Openhouse kennels and genetically sick dogs

Good day, its been a very long while since i have posted here, or any board for that matter.
4 years ago i imported two dogs from Openhouse kennels, both out of their stud dog Main Event, with the mother for the female being Double Dolly, and the other Cricket. When the dogs arrived, the female out of Double Dolly looked nice and thick, and the male out of cricket looked a bit thin and week for a bulldog, but i thought hey, this guy says he sent me world beaters. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. As time went by, the male would just just not put on weight. He was very active so thought it could just be that, so i upped his food to 2 cups a day. Quite a lot for a 19kg male. His gums were always pale though, and as time went he just consistantly dropped in weight. The feamale, Lola, who was very well built and thick, she died one night mysteriously and after spending a few thousands on autopsy and tests, our vets could not tell us the cause of death. I did not blame anyone for her death as nothing could be proven. After Lola died i decided to breed my Openhouse male as i had spent over R80 000.00 importing these dogs and did not want to loose my investment if tomorrow the male died, so i bred him. Of the litter i got 3 males and 1 female. At 6 months i the young female drooling looking spaced out pushing her head into the corner and seemed as though she had a lock jaw. The 1st thing i thought was rabbis. I took her off to the vet where they managed to stablise, and proceeded to do all the tests they could. Everything from rabbis to babesia, until they concurred the only other thing it could be is PORTOSYSTEMIC SHUNT or liver shunt. Portosystemic shunts (PSS) are vascular anomalies that divert blood from the abdominal viscera to the heart, bypassing the hepatic sinusoids and carrying intestinal absorption products directly to the systemic circulation. Portosystemic shunts can be classified as extrahepatic or intrahepatic, single or multiple, and congenital or acquired. Types of single congenital portovascular anomalies include intrahepatic portocaval shunts (i.e. patent ductus venosus) and extrahepatic portocaval or portal-azygos shunts. In a small percentage of dogs, the prehepatic portal vein is also congenitally absent.
Single intrahepatic and extrahepatic PSS are usually diagnosed in immature animals. No sex predilection is evident. Single intrahepatic PSS are found primarily in large breed dogs such as Irish Wolfhound, Old English sheepdog, Golden and Labrador Retrievers, Samoyed, AND NOW IN OPENHOUSE KENNELS WORLD BEATERS. Its also found in medium-sized breeds such as Australian shepherds and Australian Cattle dogs AND NOW IN OPENHOUSE KENNELS WORLD BEATERS. Single extrahepatic PSS occur primarily in small breed dogs such as the Yorkshire terrier, Schnauzer, poodle, Maltese, Shih Tzu, and dachshund. These shunts may connect the portal vein with the caudal vena cava directly, or may originate from a portal tributary such as the left gastric vein. Congenital shunts are hereditary in Maltese and Irish Wolfhounds and are thought to be hereditary in Yorkies. Multiple extrahepatic PSS occur with chronic increased hepatic portal venous resistance and portal pressure. These shunts are frequently found around the kidneys. Breed predisposition for multiple PSS include the German Shepherd and Doberman pinscher.


I spent R11000.00 on an operation to save my female, who later died 6 months after the op as she relapsed and nothing could be done to save her. The vet then told me that is why your dog is so thin all the time and why he has no colour in his gums. At this time we had already done another breeding with this male that i got from Openhouse, with the new pups on the ground. As the 1st litter reached 18 months the one male started to drastically deteriorate. He was thick and strong and looked like a MaYday dog in every way, then booom, just like that they switch. Within a week he was looking spaced out and had lost a lot of weight. He was extremely dehydrated and i had to make the harsh decision to cull my poor dog, as i could not afford another R11 000.00 operation, that has no guarantees. His father, the world beater from Openhouse had too deteriorated beyond belief, and i too had to put him out of his misery.

