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Don Mayfield’s Keep (Part 1)

Discussion in 'Training & Behavior' started by Stratman, May 18, 2016.

  1. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    Every dog is worked different. No two days are a like and no two dogs are a like.

    Now if someone has a written keep and performs that written keep to the "T" then two dogs can be worked a like but they will not be in equal condition.

    Dog A's keep can never be repeated on Dog B. Just can't happen.


    Thunder98 and O.S.O. NAS like this.
  2. O.S.O. NAS

    O.S.O. NAS Big Dog

    You can see why Some don't and some won't and it's not the dog yet by some posts it's the ones behind them that are why they aren't winning their 6th 7h or 8th ribbon. The difference Is within what We allow Ourselves to see as well as what we ignore. Who becomes Is A High percentage of Our own doing or lack of.
  3. old goat

    old goat CH Dog

    Sorry Slim I'm not buying that either . Maybe it's just me but I think all dogs without being black and in the heat and with no health problems better work the same . And for damn sure they're going to be in equal condition if you know what your doing or you shouldn't be doing it or learning how to do it .
    Stratman likes this.
  4. O.S.O. NAS

    O.S.O. NAS Big Dog

    So now we favor black cause of its coat n the heat??? Really. Yet All others must be the same ? Whatever works for your dogs as Ours aren't favored or treated differently cause of such but cause each is different as is each show they get ready for a Student continues to learn til they are dead and gone. But hey no one has to buy he other ones ways.
  5. c_note

    c_note CH Dog

    He's saying black dogs overheat quicker in the heat. That being the case, they should be worked different.
  6. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    They are far too individualistic for two to be the same. Two can be in great condition to the point one is satisfied that they were worked correctly. There will always be two different routes to get there. Two different dogs will be in two different levels of conditioning on the same day of the keep. Nothing is identical and nothing is cookie cutter, or at least is should not be.

    US1's Chloe (Patrick's Kasai X Fat Bill's Miss Two Eyes) had zero work ethic. She would not walk, she would not pull chains, run a mill, tag with a bike, absolutely nothing. Zero work ethic. She had a 14 ft. 5/8th" log chain, a two pound weighted collar, a 10 year old Australian Shepherd, a 5-gallon bucket of rocks and a guy to throw the rocks. Throw a rock for the Australian Shepherd, she sprints after it and Chloe sprints after her. Continual sprints, four or five days a week for 8 weeks.

    The Australian Shepherd was in great shape. She ran free running sprints 20-25 yards per day. Chloe ran sprints app. 25 foot long. She drug the chain and carried the collar. She would not work but she would chase another dog. She ended up after 8 weeks in superior condition.

    In superior condition she travelled six hours to the north, ran into one of the un-beatables, into a camp with a 13 game win streak. A camp that is well known with well known dogs. At 61 minutes Chloe was on all fours like it was minute 1. Super condition.

    My point is I am willing to bet no one else had used a 5 gallon bucket and a 10 year old cattle dog to shape their bulldog.

    Dog A may run the mill at 10MPH (just numbers). Dog B may run it at 12MPH. Basic math says one dog will have to run it a little longer to put in the same work as the other. Dog B may be a 43 and Dog A may be a 51, or vice versa, or any other combination. No two dogs will run a mill the same.

    And there is no way to say on May 25th that any dog will need "X" amount of minutes on a mill on Day 30 on June 25th during the keep. Dog A may need "X" amount of work on Day 30 and Dog B may need "XX" amount, or even "1/2 of X" amount of work.

    If a person says a dog will get this amount of work on Day 30 because all things are the same then he is selling himself, as well as selling his dogs, short.

    It simply can't be done.

    tomjones2, 305APBT and Thunder98 like this.
  7. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    As far as a black dog in the heat. Why is there a difference? Does the black dog get a waiver for coat color in mid July?
    Do the light buck skin dogs get a pass in the winter because if black dogs collect heat in the summer that should be an advantage in the winter?

    For no more reason than personal preference, I like black dogs. Always have. Their coat color has never played a role in my decision making. If an opportunity presented itself in mid-July, it was an opportunity.

    All dogs will succumb to heat, regardless of coat color, because they are DIFFERENT, and they can work at different levels for different reasons at any given point in time.

    I am sort of confused how things are different if they are black, but the same if they are another color, or it happens to be a certain temperature. There so many variables in getting a dog to condition that there is no way for two dogs to be the same at any given point in time. They may end up at the same place but they will have to take different routes to get there. If they take different routes they will be different. Not the same.

  8. old goat

    old goat CH Dog

    YOUR FUNNY . In the sun a black dog will heat up so you better get them out of it . Is that simpler for you ? It's not to hard to tell what one knows if you just listen . I still haven't gotten a good answer on why you work them different .
  9. old goat

    old goat CH Dog

    What your saying is you had to find a way to work the bitch . Yes your right some just won't work and you find what will work . But other than that I'm still not buying it . Maybe there is a reason why I'm not . Everyone does things different . But you can work just about all dogs the same if you know what your doing . Nothing changes . Maybe the amount of weight pulled but not much .

    SOULDOG Top Dog

    I sat down a while back with a guy that lived with Rod at a time . He still has Alligator/Nigger dogs ... It sounds like Rod was at a dark point of life. My old camp owned Mayfields Brasken and Batendorfs Odessa
  11. old goat

    old goat CH Dog

  12. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    Tell us abut two dogs you have experienced that were worked the same, down to the same number of days, the same amount of time per session.

    Personally I can't do that. All of them are different and have to be read not only on a daily basis but from exertion to exertion. One dog may be ready to rest an hour in today and the next dog may go two hours. If you force the extra hour on the first dog there will be nothing in the tank at the end.

