out either.

any help is appreciated!!!
mike

[snakewidomski]

I think you have a late starter.
Some Patterdale Terriers act like puppies till they are 12 or 18 month.
Make a break, and try to work with the dog 1 month later. If the dog will not work again, make the next break for 1 month. ...And so on....
If your dog is from a good working line he will hunt.
...I am afraid that he will hunt your bird, too.

[raman781]

First thing to do is get your dog started on tug games, chasing the ball, and get him to go after the flirt pole. Work with him daily, as much as possible. Dog should end all games wanting more.
Don’t take him out to the field, first introduce him to the rodent in his environment, at home when dog is in prey mode(play mode). Young patterdales seem to get nervous when you drive them in the car and when they are in a strange environment, this will pass and the more you take them out the faster it will pass.
Build you dogs confidence by not yelling, hitting, or forcing, this discipline will confuse the dog, not saying that you are doing that.

snakewidomski is right about your bird, these little dogs can't resist.

[groundnpound]

I disagree on the late starter comment, although I do agree with the rest of Snakewidomski's reply. Especially with the dog wanting to eat the bird in the future. Raman has a good point as well by introducing the rodent to the dog on his own territory. Just be patient with the little guy. Sometimes they won't show interest until a yr old or so. Patience is key. If he's not doing anything by 18 months - 2 yrs old, then I would definitely do away with him. These dogs are mainly to go to ground, so I'm not sure you chose the right breed for your style of hunting. Either way, good luck!

[killjoy]

thanx guys!
i did have a break thru this past weekend. i went to a farm and took the dog to get some running time and social time with another dog.
the guy i was with trapped another rat, and this time it was different.
he didnt run up barking, but he walked up to it was intruged by it, actually sat there and sniffed it a little.
i also took the dog out to meet the bird while it was eating.
of course it was time to bark and act mean!!!
so now its a matter of getting them use to eachother.
FYI,
JRT's are very popular in falconry, so i guess its up to the training it recieves.
as for getting rid of him, not going to happen. this dog was purchased as a family/hunting dog. so if he doesnt work out he still has a home!

as for the input, thanx!
tennis balls arent always on the shopping list, but i have been meaning to get some.

"Build you dogs confidence by not yelling, hitting, or forcing, this discipline will confuse the dog, not saying that you are doing that. "
as a falconer this doesnt work with the bird either, but the bird lives outside so pooping in the house doesnt happen either.
i have an 8x8 kennel and the dog will wait for us to get home to crap in the house, any suggestions on how to stop that?

other than that i do practice positive reinforcement on the dog, much like the bird.


here are a couple of pics of my bird.
the first one is her with a 10lb jack rabbit we caught in new mexico this past christmas, and the second one is a cotton tail she caught.
the bird is a harris hawk and is the only bird in the world that can fly in a family unit.
they have been calle wolves of the sky since they can pack hunt like a wolf pack!
thanx for the replys, they are much appreciated.

[jacko]

proper bloke ! dying breed !!!!!

[ben brockton]

how did you catch a hawk ?

[TASOSCHATZ]

Catching hawks is illegal, unless you are a mongolian lol, but you can buy prety much everything, papers included, ring actually, from breeders. Harris hawks are easy going and nice to work with, relatively speaking always.

[killjoy]

being i am american i can trap a hawk.
to trap a hawk you have to go thru a 2 year apprenticeship pass a federal test with an 80, get inspected to make sure you have minimum requirments.

it was not easy by any strech of the imigination!
but very rewarding and cool.
my son loves it and my girls like having the bird around!
of course it will be a motivation for having my daughters home by cerfew time!!!!!
and by then i hope to have an eagle!!!!

i used a special trap with tiny nooses on it. you put a rat in the trap and the bird comes down and tries to grab the trap and as it does the noose gets wrapped around the toe or foot trapping it.