breeding / gameness

couldn agree more i been around game dogs and game birds all my life and have seen people that didn know what they was doing with a animal ruin it about as fast he gets it

 

I was taught to breed for gameness and out cross for mouth. Its worked for me so far.

 

I have read all the comments very carefully. Allow me to weigh in with the boys, so to speak as I am a lady. An older lady at that.
Just MHO of course but:

No, you cannot teach Gameness.
Yes, you can LESSEN Gameness in the wrong hands.
No, I don't think you can make a God given cur a Deep Game dog no matter what you do. BUT...
My game dog until the 2 hr mark might be your game dog until the 3 hr mark. ALOT can happen in an hour you know.
Winners are made and unmade in MUCH less time than that.
That is where conditioning and the keep and the bond with the animal all ties in.
The natural God given constitution of the animal will shine through, but the handler puts the POLISH on it.
My opinion only is that yes, a human can make any dog quit under the right or maybe I will say wrong circumstances.
Again, just my take.

 

I'm with scooter on this one, this is what I have seen over the years.

 

You just put 4 pages of nonsense into 1 paragraph!I give this a score of 5 smiles!!!!

 

I agree with you bama if your dog is game then he is game period. If you or someone else raise him his performance will be different based on conditioning and such but the dog will definitely still have the same level of gameness and drive.

 

Scooter GREAT GREAT post Maw!

 

And you are a bit over sensitive...if a dog is DEAD GAME....did he quit yes!!!!!!! Death STOPPED him. Before you go all indignant listen to what was said.

The dog is game or not, true but there are different degrees of being game, some are more than others.

And you can have a dog that would go till he was dead, but if his conditioning did not support his drive then he would quit due to factors outside of his game.

Handlers are essential to allowing a dog to exert his FULL potential, if not the animal will quit due to failure of his body, not his "heart" or game.....does this make you feel any better :rolleyes:

 

I can understand your logic but I have to disagree with u bro. I have seen plenty of dogs in almost perfect condition stop in 20 or 30 minutes.

But I can remember a dog that came into a match in top condition. The match went 3 1/2 hours. Both dogs were very game but the loser was scratching with 2 broke legs for 45 minutes and was pick up game. So no all dogs wont quit.

 

Well thanks for the civil response...as a competitive body builder I know a thing or two about conditioning. I would say in your scenario, either the dogs were not as conditioned as you thought, there is a balance between muscular and cardiovascular conditioning and you cannot SEE it from the outside, but you can measure it with the correct equipment .... or the dogs were not as game as their opponent. And YES a dog that fails physically, meaning he cannot sustain oxegynated blood to his extremeties or vital organs WILL stop, even if he WANTS to continue...that is science! And it is for this reason I believe they will all quit eventually.....not because of their game JMO



And I am a Bra!

Oh and i love this on game...check it out:
What exactly is "gameness"?
[The following is an exchange that occured on bulldog-l between
Scott Bradwell and Wilf LeBlanc. The passages offset with ">"'s
are questions posed by Wilf.]

http://www.faqs.org/faqs/dogs-faq/breeds/apbt/part2/

 

i agree you cant teach true game, but in the wrong hand you can wreck the spirt of anything, cause thats whats useally humans are good for when it come to people that dont know what they are doing. i feel like in the right hands they will have a fair chance

 

so you want to tell me because a dog was stopped Dead Game, that means he quite???:rolleyes: ok
i really don't understand your logic on that one.
regaurless of a dogs conditioning, if he stayed straight ahead and was killed doing so, he never quite, he was killed.........thus he definately had the heart for the job.

 

We are violently agreeing....but when the body fails the dog must quit....regardless of the heart....so I am taking a more literal interpretation. And I agree in the wrong hands a dogs spirit can be tarnished.

 

This is one of those subjects some people understand, some THINK they understand, and some will NEVER understand LOL

 

I don't think that there are degrees of gameness ,they are game or they are not.it can't be taught nor learned.some of us use the phrase (deep game) that quit after 2 hrs.just to verify us breeding that animal. but he/she still quit.(CUR). some people will breed to that animal because it's better than what they own or has gone the longest distance than what they have.which i don't have a problem with only if you are trying to improve your line and not peddle pups off of.and also there is no way to predict what percentages of gameness that your pups will have from being bred to 2 game offsprings.i've seen litters that the first ones produced 2 gr.ch's and multiple 1 timers.and when that breeding was repeated 1 out of 5 made it only to pull up on it's 3rd. one.gameness can completely skip a generation.and all of those animals were owned by the same knl. and all dogs have mouth some just bite hard when they want too.if you don't believe this, give any of them a ham bone and see what happens to it. KEEP ON SCRATCHING.

 

Being a competitive bodybuilder means you might know a thing or two about dieting but that does not mean you know anything about fighting conditioning. Lifting weights for bodybuilding is completely different from using weights for fight conditioning.

 

Great find.

 

not violently at all mydawg, but i do have to say i do feel a little insulted when someone wants to quote that a dead game dog "quit" and for good reason. reguardless of how much punishment his body took, and it could take no more, he had the heart to proceed and died doing so.
a dead game dog is one that never quit, he died in the box look'n strait ahead, he was not picked up and taken home to die or in any other way was he removed from the situation, then die.

ROSE, also, i will add just because one may have quit, and with that being said, for hear say..he did quit because of poor condition does not mean he is a (CUR). maybe i read you wrong hah,refure to mountain man interview for referance for more explanation.

i don't know, maybe i should stay away from this one:confused: