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Hello! New game-dog enthusiast, brief intro

Discussion in 'Introductions' started by The Lionheart, Jan 2, 2017.

  1. Hello, game-dog world. I have zero experience with the APBT, but recently fell into the rabbit hole of its true history. It is quite fascinating, and I've become somewhat obsessed with learning more. So, I find myself here! I hope to sate my interests. But before I do that, let me first introduce myself.

    In August of 2016, my boxer Mars died. He was truly my best friend, my partner in life. It's been very difficult to get over, but I really don't think I ever will get over the loss. I am really sick of being depressed about it, though, and I simply have to move on at this point. So, I want to dive in, over my head, with a new dog experience. That's how it was with Mars.

    I've always had dogs, but buying my first pure-bred dog was something completely new to me. Bringing home a baby boxer was quite the learning experience. I truly had to step up my understanding of what it means to be a leader for a dog with that level of requirements. Still, Mars was just a companion, a pet. I want to take my man-dog journey to yet another level. So, I started looking into the working/sporting relationship between man and dog. During my research, I stumbled upon Dogumentary TV's conversation with Richard Stratton. This absolutely fascinated me.

    I have always wondered how there is so much disparity between pit bulls. I have seen the world-famous Hulk. I have seen pits that seemed perfectly proportioned and statured, but weigh over 100 lbs. I have seen the American Bully in all its shapes and sizes. It's like, what the hell is going on? What exactly is an American Pit-Bull Terrier? Everyone seems to have their own idea, but what seems to me to be its true form is this 40-lb game-bred dog. The history and tenacity of this dog are fascinating to me, as I've said.

    I think this is the next leg of my personal journey with dogs, as I really want to take my ownership to the next level. What I mean by that is I think I'd like to try goal-oriented training, taking that gameness and applying it to the world of dog sports. This, of course, would include breeding to uphold the standard... But I'm still not entirely sure what that standard is, since it apparently has a variety of meanings to different people. I've been looking at breeders, but I still consistently find dogs in the 50-60 lb range. This is within the kennel clubs' standards, but it doesn't mean they are true game-bred dogs. And it is that gameness (and applying it constructively) which interests me so much.

    So, after this long-winded intro, I would appreciate it if any members happy to join my personal discovery would point me in the right directions. I am now going to jump into the archives here, but a stream-lined approach would help, haha. I want to know what a game-bred dog is, what it means to be a responsible game dog leader, and how to go about finding my game dogs!

    Thank you so much for taking some time to read all of this. CHEERS!
     
    niko likes this.
  2. Box Bulldog

    Box Bulldog Top Dog

    Pit bulldogs in my books are 25-50lb female 30-60lb male. In good shape give or take a few pounds. The smaller the better as far as I am concerned. Wish you the best of luck in finding a good dog.
     
    niko likes this.
  3. Box Bulldog

    Box Bulldog Top Dog

    Oh and that hulk dog you speak of is nothing but a French Mastiff with its ears cropped.
     
  4. Yeah, I assumed he couldn't possibly be an APBT. This is sorta what I was referring to. Where/when is the line drawn? He's a beautiful dog in his own right, but not what I'm looking for.

    I think I agree with what you said about 'the smaller, the better.' That's what I like.
     
    Box Bulldog likes this.
  5. bamaman

    bamaman GRCH Dog

    A simple pedigree tells the difference it shows the dogs he or she is down from.Without a pedigree it's impossible to know.Even with a pedigree showing he or she to be from game dogs it still doesn't mean this particular dog will meet the high standards of being called a Bulldog.
     
    niko and bluedoglover like this.
  6. AGK

    AGK Super duper pooper scooper Administrator

    Welcome.
     
    niko likes this.
  7. By this, do you mean the gameness of an individual dog? Like, a champion fighter producing poor fighters? What are the high standards of a bulldog? In that Stratton interview, he repeatedly referred to them as bulldogs. This refers to their gameness, and not necessarily their pedigree? This is all very interesting.

    And thank you for the welcomes.
     
  8. bamaman

    bamaman GRCH Dog

    I think you need to do some more research and find yourself a mentor .This site has a lot of good info on it.Thier is a lot to it.Not as simple as it sounds but yes gameness is a quality a Bulldog should have.
     
    Box Bulldog likes this.
  9. Box Bulldog

    Box Bulldog Top Dog

    You could breed two great pit bulldogs that doesn't mean every pup is going to grow up to be dead game. Your odds are better though than a scatter bred dog. For your purposes unless you plan to [ ] your dog most dogs from half decent lines/breedings would be more than enough dog.
     