Now i was sitting with 2 males from the 1st litter, who i did not know the future of, and the 2nd litter young with the impending doom awaiting them. The 2nd litter of 7 pups is now 1year 4months and this past weekend had to make the harsh decision again to put 4 of them down, as the disease had kicked in and literally over night destroyed them. So of a combined number of pups off my male was 11, with me only having 5 left to work with for now, but even that is a dream as at any point they dogs could shunt.
The breeder denies ever sending sick dogs to me, but i find it hard to believe that i am the only one in the bulldog world that has this problem, or maybe because i only have a handfull of dogs i actually take the time and money to find out why my dogs are getting sick and dying. The breeder gave me a million excuses blaming me for it, but the thing is i have other dogs, from other people, as well as dogs from Southern Kennels that are all living in perfect health, fit and full and like a dog should be.
If any one else is having this problem pls contact me via pm, as im sure there are a lot of people breeding dogs down from MAIN EVENT, CRICKET OR DOUBLE DOLLY, or the parents of them, that will scientifically without a doubt be carrying the same genetic problem.
I was not going to say anything about this, but after sending a mail to the breeder asking if we could make an arrangement for a replacement dog, i was called a crying bitch who talks too much shit, and that he cant be blamed for my failures. I was very thrown back, which made me feel like this guy knows he has this problem, but would rather turn a blind eye, cos who cares if one or two of 300 dogs die right. My question is, why did Main Event die so young. Why did Double Dolly die so young? Answers you will never get.. I guess to them having 300 dogs means the ones that look skinny just die.


Sorry for the rant but im more upset with the fact that i have to shoot my dogs before i can even take them to a show.





What is a liver shunt?
A liver shunt is a blood vessel that carries blood around the liver instead of through it. In some animals a liver shunt is a birth defect ("congenital portosystemic shunt). In others, multiple small shunts ("acquired portosystemic shunts") form because of severe liver disease such as cirrhosis.
Why do congenital shunts develop?
All mammalian fetuses have a large shunt ("ductus venosus") that carries blood quickly through the fetal liver to the heart. Since the mother's liver does the work of filtering out toxins, storing sugar, and producing protein for her unborn babies, liver function is not needed in the fetus. This ductus venosus is supposed to close down shortly before or after birth as the baby's liver begins to work. In some individuals the shunt doesn't close down; it is then called a "Patent Ductus Venosus", or an intrahepatic shunt. In other animals, a blood vessel outside of the liver develops abnormally and remains open after the ductus venosus closes. This is called a congenital extrahepatic shunt.
Why do animals with shunts have problems?
In the normal animal, food and other ingested materials are broken down or digested in the intestines and absorbed into the portal blood stream, where they are carried to the liver. The liver stores some of the food for energy, processes some of it into safe chemicals, and uses some of it to make proteins and other substances. Because the blood bypasses the liver in dogs with shunts, toxins may build up in the bloodstream or kidneys. Additionally, the animal lacks the necessary materials to give it a ready source of energy and to help it grow.
What are the clinical signs of a liver shunt?
Clinical signs are often seen at a young age and include small stature, poor muscle development, behavioral abnormalities (circling, disorientation, unresponsiveness, staring into space, head pressing), seizures, and quiet demeanor. Other less common signs include drinking or urinating too much, apparent blindness, diarrhea, and vomiting. In some animals the signs are associated with eating protein. Other animals are diagnosied when they take a long time recovering from anesthestics (i.e. barbiturates) or sedatives (i.e. acepromazine). Some animals show no signs until they are older, when they develop bladder and kidney infections and stones.
What breeds are commonly affected with shunts?
Small breed dogs tend to have shunts that form outside of the liver ("extrahepatic"). In the United States, Yorkshire terriers have almost a 36 times greater risk of developing shunts than all other breeds combined. Extrahepatic shunts can be seen in any small breed but are also reported commonly in schnauzers, Maltese, dachshunds, Jack Russell terriers, Shih Tzu, Lhasa apso, Cairn terriers, and poodles. Large breed dogs tend to retain the fetal liver shunt (patent ductus venosus), or "intrahepatic" shunts. In the Netherlands, about 2% of Irish Wolfhounds are born with intrahepatic shunts. Intrahepatic shunts can be seen in any large breed dog and have been reported in some small breed dogs (especially poodles); in the United States, we see them most often in Labrador retrievers. Australian shepherds, Australian cattle dogs, Samoyeds, and Old English sheepdogs are also commonly reported.
Are shunts hereditary?
A disease is likely to be hereditary if it occurs more commonly in one breed than others; if it occurs in a family of dogs; or if it or a closely related disease is proven hereditary in other breeds or species. Liver shunts are considered hereditary in Irish wolfhounds, Cocker spaniels, Maltese, and Yorkshire terriers, and are probably hereditary in several other breeds. The affected dog should be castrated or spayed and, because the mode of inheritance is not known, it is best to avoid breeding the parents.
How is a shunt diagnosed?
On blood work, dogs with congenital liver shunts usually have low blood urea nitrogen (BUN) and albumin concentrations. They may be slightly anemic or have red blood cells that are smaller than normal ("microcytosis"). They also may have increases in liver enzymes ("AST", "ALT"). Their urine may be dilute or infected and contain small spiky crystals ("ammonium biurate"). None of these laboratory changes are specific for a liver shunt; however, when veterinarians see these abnormalities, they will usually measure bile acid or ammonia concentrations to evaluate liver function. A liver shunt cannot be definitively diagnosed by blood work; shunting can only be found with advanced techniques such as scintigraphy, ultrasound, portography, Cat scan ("CT"), MRI, or exploratory surgery.

