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American Bulldogs?

Discussion in 'Dog Discussion' started by teewiggs, Nov 23, 2010.

  1. teewiggs

    teewiggs Pup

    I admit that I don't know much about American Bulldogs, but I just read an interview with John D. Johnson saying the APBT got it's gameness from the American Bulldog. I thought the AB was a relatively new breed of dog compared to the APBT. He says the AB was one of the breeds that made up the APBT. Anyone else hear this or believe it?
  2. SWB

    SWB Pup

    Thats not true at all. The AB comes frome the pitbullterrier. Where did you read this interview?
  3. teewiggs

    teewiggs Pup

    That's what I always thought. The quote that got my attention was "Dr. J.: "Did you ever add American Pit Bull Terrier to increase gameness?"

    John D.: "No. The American Pit Bull Terrier got its gameness in the first place from the American Bulldog."

    Here's the article. http://www.alapahabluebloodbulldogs....ninterview.php


    can't wait to hear the replies to this one......
  5. MCS

    MCS CH Dog

    Well, I been doing some reading on AB's, this is the supposed story. Back in the 1800's true english bulldogs were brought to the colonies. They worked on plantations and farms as catchdogs, cattle dogs, gaurd dogs etc. Fast forward to JDJ's time, He came back from world war 2 and was dissappointed to see these old bulldogs dissappearing. He looked to find the best examples, got hooked up with Scott. Began breeding and they were originally called American Pit Bulldog, later changed the name to not confuse with the APBT. It was first registered in 1970 by the NKC and him and Scott had a falling out about something and JDJ went on to create his new registry. Scott's type aka performance, are the smaller, more athletic and resemble a wide head apbt in the face. It is said that Scott used larger APBTs to aid in creating his more athletic verson. JDJ stuck with the more bulldog/mastiff type body style. There isn't too much written as far as books etc. the info you find is from kennel clubs, breeders, magazine articles. Check out www.realjdjboard.com for some info on the johnson type and 100% johnson. I got me a Johnson type pup, going on six months now. Believe what you will, I don't think they had much affect on the APBT I believe the APBT most certainly came from the UK around after the 1830's already pretty much formed, AB's might have been thrown in later down the line here or there for size but nothing else.
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 23, 2010

    MISSAPBT Top Dog

    Correct me if im wrong but i was bulldog x english white terrier? not American Bulldog

    gamess came from the terrier, this is from a nz pb fancier about a book he has.

    i got an old book here,talking about the black & tan terriers,that were crossed alot with the bulldog,anyway one individual weighed 5lbs!.he fought 50 rats somtimes 80,the rats would weigh up too a pound each.that on a scale to the dog, in their with them,must seem like a huge task!,often a terrier was killed,when he would run out of energy,& find himself with 20 rats in company,then they would start to fight the dog..this is where the sportsmen would bet! on the gameness of the little terrier.i think it would be fair to say that those original terriers contributed alot of gameness,toward the making of the APBT.
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 23, 2010
  7. brindlexpitt

    brindlexpitt Top Dog

    alot of AB fanciers also believe this, because they MISTAKE the old bulldogs as american bulldogs. I will also like to put out there that i know quite a bit of working(PP, SCHH, hog hunting etc) AB breeders, and they say they dont got shit for game. drive, sure.
  8. MCS

    MCS CH Dog

    Agree, with ya there my APBT has thousand times more drive, stamina, wind, focus than a Johnson type or pure Johnson. Scott's type I really cannot comment on.

    Also Twiggs, look at the site you are on, it isn't an American Bulldog website....they believe Alapaha Bluebloods to be a seperate rare breed. They say the size for these are upto 90 pounds. Pure Johnson ABs run 130 to 150's.

    The bulldog people I know don't even want to associate with the APBT or gameness. that is fine by me, keep them far apart because they are for all intents and purposes
  9. Ninety-Nine

    Ninety-Nine Big Dog

    Most of the original American Bulldogs have American Pit Bull Terriers somewhere in their pedigrees so it's the other way around
  10. MCS

    MCS CH Dog

    It depends, if you are reffering to a Scott type, then probably yes. If you refer to a pure Johson then no not at all.
  11. dogman2007

    dogman2007 Big Dog

    american bulldog is a new breed which is created by mr johnson and alan scoot and a few others,but there are old southern white bulldogs that have been around for centurys that were used for all different tasks from dog fighting,bull baiting,hog hunting all types of farm work etc.theses ol southern white are the closet thing or as some claim old tyme bulldogs,some even same that these are the dogs that came from england,in that sense yeh the pitbull came from the old soulthern white bulldog or the old tyme bulldog.thats just some theroy ive heard from a man that has working type american bulldogs.
  12. Ninety-Nine

    Ninety-Nine Big Dog

    Finding pure Sott or pure Johnson type becomes even trickier these days as a lot of breeders are crossing the two calling them Hybrid type.
  13. MCS

    MCS CH Dog

    Agree with you to a point, the Old Southern White is the original they brought over, Johnson took the biggest, and he says in articles he looked for the biggest and bred for the biggest what are Pure Johnson ABs today. Scott took his ABs and threw those to APBTs to gain some of their attributes. And Old Southern Whites had nothing to do with APBTs but APBTs were founded more along the lines of what MISSAPBT has stated.
  14. MCS

    MCS CH Dog

    True, Pure Johnson is 100%....Hybrid is 50% Johnson and 50% Scott....Johnson type(what I have) is a high percentage Johnson, like 70%, 80% etc...and Scott 100% Scott type.

    If you want to really see the diff, look at Konfederate Kennels(Scott) size is 70-90, Something Special or MGK(J-type) size is 90-130 and then Johnson websites(100%) 110 up to 150's
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 23, 2010
  15. shatoe

    shatoe Pup

    I owned a bulldog that was down from scott lines.He was bred by Billy Hines.These dogs were working bulldogs bred to catch wild game.In my opinion they were as close to the old southern whites as you will find (in form and function).There was a bulldog named sgt. rock that was used to start a line of pitbull and bulldog crosses but that was a completely different line.The johnson line was bred more like the modern day English bulldogs (for looks and size).
  16. MCS

    MCS CH Dog

    They have a function....obviously you never seen them do bite work. The Johnson types excel at it. They will gaurd and gaurd well with no real training or encouragement, others here know what I am talking about.
  17. dogman2007

    dogman2007 Big Dog

    my mate has a grandauther of gr ch scotts crusher,shes only 22in and 55lbs fit,looks like a colby dog and works well too with terriers,will try puting sum pics up.
  18. MCS

    MCS CH Dog

    And are you refering to Margentina's Sgt. Rock?....That dog had Johnson's foundation Dick the Bruiser and Scott's foundation bitch Dixie Belle in her. Many of the Hines dogs have him in their peds.....My boy has him back in like the 7th or 8th gen. from MGK's Brahma The Bull
  19. dogman2007

    dogman2007 Big Dog

    johnsons dogs have english bulldog blood in them,they were crossed with a kc bulldog
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 23, 2010
  20. MCS

    MCS CH Dog

    From what I hear from AB breeders is that the Scott's work with other dogs, guessing that is what they intended since they were bred for hunting etc. And Johnson ABs, especially pure Johnson are more dog aggressive, and very dominant with other dogs.

    good looking dog by the way.

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