Any success with Farnam Red Cell for Horses?

It is an OK supplement. But remember it is doses for a 1200lb horse. Most of what you give will be pissed/dumped out.

It was a popular supplement a number of years ago, along with Clovite Horse conditioner. The dogs have not evolved to the point they are of no use but there are better supplements out there.

Plus it must taste like shit because most dogs will eat around it. It has to be hidden in a feed mixture. The Canine Red cell is easier to feed.

S

 

It is hard to just supplement a dog accurately without bloodwork and/or seeing the dog.

Lots of dog foods his the nail on the head. Feeding raw or supplementing with raw food usually is very accurate.

What happens is if a dog is being fed a pretty good diet and not being worked very hard supplements will pretty much pass thru.

Feed a well balance diet, increase the exercise and supplement from there. The body will use the supplements as needed then pass the rest.

Prior to the work starting increase the daily fat content, beef fat/chicken fat. The dogs metabolism will adjust to the fat for energy and the proteins and what not will be used for recovery. When that happens there may not be a need for supplementation.

S

 

I am sure it is a great additive for a horse but at the same time it is designed for a horse.

I remember when it was a staple. Same with the Clovite conditioner. Getting the dose right was always a concern. The dosage is for a 1250lb. horse not a 40lb. dog. Even as a staple it was always hard to get the dose right.

Not everyone does bloodwork/bloodcounts prior, during and near the end of work. Most back off supplements 8-10-12 days out as the work winds down.

Way back in the day it was a good idea to watch a dog's urine. Feed him a good diet and make sure he is plenty hydrated, maybe even wetter that normal on the first week or work. His urine will be clear/slightly yellow. Start the supplementation. Watch the urine. When the slight yellow darkens he is now passing more than he is assimilating.

The Red Cell will change the color as quick as anything. It will only take a couple three days of supplementation and there will be some color.

If the dog is not being worked really hard a raw diet is usually all the dog will need. Cycling the supplements is a good idea.

On TG;s stuff read the ingredients and pick the three or four major ones and buy them separately. Rotate them throughout the week. One it is way cheaper, and with out the dog being pushed to top notch condition it will be more effective.

S

 

I feed mostly RAW with dry food on occasion. I don't supplement unless the dog is being worked.

6-8 weeks prior to work starting I gradually increase the fat content of his diet and the stool let's me know when enough is enough and when too much is too much.

When the work starts the fat is increased a little more and his feed is mixed with a lot of water.

I supplement with recovery in mind. The fats and proteins are there and the performance part is the work being put in each day. I supplement so he can be ready to work tomorrow, and tomorrow and tomorrow.

For me, there is only two reasons to supplement. One the dog is being worked and needs the extra to recover from day to day or two, the dog is being fed a shitty diet and is in need of supplementation.

 

Dogs use fat for energy. Dogs who are fed a high fat diet, over time, burn fat to perform vs. protein. Using fat for energy is a cooler process than using protein or carbs. When the dog is using a high fat diet the increase in protein will be used for recovery.

To get more scientific and I am not a science type guy. Sportvet.com has a great article.

http://www.sportsvet.com/information-pages/a3-feeding-the-canine-athlete/

http://www.mushing.com/articles/content.php?vw=,,,633

The research vet here is also a world class sled dogger.

Granted the work is different and the competition is different. But the principles are pretty much the same. Weeks of sub maximum effort prepare the dogs for a single competition. Understanding the competition is a one night affair vs. a week to ten day affair the prep work is similar.

Maintaining a dog on a semi high fat diet year around and then starting work and upping the fat content the dog will return to good physical shape faster than on a high carb/high protein diet.

What you will see is a dog maintain a healthy weight on less food because fat has a higher caloric count that its protein or carbohydrate counter part.

It takes a dog about 8-10 weeks to acclimate to burning fat. Basically they burn what they eat. It takes time for their bodies to convert over to 'searching' for fat. Once that happens the dog burns fat and the proteins are used for recovery.

Carbs do not do a lot for the dog but I still feed them. Most of my dogs stay outside when worked hard. The carbs keep the gut going during the night. Helps maintain weight as they do not shiver much weight off during the night.

The amount of fat depends on the dog. The maniac worker can go to a higher fat percentage. The solid, steady work not as much. Ch. Lil Man (4XW) was fed around 45% to 50% of his meal was beef fat/chicken fat and a hunk of lard. 40% or so protein and the rest a carb. Always been a fan of twice cooked brown rice with an occasional shot of sweet potatoe. Lil Man was a freak paced worker.

The fine line is that it is total calories is what counts in maintaining weight, the percentages are for performance.

S