 

before


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then with shunt






his sons ..

this dog was strong and thick and looked like barracuda


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this dog was acting great then bam!!..



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this doggy off him so far is ok as are the following pics



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the mom



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i can post pictures of all my other dogs that are not off this openhouse dog and show that they are all in good health. i have proof of vet bills, diagnosis and operation costs that this breeder refuses to acknowledge.. do a bile acid test if you have a dog off any i mentioned.. if you have the balls, genetically this problem is alive in bulldogs too

 

Only problem is that shunts are something a dog is born with, not something that develops over time... it makes no sense that a dog would "get a shunt" later in life. Story fits for the young, neurologic female, but not the rest of them. Not saying they didn't have something else genetic going on, but it wasn't a shunt.

 

My vet informed me that in medium to larger breeds the shunt can take up to 4 years before it affects the dogs. I have spent many thousands of rands trying to find other reasons, but there is nothing else we can find. Every single one of my other dogs are perfectly fine. Frisco/ELI/Bolio dog, fine, inbred Stonewall/tramp bitch, perfectly fine, RBJBT/Eli, fine, scatter bred Hawley dog (sa scrap), fine, 2 other RBJBT dogs, both fine and pups off them all ok. What else could it be? I am really open to suggestions and opinions. We have tested the grounds, the water, removed all harmful bushes etc. I noticed some, they look kinda scrawney from birth, and i gave them some time, but then when i see its not right, i cull. The lack mask buckskin male that is skinny on the pics only started showing a few months before, with his hip bones and spine starting to show.. he sustains for a couple months then bam, it hits hard they litterally fade in front of your eyes. I have learned in these dogs now to see it early as well as the eyes give a lot away. They seem so distant and almost brain damaged over night. Its crazy. The skinny black mask buck skin dog was thick and strong and on raring to pull any weight you put on him. I have become scared of getting my hopes up on the remaining litter mates, as you see they look in good nick. All carrying some meat on them.

 

it sure does suck they wont replace the dog. after you showed the vet bills and got all that info. next time when you buy dogs from folks that you dont know get yourself a grown dog and bypass the bullshit.

 

Yes i bought the dogs as puppys. Ipaid twice for the regulation tests to be done as the 1st time was not done according to time frames set by the South African Agricultural department. It was out of my hands to do the tests and informed the breeder of the time frames for shipping. The tests were not done in the time and then to further the process Delta airlines put an embargo on all flights with live animals as it was too hot. So i waited for the season to pass and paid again for the tests as well as the additional boarding and feed fee which was as reasonable as if the dog were here. I paid again for the tests and bought the tickets and the dogs were sent. when i opened the crates at the airport i was like an excited young kid. The feale was beautiful, and the male i noticed was a little thin but as you see him in the before pics. I still consider than thin. When i got home i let them out to sniff around, and i noticed the males belly looked very pale and his gums were pale too.. but he was active as hell.
But yes Ben I agree with you. You learn from your mistakes

 

That sucks if dogs were sent sick they should b replaced. But why would u breed a sick a dog? Yis Ole Man

 

We had done the breedings before we knew that he was sick, we just always thought that he was a naturally lean energetic dog

 

Either way something was off with them. I know its hard but cull the rest and cut your losses now, even the healthly will pass that along. Not to.much else can be done a lesson learned. Best of luck.

