Pitter Patt vs Patterdales

[NewSchoolDogMan]

So just out of curiosity, what are the differences between the two dogs? Can anyone tell me what are the advantages and disadvantages of a pitterpat (apbt x patt) and a standard patterdale off of lines like nutall etc.?

[MinorThreat]

sure, ones a mutt

[Naustroms]

like mt said. the pitterpat is a mutt and too big for its original work. like asking the differences between a boxer x apbt and a bulldog

[Blackpoison]

So just out of curiosity, what are the differences between the two dogs? Can anyone tell me what are the advantages and disadvantages of a pitterpat (apbt x patt) and a standard patterdale off of lines like nutall etc.?

one has already bull way back and the other has a recent cross to bull ..

what would you call a wheeler bred dog.. a stafferdale lol its called patterdale..

[paddy]

on the ball BP..Every terrier has bull blood in it but its diluted..even every few generations brian nuttal use add bull blood to his line..personally i like 3/4 patts 1/4 apbt...

[benthere]

like mt said. the pitterpat is a mutt and too big for its original work. like asking the differences between a boxer x apbt and a bulldog

not even close.
a patterdale isn't a breed like a bulldog.
patterdales are a TYPE of terrier bred to hunt.
we did a cross last year. the 50/50 dogs hunt like demons.
we hunt coons that weigh more than 30lb and coyote.
small (10lb) patterdales get their face destroyed by large coon.
20lb patterdales take an ass kicking from a 30lb coon and don't have enough wind to go 20 to 30 minutes if we have to dig to them.
the 50/50 dogs have wind like a bulldog and can kill coon in short order.
plus they can run with hounds when hunting coyote.
when bred back to a patterdale a 50/50 bitch from that litter threw some awesome pups that are hunting in their first season. that same bitch was on 150 coon last winter before she was 18 months old.
hardcore hunters want dogs that get the game, they aren't worried about 'pure' breeds.
patterdales have always been a mix of lakeland, border, russell, and gamedog.

[Naustroms]

not even close.
a patterdale isn't a breed like a bulldog.
patterdales are a TYPE of terrier bred to hunt.
we did a cross last year. the 50/50 dogs hunt like demons.
we hunt coons that weigh more than 30lb and coyote.
small (10lb) patterdales get their face destroyed by large coon.
20lb patterdales take an ass kicking from a 30lb coon and don't have enough wind to go 20 to 30 minutes if we have to dig to them.
the 50/50 dogs have wind like a bulldog and can kill coon in short order.
plus they can run with hounds when hunting coyote.
when bred back to a patterdale a 50/50 bitch from that litter threw some awesome pups that are hunting in their first season. that same bitch was on 150 coon last winter before she was 18 months old.
hardcore hunters want dogs that get the game, they aren't worried about 'pure' breeds.
patterdales have always been a mix of lakeland, border, russell, and gamedog.

whats the span of your patterdale/bulldog x? can they still go to ground? i feel like when you introduce more bull blood you add unnecessary size to the breed. as far as patts being a type and not a breed i guess you could say the same about bulldogs.

edit: if you're hunting large coons (30lb plus) and coyotes why even bother using patts at all? There are better dogs for handling this type of quarry including the apbt.

[benthere]

edit: if you're hunting large coons (30lb plus) and coyotes why even bother using patts at all? There are better dogs for handling this type of quarry including the apbt.

spannable??????
where we live its illegal to dig to game.
we hunt in barns and brushpiles. we hunt in the winter so a dog going "to ground" isn't a good thing since the ground is frozen and the underground warrens are usually under buildings or old foundations. if the dog gets under there you're looking at machinery to get them out. the dogs work in buildings, barns, etc. they get into tight spaces, they go where the coon are.
the 50/50 dogs get just about anywhere our patterdales get.
my patterdales are 'spannable' most of them weigh about 20-22 lb.
the 50/50 dogs are a little bit bigger, not 'spannable' but they are not bulldogs. they're terriers, not some mutt boxer cross, thats an insult.
these dogs work. if you saw one work you'd want one just like it.

[NewSchoolDogMan]

not even close.
a patterdale isn't a breed like a bulldog.
patterdales are a TYPE of terrier bred to hunt.
we did a cross last year. the 50/50 dogs hunt like demons.
we hunt coons that weigh more than 30lb and coyote.
small (10lb) patterdales get their face destroyed by large coon.
20lb patterdales take an ass kicking from a 30lb coon and don't have enough wind to go 20 to 30 minutes if we have to dig to them.
the 50/50 dogs have wind like a bulldog and can kill coon in short order.
plus they can run with hounds when hunting coyote.
when bred back to a patterdale a 50/50 bitch from that litter threw some awesome pups that are hunting in their first season. that same bitch was on 150 coon last winter before she was 18 months old.
hardcore hunters want dogs that get the game, they aren't worried about 'pure' breeds.
patterdales have always been a mix of lakeland, border, russell, and gamedog.

Thanks a lot for your input Benthere. Do you have any experience on a 3/4 pat 1/4 apbt? How are they as working dogs?