  10. Yes, definitely. I'm really not sure how I'd go about finding a mentor, but that would be great. I will look into that (and also what that means lol).

    Maybe this sounds naive to experienced keepers, maybe too ambitious, but I would I like to ultimately breed out my ideal dog, in a perfect world. I don't even have an ideal dog yet, and I'm gonna continue researching for the next few months, but it's all planning ahead to get to that point. It seems to me that, if you're going to breed, maintaining the integrity of the game dogs is of the utmost importance. Like I said, maybe that's naive. Idk.
     
  11. Box Bulldog

    Box Bulldog Top Dog

    You have to learn to crawl before you learn to run.
     
    bamaman likes this.
  12. lol Yeah. I appreciate the reality checks, and there are a lot from what I see in other threads, but I'm gonna keep jumping in with my ignorant questions because I'm excited about the prospects. It's either gonna discourage me completely, or just encourage me even more.
     
  13. So, I've been doing a lot of reading since yesterday, and it occurred to me... this is a real fuckin game-dog forum. lol Not sure what else I expected.
     
  14. tattooit

    tattooit Pup

    Here is the best advice I can give someone just discovering the gamebred APBT.

    The romanticizing is and always has been FAR different than the realites of the game. This is true now more than ever.

    Read the stories of the glory days gone by and enjoy them. But do yourself a favor and leave it at that. ESPECIALLY if you live in the US.

    The only way to test true gameness in these dogs is via fighting them. Since this is a felony of the worst kind in this day and age, I advise that you not ever partake in it unless you're willing to risk your freedom and life as you know it. Simply put, it's just not worth it. You unfortunately discovered the breed about 15-20yrs too late IMHO.

    Even before the Vick/Tant/SDJ busts, it was extremely difficult to penetrate the inner circle of reputable dogmen and earn trust. Now I'd imagine, it'd be damn close to impossible.

    So unless your participating interests begin and end with confirmation and/or legal sporting activities (none of which will ever test true gameness), then I implore you to continue to enjoy the stories of yesteryear and have your pets spayed or neutered.
     
  15. That's very direct, and I respect that. Thank you.

    When all that shit with Vick happened, I can clearly remember thinking that it was unconscionable, unforgivable, and that they should has him. Now it seems like a long time since then.

    When I watched the interview with Richard Stratton, it forced me to reexamine everything I thought I knew about dog fighting. My feeling now is that, whether or not it is right or wrong, a game-bred dog is never truly fulfilled until it's fought in the pit. They were bred specifically for that purpose, and to pretend that it's anything different is foolish. That is how a game dog comes alive.

    I reserve judgment now. I trust my own instincts more than anyone else's, and I would have to actually experience it for myself to judge whether or not it is cruel. Having said that, I will NOT do that for two reasons:

    1.) From the best that I can tell, the vast majority of the good dogmen have left the sport. It's now overrun with psychopathic thug try-hards. If There was ever any honor in it, it's certainly gone now. There is absolutely no part of me that wants anything to do with that. It disgusts me, to be frank. It's destructive to the legacy of the breed to be in the hands of trash, which brings me to my second reason.

    2.) The legacy and future of this breed are in jeopardy, and it's not only because of the irresponsible losers. The mass news media would prefer to create hysteria, and demonize the breed, rather than address the real problems, and work to fix them. There needs to be some progression to counteract the movement against the breed. Like I said, if we can redirect the qualities and traits of this breed into something more constructive to the modern world, then good, misinformed people can also get on board.

    So, I appreciate you putting it into perspective like that. Hell no I don't want to risk my freedom. But, I don't think I have to do that in order to have a mutually beneficial relationship with the game-bred APBT.

    I don't think the dog fighting will ever go away. Whether that is right or wrong, it's probably a good thing. Otherwise, the breed would cease to be the American PIT BULL Terrier that is so beloved.
     
    Box Bulldog and tattooit like this.
  16. tattooit

    tattooit Pup

    You sound like you have a very good head on your shoulders and a very accurate survey of the current landscape in the states.

    The true APBTs fate now lies in the hands of the dogmen overseas. And there are some really good ones. Let's hope they can do their part now in the drivers seat and keep the breed we know and love alive and thriving.

    The good old days weren't always good, but the best dogmen sure were.
     
    The Lionheart likes this.

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