 

Man I'm so sorry. That truly sucks for you and the poor dogs.

 

this is the best and most logical advise. You don't want to pass this on to another generation. Sorry!

 

always wonderd what happened to these dogs .sounds like you got fukked

 

Yes i am considering culling the remaining ones this weekend, but it is extremely hard as they look really good and act great. They are my kids, its the hardest thing i have had to do in my life as these dogs are loosing before they even getting a chance. Its different when a dog stops, but when they so young and getting sick just as they come of age is heart breaking. But i did not write this for pity, i wrote and showed pictures because i am not the only one with this problem, and want people to know this disease is alive in bulldogs.
@ zoltan, yes they had very high expectations when they came in, but all this breeder did was put me back 5 years.

 

Wow this is truly upsetting just looking at them I am sorry you are faced with this issue. I love the RJBT dogs and your first before pic of the male looks identical to my male they are bred from the same families but I didn't get my dogs from OHK. I agree with the culling thats not something you want being passed along to the offspring you can't change what happened but you can sure prevent it from continuing on your yard. Sending positive thoughts your way I know how it is to love the dogs like they are your kids and I wouldn't want to be faced with having to put them down. But for something like this you really have no choice and you would be doing the right thing.

 

I feel your pain OSK. Culling, even when you know it's the right thing to do is extremely difficult. At least it is for me, and I am sure for many others as well.
And looking back I am sure you can see that breeding that unproven male was probably not the wisest decision you have ever made. And most likely one you will never repeat again.
And even though this situation, as tragic as it is, is just another reminder that you NEVER breed a dog on papers alone. And with the disorder that dog had it would not have past any ones standard as a stud.
I wish you good fortune in the future.

 

Probably the best advise I have read regarding this issue.. I saw their ad (Openhouse) on the back of the Gazette and the fact that the had an advertisement but did not offer any stud service or pups for sale told me that they either sell prospects only, or are just awful proud of their stock. I thought that was pretty snotty, like who gives a fuck enough to actually contact O.H. just to hear him toot his own horn.. I swear to god, these magazine bulldog people (SDJ), I think they ruined the game, worrying about the titles and notoriety instead of keeping this shit a SECRET, .... but that's another thread..

Now that this is out in the open (no pun intended) I would venture to put the remaining dog's DNA on file to establish the genetic source of the disease to compare and contrast against your new stock, if that type of thing is possible.. At least you can help others prevent the same mistake of buying a dog from another continent, or from parents you never saw in person..

 

Well, there's a BIG red flag, IMO. Why on EARTH would you purchase
from someone that has 300 dogs? With THAT many, you get a few good ones and the hell with the rest of them....that's what I read when someone has that many.....

 

@ Dayair, like i said when they came in he was not on deaths door. We looked at him and that day B say, i like that dog. I lost my female and did the breeding to secure my investment. I figured genetically he has amazing dogs behind him and my Ali/Sofia bitch is true. So i did the breeding with the idea that i should get 1 good one at least. None of these dogs ever left my yard! @ Tiznow i do not believe this breeder had the magnitude of dogs then he does now, as he was bragging this in an email this week, which made me think, that a few sick in 300, who would bother to check? You have another 200 plus to work with. I did enough research i felt before the dogs came over and was confident in my purchase. I spoke to a very close friend this week and after all your replies have decided to put the remainig dogs down.

 

Breeding a dog, unproven or not is always a gamble. Performance doesn't equal production so breeding an unproven dog is his decision and at the time he has every right in doing so. A nice ped might be more of a indicator of a producer than performance so please don't knock his decision. It's easy to do, facts in hand, but when he did the breeding everything was good and probably did what would have been best for his yard and his investment.

It hurts me to see these dogs and i wish you the best of luck with this issue. Hope you'll be refunded and get your dogs replaced.

 

Well damn,ain't that bout a bitch