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Staffordshire Bull Terrier

Discussion in 'Staffordshire Bull Terriers' started by Envy's Mom, Sep 20, 2007.

  1. Envy's Mom

    Envy's Mom Top Dog

    I have been curious about this breed for a long time and I can't find enough information on them. Does anyone own these dogs or familiar with them. I have never even seen one in person, but I am interested in getting one someday.

    What I have read states they do not have a standard size and they can range from 30-100lbs. I was interested primarily because I thought they were smaller dogs. (i thought 30 or so lbs)

    If anyone has pictures too please post.
  2. dogged

    dogged Big Dog

    Males shouldn't be more than 38lbs.
  3. RightHandImp

    RightHandImp Big Dog

  4. Titch_Pitbull

    Titch_Pitbull Top Dog

    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 20, 2007
    Pipbull likes this.
  5. Envy's Mom

    Envy's Mom Top Dog

    Thanks for the links and pictures. That is a much better site than a the ones I ran across. I would love to get one of these one day, but I have never even seen one. At least not one I knew was this breed. They really look like APBTs. They have the same fighting history as well. I find that very intriguing. Does anyone have personal experience with them? Can you tell me a little about the personalities of these dogs. If you were to get one where would you go? About how much $ do these dogs cost?

    Any more info on these dogs would be greatly appreciated.
  6. heelinok

    heelinok Pup

    There was pretty cool little staffie in the movie Snatch. A friend of mine had one when I was growing up. We raised Boxers, and she was great around them. Amazingly high jumper for her size too.
  7. lunadogge

    lunadogge Pup

  8. Titch_Pitbull

    Titch_Pitbull Top Dog

    These are just regular staff's at a dog show in the UK. dedicated to working staffords.
  9. Titch_Pitbull

    Titch_Pitbull Top Dog

    "find that very intriguing. Does anyone have personal experience with them? Can you tell me a little about the personalities of these dogs. If you were to get one where would you go? About how much $ do these dogs cost? "

    I've owned a couple of working staff from lines such as Diamond Jim.Dublin Red.Fiery Jacks Pet. (all atleast Ch's in the box)

    These are very sweet dogs. Nicknamed the nanny dog because there amazing with children and humans in general. Highly active and very eager to please.

    Im not too sure about US breeders as ive only been in the US for a year or so now.

    Probably $800+ a pup.

    Both parents should be tested for eye sight and hips
  10. Envy's Mom

    Envy's Mom Top Dog

    Can someone explain the difference in the different Staffordshire Bull Terriers? There are Irish/Scottish and English. Are there other variations. I was originally looking for a British Staffordshire Bull Terrier. Although that may not even be a breed.

    I know the English have been ruined by show breeders and the Irish/ Scottish were originally game bred.

    Any additional info would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks again for everyones replies!
  11. Envy's Mom

    Envy's Mom Top Dog

    Thanks Titch that is good info to know!

    Keep the replies coming I would like to learn more!
  12. Titch_Pitbull

    Titch_Pitbull Top Dog

    Can someone explain the difference in the different Staffordshire Bull Terriers? There are Irish/Scottish and English. Are there other variations. I was originally looking for a British Staffordshire Bull Terrier. Although that may not even be a breed.

    Basically Irish dogs tend to be more preformance and game bred. Although I belive they are the same breed and stem from each other similar to the ast and the apbt.
  13. Mouser

    Mouser Big Dog

    Envy's Mom, Stafforshire Bull Terriers, are the english ones, Irish staffs, are a mix of Staffordshire Bull Terriers, English Bull Terriers (Spuds), and APBT's. The true Staffie Bulls are pretty neat dogs, I've not had any experience with the Irish Staffs, but I'd venture a guess that they are very much like APBT's. I owned a Staffie for a while, very sweet dog, but very DA towards same size or bigger males. I had to give him back to his previous owner, because he was allergic to something in my house. $800. would probably be a good starting price. Best of luck, Mouser
    Titch, them are some very nice looking dogs.
  14. Not to venture too far off topic, but I wonder what is the root of this behavior. (Im guessinig it is rooted in dominance). My pup is going on six months now, and he is acting the same way. If I have him out front, and someone walks by with a pomerian, etc he will ignore them (unless they challenge him), but if its a American Bulldog, Rottweiler, another APBT, etc. he goes nuts trying to get to them. I was just curious if someone new precisely why?

    BTW Titch_Pitbull those are beautiful dogs that you posted. I understand that they aren't your, but I just wanted to say thanks for posting. That black and white one (3rd picture down) looks especially serious!

    JRSPITS Top Dog

    Most breeders here in the US want about $1500+ for show pups, haven't found any good working kennels so far. I'm hoping to get one in the next few years. I met my first two staffy bulls a couple months ago and fell in love with their happy, enthusiastic personality.
  16. diva

    diva CH Dog

    I like this one!
  17. Envy's Mom

    Envy's Mom Top Dog

    Thanks everyone for your replies. These dogs seem pretty closely related to APBT and that intrigues me. I sent an email to this kennel to see if I could get some more information and I'll share with you what I got. This is the link for the kennel I emailed http://www.jajca.staffdata.co.uk/. They seem like really nice people. They gave me this link to check out http://www.staffords.co.uk/.

    Are these the showy ones or the working ones?