    Ch. Charlie 4XW (Mim's Spiffy X Mim's Lucky) ran his chain spot like a jenny. His 14ft log chain was pulled tight and he sprinted for hours every day. The only way to stop him from running the chain was to finish feeding, watering and raking. This dog was a couple of dumps away from superior conditioning most every day of his life. His first was as a replacement with two weeks of weight/feed adjustment. He won over Hargrove's CH (4XW) Ideal in :45.

    His sister Polly 2XW would not work in a pie factory. When put in the water she pretty much chose to drown vs. swimming. Every day for six weeks she decided to swim just before she drowned.

    US1's ABU (Virgil/Mayday/RBJ) bred male would work any thing put in front of him. He had an incredible work ethic. Actually had to dial him back in or he would over exert himself. He had no stop in him.

    US1/Purepower's CH 4XW Skull was as lazy as all get out on the chain. He would spin the wheels off of a mill but had zero interest in chain activity. Slept the entire time in between work sessions.

    Four dogs who ended up in excellent condition and had great successes on a series of Saturday nights. Charlie was black and his 1st was in mid-July. 80 degrees. Polly was black. She had as much natural air as any dog ever. She could pretty much breathe underwater. She picked one up in early September. Abu was a Buckskin male. Skull was a brindle and white dog. Won two in the summer and two in the winter.

    4 really good dogs, all four in really great condition. Yet all four were night and day in every aspect of the dogs.

    They simply are not the same.


    ELIAS'PISTOLA and Thunder98 like this.
  13. old goat

    old goat CH Dog

    Sounds like most of these dogs wouldn't work a mill so you had to find a way to do it . I said this earlier . Maybe your not understanding what I mean . That is get the same time in moving their legs to get air or pull weight . Them black dogs don't do to good in 95+ and high humidity . Sure they can do it but better to work out of the sun . A 25 can work just like a 45 . The reason I say this is I know they can and will if there is no health problem . You may have to teach them to run some other way but they will get the same time around here .
  14. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    "getting the same time" is the part I think is why every dog is different. If there is a certain time achieved not every dog will achieve that 'time' in the same way. One dog may get there in a shorter period, the next dog may take longer. That is what I am saying in no two dogs can be worked a like. Granted they both may be slat mill dogs or carpet mill dogs, or whatever dogs but no two of them will progress the at the exact same rate.

    That is the difference I am talking about. If two dogs start today there is no way to tell what those dogs will need ten days from now, of at the 7 week mark. Simply can't be done.

    If Dog B is conditioned exactly the same as Dog A no matter how well Dog A turned out, Dog B will be one of three things. Over worked, under worked or spot on. Bu the odds of Dog B being spot on is slim to none. And as the old folks say, "Slim just keft".


    bamaman likes this.


    If sombody told me they are peaking a thirty pound dog the same as a fifty pounder It would be smart to bet against that dog on mere conditioning,,,
    if that thirty pound dog was freak and could handle a heavier keep,,, than it would be a dumb bet...lol...
  16. old goat

    old goat CH Dog

    Damn Slim you can tell me all you want but I know it can and is done . You just need to know how to do it . It's and old Carver keep . What I call peaking is party time not working time . I don't know what you call it elias but they can do the same keep if you know what your doing on matter the size . you can pull the same but the rest is . Everyone has their way but Carver would use it and i'm sure others .


    I tell you there is no set written keep that will bring your dog into the best condition possible with out tailoring to the dog,,,
    from food and supplements to the amount of time worked that breaks the dog and their tongue curls,,,
    that would be the beginning of the keep and I agree about a week after the dog peaks they should be ready,,,
    thats if you read your dogs excursion and catered to not peaking them in maximum peak condition...

    Now I will be the first to say I am not a conditioner by no means but spent many of hours talking to my buddy
    Dirty while he was working dogs he would share me his theories as I asked way too many questions...

    He first studied under bo wellls who learned from mayfield and bo also ran with bobby hall whom was carvers understudy,,,
    Dirty also learned bonnes juice keep from carolina kennels as well as some more modern holistic keeps from others...

    One thing he told me about boones keep was boone intentionally wrote the one recipe that would work best
    but left out all the secrets from the amount of j given to the dog to the amount of work...

    I respect your thoughts Old Goat on Carvers keep but I would have to say boones keep
    has got more dogs in the fast lane than any other today but I am sure there is some good and bad in booth...

    We can all agree to disagree and i enjoy the exchange...

    Slim seems to have that individual tailored understanding that my buddy dirty shared with me...

    Good weekend to remember the vets human and bulldogs alike,,,
    rest in peace to my buddy dirty as eight years with out him doesnt get easier as I catch myself coming here to all of you to supplement our relationship,,, he is truly missed by all that knew him...
  18. Saiyagin

    Saiyagin Chihuahua Premium Member

    Its so ironic how he admits the truth now after all my post of trying to expose him was all ERASED. LMAO...If I had not exposed him for what he is he wouldnt of told yawl the TRUTH and most likely would of fooled some people (especially the newbies/greenhorns) into thinking he is the Mayfield "MASTER", conditioner. LMAO...smdh what a shame this world is full of LIES and COVER UPS.

    Ive never noticed him use the word TAILOR, until now, hhmmmmm I wonder where he got that from? (emll? or slat/carpet?) LMAO
  19. old goat

    old goat CH Dog

    39 years tells me you can do it elias and your going to tell me it can't lol
  20. niko

    niko CH Dog

    I'm no dog conditioning expert but I've worked with a lot of human athletes.No athlete is the same,I know this from countless examples of Athletes I've put on weight and plyo programs.None of them get the exact same results.Just doesn't happen

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