[CCDINO]

The few 3/4 patts 1/4 Pitts I've been around have been all around great dogs.with kids and other dogs,not cat friendly but that didn't bother me.same as the 3/4 pitts 1/4patts. Adrien renteria from renterriers has got both.his boy Rage is 3/4 patt and his boy chevy is
3/4 Pitt. Both are great dogs turn on and off for bite work very clear in the work..

[Naustroms]

spannable??????
where we live its illegal to dig to game.
we hunt in barns and brushpiles. we hunt in the winter so a dog going "to ground" isn't a good thing since the ground is frozen and the underground warrens are usually under buildings or old foundations. if the dog gets under there you're looking at machinery to get them out. the dogs work in buildings, barns, etc. they get into tight spaces, they go where the coon are.
the 50/50 dogs get just about anywhere our patterdales get.
my patterdales are 'spannable' most of them weigh about 20-22 lb.
the 50/50 dogs are a little bit bigger, not 'spannable' but they are not bulldogs. they're terriers, not some mutt boxer cross, thats an insult.
these dogs work. if you saw one work you'd want one just like it.

well i guess it all depends on the type of work you do and if you aren't diggin em then you don't need a smaller working dog. have worked barns with smaller bulldogs, patts and jrt x's. my point with the boxer x is that the patt is a fine working dog without crossing in more bull blood. if the terrier is too small to work the quarry then i'd say use a different tool. you can use a hammer for both nails and screws but sometimes its better off just using a screwdriver.

but my pov was more on going to earth. if you're not doing that then best of luck with the bull x's. wasn't putting them down as working dogs.

[NewSchoolDogMan]

The few 3/4 patts 1/4 Pitts I've been around have been all around great dogs.with kids and other dogs,not cat friendly but that didn't bother me.same as the 3/4 pitts 1/4patts. Adrien renteria from renterriers has got both.his boy Rage is 3/4 patt and his boy chevy is
3/4 Pitt. Both are great dogs turn on and off for bite work very clear in the work..

Do you know how large each type of cross runs? Like 1/2 pit 1/2 patt, 1/3 pit 3/4 pat, and 1/3 pit and 3/4 pat?

[CCDINO]

The 3/4 Pitts are around 30lbs and the 3/4 pats are around 20lbs.give or take there was a couple that were close to 40 but they've been able to get the size down

[damon]

I original job is to go to ground, adding bull blood to the equation isn't going to help matters at all

[CCDINO]

@ Damon Have you ever seen a 10lbs dog do bite work?its cool but not to affective you add a lil pit in there you got a 20-30 monster.A patterdale can't compete in any ring sport just to small won't make jumps,if you get the size up a bit the dogs work great.middle of next year.Renterriers will have the 1st patt/pitt to get a sch1 and a mondio 1 title.

[benthere]

I original job is to go to ground, adding bull blood to the equation isn't going to help matters at all

we hunt above ground mostly. we also hunt in barns and old houses.
it is ILLEGAL where we live to send dogs into dens (underground) so a smaller terrier is useless. plus if a dog gets underground or under an old foundation it is a complete pain in the ass to get them out when the ground is frozen rock hard for at least 3 feet (one meter for you euros).
when we scout a hunting site we will close off all access to underground dens just so our dogs don't end there. hence we use larger dogs when we hunt and the larger patterdales and crosses work well for us.

[tigerboy5]

@ Damon Have you ever seen a 10lbs dog do bite work?its cool but not to affective you add a lil pit in there you got a 20-30 monster.A patterdale can't compete in any ring sport just to small won't make jumps,if you get the size up a bit the dogs work great.middle of next year.Renterriers will have the 1st patt/pitt to get a sch1 and a mondio 1 title.

The 10lbs dogs arent effective at bite work because thats not what they were bred for. I dont know if you have looked into guard dog breeds but they are much more effective at bite work because its what they were bred for.

[damon]

we hunt above ground mostly. we also hunt in barns and old houses.
it is ILLEGAL where we live to send dogs into dens (underground) so a smaller terrier is useless. plus if a dog gets underground or under an old foundation it is a complete pain in the ass to get them out when the ground is frozen rock hard for at least 3 feet (one meter for you euros).
when we scout a hunting site we will close off all access to underground dens just so our dogs don't end there. hence we use larger dogs when we hunt and the larger patterdales and crosses work well for us.

I'm not disputing your use of your patterdale crosses, I'm simply stating the fact that he is an earthdog. That is the job he was bred to do, and adding extra bulldog blood isn't going to add anything to that purpose

[CCDINO]

@tigerboy5,I been training dog in proctetion for a few years now and as long as the dog has drive.it don't matter the breed.yes there are better breeds then others. we'll train any dog someone brings.we've even done a labradoodle.there's even a jack russel that did PSA a few yrs back.handled by a 9yr old girl...

[paddy]

I'm not disputing your use of your patterdale crosses, I'm simply stating the fact that he is an earthdog. That is the job he was bred to do, and adding extra bulldog blood isn't going to add anything to that purpose

bull blood adds some drive and size not much else..a good patterdale should have everything else for earth work..saying that i long apbt x patt for digging badgers but then i love hard dogs