    The history on these dogs seems cut and paste from APBTs. Anyone know what sets the breeds apart?
  18. Titch_Pitbull

    Titch_Pitbull Top Dog

  19. 14rock

    14rock GRCH Dog

    I'll take em all :)
  20. grayley

    grayley Pup

    Here in the UK people have been selling so called Irish Staffords but if truth be known most of these dogs came from Kennel club show dogs imported into Ireland. Then in the 80s they were imported back into the UK in large numbers because Ireland bred them for the badger trials and for the pit, unlike in the UK these Staffords were real working Staffords. Alot of Staffords were crossed with Pits and EBT in the 80s. Heres a article written by a dogman from Ireland who produced some great match Staffords its a good read thought you guys might like it. Enjoy.


    Having read some of the contibtions in your periodical, it seems apparent theres quite a few Stafford fanciers living in fantasy land.Any suggestions that we should accept the English Bull Terriers version of history for the breed would be particularly retrograde, as that version is basically the English Bull Terriers history transposed onto the Stafford.

    According to the English Bull Terrier story, the 1860's type White English Bull Terrier was superior to the Original Bull Terrier as a fighting dog, why then did the old time sporting fraternity not abandon the older type to embrace the new Dalmation/English White Terrier/Stafford mix ?....the answer is simple, you cannot mongrelise a strain by crossing to a different breed and expect to consistently produce game dogs. I speak from experience....not armchair theories.

    The idea that a long established game line of combat Bulldogs could be improved by crossing with Terriers may have been acceptable 150 years ago when evolution was a dirty word but it doesnt work in practice.

    The Irish Wheaten Terrier not the show Wheaten is as game as any Terrier, having been bred for the specific task in recent times of meeting big game underground in total silence, often taking terrible punishment. Many times these dogs have been crossed with Staffords in order to improve this inclination to work in silence to the progeny competing in trials in Ireland. Ive bred quie a few litters myself this way, using really game Staffords and Wheatens from Peter Gormans strain which were the very best...of all the pups i produced, i only know of one dog possessing the type of gameness i required of my Staffs. This dog Terry T's Grip went 2:20 and lost game against a local Staff dog of 36lbs. None of the brothers or sisters were game and he didnt sire a single game pup. I think that the Bull breeds were indeed crossed with other dogs to increase the determination of Lord Orfords coursing Greyhounds, to increase the gameness and strength of jaw in Terriers used to hunt, and more recently to increase the poke and agility of the Mastiff breeds to produce the so called Bandog, but never ever to increase the fighting ability of the Pit dog. I must stress that my opinions are based on experience at the sharp end....not from books or pub conversations.

    Another source of amusement is the growing trend of fanciers claiming to own Old-Tyme Staffords. I'd like to know where were all those Old- time dogs 20 years ago, when i was looking for competition for my own Staffords.All show strain Staffords produce some pups which are more rangey than the ornamental favourites of the EKC exhibitors and, when these are passed onto pet homes some get into the hands of those who claim to have remnants of ..secret strains, thats been hidden away since a 100 years ago....others are produced by crossing APBT'S, like the newly recognised Jack Russell Terrier enthusiasts claim to trace their dogs back to the Reverend Jack Russell himself. The mainstream Jack Russell fanciers who hunt their dogs want nothing to do with Kennel Club shows, considering that show Jack Russells were infused with Fox Terrier blood to produce showy-looking tho largely useless dogs.

    One example of the Old Time Stafford that was quoted was CH. Stormer. well to those 'Old Time' Stafford fanciers who are new to the game, i can tell you that this dog was bred from3/4 English Bull bitch ( which was also the mother of Flint a 2 x W and 1 x L) and a pure Stafford called Adam. When Adam was owned by Nibbsey of Belfast he quit in 35 mins. Adam was son of Socks the great badger dog and he was pure show bred being a grandson of the Belfast bred CH Badgerlea Rascal.
    Rickys CH. Psycho another 'Old Time' Stafford was 1/8th English Bull Terrier and double bred on Geronimo, Geronimo wasnt from some obscure strain of secret fighting dogs either...but from show bred lines his grandsire was CH. Brinstock Glenagow.
    The former owners of CH. Stormer the Boneyard boys insist that the best Stafford they ever saw was a son of my old Oscar, a dog called Teddy and that includes GR CH Duke...CH Psycho...CH Stormer. Oscar also produced my own own bitch i named Squaw a 2 x winner. None of these dogs were bred off any mysterious old time strain either as Oscar was sired by CH Rockmere Rip It Up and a Belfast show Stafford. So where where were all those 'old time' Staffords hiding when these dogs were active?

    I must add, that im not championing the cause of show breeding but the simple fact is that the only strains of Staffs that exist today are from KC reg'd stock somewhere along the line or else a cross of these dogs with KC English Bulls ....or more recently with APBT's.

    That is the situation in Ireland, and if someone in Britain is claiming to have 'old time ' Staffs that arnt bred off KC stock, why could none be found to challenge CH. Brock or Dillenger ? both bred down from registered stock. From many of the pedigrees advertised of 'Irish Strain' Staffs its apparent that these donot represent dogs that were ever matched over here, with very few exceptions, but someone is doing very nicely out selling their notion that they were. the fact that top quality dogs are so rarely produced, even when breeding for working ability alone in Stafford, is the reason why many of us have gone over to pure APBT's.50 years of breeding for purely ornamental dogs has flooded the country with inferior dogs, making it all the more difficult to reproduce gameness. When it does crop up its a throw back. Its much easier to produce in Pitbulls which have game dogs scattered more closely in their pedigrees.

    LETS CUT THE bullcrap....Humbug is a product of fantasy and a lack of knowledge with experience.

    Yours in sport....DRIFTER.

    ( Published originally in 1990.)

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