WHY DO WE WORSHIP THE BULL AND SACRIFICE THE TERRIER

I agree.onece people start breeding for how a dog looks,well it all go's down hill from there!..plus any one can breed a dog for looks.its easy!...a lot more easy then breeding for performance!....

 

I do not believe everything I read. I fo believe this though. I have read from both sides. American and Irish folks...stories line up like alibis. .

 

Look into Mr. Deleaney and the history behind. This fellow is well known in dogs..not just staffs..or APBT..but hunting dogs ..in general.

 

I no.his web page is great....

 

All Brown was meant to have imported some Dublin Red Staff's to.....

 

Al Brown and Pete Sparks imported SBTs from Ireland , but they ware before any SBTs ware called Dublin Reds ,,,

http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=397576

http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=397575

 

see the dog in those peds,The jolly roger his owners son was a very good friend of mine, Mr harry rogers of Wolverhampton, John f Gordon of the bandits pre fix sold dogs to both joe orday and Pete sparks back in the day,and by all accounts they were incorporated into their breeding programs.

 

Harry was a contemporary of Mallen Timmins, the Dunns etc he was the last of the great old black countryman,i presume he has passed now,but if he hasn't he would be about 94,i used to sit and listen to him for hours.no such thing as an Irish staff they were all bred down from the same British kc stock. Dusty i seriously doubt sparks imported "Irish" staffs from anyone in ireland ,but he certainly imported sbts from JF gordon.

 

The dogs he sent over were out of or down,from a dog called brigands red rogerson,son of guess who? The so called uncrowned champion himself The jolly roger.

 

Dusty it says in your book(dead game,Irish Strong dog's of old)shanty of Dublin was on the cover of one of the American magazine's. Lol....Dusty can u please tell me about your CH Culchi(i may of spells that wrong)and her brother Black spider.I have 4times black spider in the 3rd and 4th of one of my hounds,and one time Culchi in the 6th....the dog is 12.....I have 2year olds of him bred back to his niece!.... Please help! Evan if negative....p.m.me.....Dusty u can have one for nothing!!!sir!!!.i have a male and female.....I want what's best for them!and the breed in general.... Dusty u no more then I ever could!and I respect u sir.please take one and see what u think. Dusty I don't no you from Adam.but I no your a living legend!.... Many champ's you've had Dusty!..respect!...sorry for being a tit,but I'm privileged to speak to some one genuine...... Plus its Saturday and I have just had 5 beer's with my tea lol.I'm celebrateing,I have just found out me and my wife are having a baby girl!! Are second!!!.... .Dusty....thanks for replying........... Respect sir!!!.....

 

It must have been great to listen to the old timer's...

 

Brilliant history!.....

 

All this was confirmed in an article on sparks and orday in the registar magazine in an interview they did if i remember right was done by Ed Mullins.But old Harry had been telling me about all this for years.I remember telling him about stuff people used to go on about the Irish staffs etc on the phone and he used to have a right old laugh about it.

 

Great peace of history. I do love history! (Wasn't history crap in school?)great now though.lol......thanks for sharing stedz.....

 

Al Brown's good Tudor stock + Imported Black Staffys = Hybrid vigor?

Stirrer Alert!

 

why do you doubt they imported SBTs from Ireland ? its common knowledge , the two dogs I posted the peds off came from Ireland to Sparks and Al Brown ,

 

Do you believe that?!kiwidogman?........I personally don't. ...........the reason I don't is:by the 1930s alone the dogs in America were far more better then the dog in England..( One only has to read Armitige book to see that).Earl Tudor would of had hundreds of dogs alone(England would of had hardly any)..........so to import English show stock,to improve American game stock is questionable???........ A country that had thousands of good dogs,wouldn't have needed to imported show dog from England!.......

 

No I don't believe it. Just putting it out there. But..... I think it's worth considering the POSSIBILITY he did a cross breeding or two. Even if only to satisfy his own curiosity. Show Staffords of the '30s were not that many generations removed from Working Staffs remember.

 

Dusty, i don't mean any disrespect but look at the dogs in those peds, they are all British , mainly English but also some of them were actually welsh. Now i'm not saying an Irishman didn't send them but they are not Irish staffs are they? It's the same with a lot of things e.g the OFRN dogs. Harry told me those dogs were always around when he was a kid and they just referred to them as Dudley's, because they were prevalent in the Dudley area of the black country which was then part of staffordshire. Now I'm not anti Irish far from it, in fact I love all things Irish I'm a Celt myself. I love going over when I can afford it because I love the jump racing, Guinness etc, but I've read accounts of how the Irish took their dogs over to America when they were immigrants etc, around the time of the famine, and quite frankly I don't believe it. Stratton, Mullins Brown all these people who are supposed to be historians clearly don't know much about the famine and poverty in Ireland in those times. The people had to eat grass to survive , there were even reports of cannibalism and millions of people died of starvation - surely any dogs would have been eaten sold or whatever, before they had managed to get the money together to be able to sail to America! Let me leave you with another example for decades Stratton, W brown etc were all saying JP Colby was an Irishman, read Louis colby's book the man was a Welshman for gods sake. If you listen to certain people Obama was Irish, muhammad Ali was Irish yeah yeah yeah as if!

 

Keep in mind that during the Highland Clearances landowners would pay tenant's passage to North America to get them off their land. I don't know if a similar practice took place in Ireland, I'll admit.