tom garner

SO!!! has he or has he not produced more winners than anybody you know? Who cares if the papers are hung as long as he putting bulldogs on the ground. How many ch or gr ch have you produced? It's gone take the rest of your life to do half of what he accomplished

 

OK, so this thread has me wondering about the value of registration. I have had AKC dogs, and without registration, you might as well have mutts. But in the case of working dogs, I guess it doesn't matter as much. And whether or not the dog is registered, someone could lie about the pedigree. I assume if you got a dog from Mexico, you would get a pedigree, but the dog wouldn't be registered with any official registry. Being ADBA registered would seem to give credibility, but maybe it's only important for the show ring.

 

Lol, I ain't knocking the guy but when you produce several hundred dogs per year for 30+ years your bound to get a Ch or gr ch here and there. Throw enough shit at a wall and some of it will stick...

 

Basically there is no real value in registering a dog with any registry except for being able to participate in that registries activities/events...Credibility comes from the owner/breeder....ADBA or any other registry for that matter wouldnt know how any dog is bred unless the owner told them how it was bred to begin with LOL....Do you really believe all those AKC papered dogs are legit and bred exactly the way the papers say? LOL There are some people that will pay big money to buy or steal (someone else)registered papers and falsify them for there own personal gain/agenda. We are now living in the times where lying is considered the new NORM. LOL

What is a pedigree? Its a piece of paper with writings on it of ones lineage/family tree, nothing more and nothing less. Too many people get caught up on a fucking piece of PAPER that came from a registry.

Like a old timer once said...why should I pay someone else to tell me something that I already know? LMAO

How about this comedy sketch....A old timer says hea boy this a hand written pedigree from me....boy responds but this aint legit because its not from a registry with them fancy paper work....the old timer said wtf son do you want me to sprinkle some glitter on that paper to make it look legit. LMAO

 

IMO, papers simply once again doesn't make the dog. Everyone knows just how paperwork with these dogs can be manipulated. To me it really doesn't matter as long as I know what's behind the dog. I have to be honest, these dogs can get to be expensive. So, if I purchase a pup for say 600-1000 bucks I need some form of knowledge from a honest breeder if I didn't see them being bred, how exactly are they bred? Ok he tells me i have no papers but I still want 600-1000$ for the pup. Really? Who does that? Now if you want chump change for the none registered dogs then I see no need for papers. With all the money spent and all the work put into the dogs, its hard to let them go for cheap. Especially when some breeders have put their lives on the line for this stuff. If your serious about your hounds, you will make sure they even have proper homes. Some people got a lot into them and want something back. I can't blame Garner for being business minded with his stock. For every 5 people that don't want to spend with Tom theirs always 5 more that will.

 

I understand totally what your saying treezpitz, I have bought pups for a decent amount with no paper work. Its just that when its your turn to breed, you have to explain why ,what ,where and who to the next guy to some degree if you sell one. Now I gotta say it came from so & so that they themselves know nothing about. Not every breeder is known that happens to have good bred dogs. Believe it or not some back yard breeders have good dogs..... The best thing you can do as stated 1000 times. Know the breeder and dogs if you don't need papers. Also depends on what your plans are for the dog. Maybe you don't wanna register the dog period.

 

SO!!! You are correct in that he HAS produced more winners then anyone I know son, Hell I've been to Bulldog Hill a few times and don't know no one come evn close to havin' an operation of that size or for that long.

Well I care, I care very much if the papers are hung if I were getting a dog from someone. Want the chance to breed that dog with others that would make sense to me based on how the one I got is done bred.

No Gr Ch and only 2 Ch that I bred, fed, schooled, brought along, competed with, retired and used them as an in house studs, then beloved house dogs till their ends. Also have had many 1 n 2x'er's through the years. As for what I wrote about my 2 champs, well sir i'm betin that's two more then Tom did as much for.

I'm fine with what I've accomplished son. I've done won and I've done loss. Except for my foundation and an odd stud or gyp used for outs I've bred, fed, schooled and competed with my own. I've never wronged another dogman and the few dogs I've let go over the years were bred as I said they were and I never took a penny for em. Small time by any standards but I am a might proud of my small time.

YIS

 

Just give me the correct pedigree when I pay for my darn pup or just keep it. Cause you tell me its off so & so means nothing. If you can't supply the pedigree keep'em. For every dishonest breeder, there's a honest breeder with the same if not better IMO..

 

do you really think a pretty piece of paper means the dog is bred like it says thunder ? i have no pretty paper but you can bet i know how they are bred .

 

A hand written ped. Works just fine, for me that is. I rather get a pup or dog from a person who only does a breeding when needed, then someone who just breeds to sale pups.

 

I do believe some are real, I believe most are fake. But if I'm gonna spend a fortune on the pup, give me some sort of verification please. Old goat, then you must be a honest man. Good deal. The truth is some of the best dogs I had were paper less. I didn't know anything about them for real, it killed me by not knowing.

 

well i don't have any registered papers on any dog i have . but there is 1 thing i know how they're bred and i keep my papers myself . i don't sale but if your lucky very very lucky haha i may give 1 away every 10 or 20 years .

 

More dogs on the ground mean the quicker he can sort through and get the best why not speed up the process

 

He isnt sorting out anything. Others do it for him and when everything is said and done he'll buy the dog back. I'm not knocking the mans hustle but for every one Ch or GR CH he has produced there's hundreds of curs he produced as well along with the slew of very shy dogs that as soon as people get a pup from him tend to come here looking for help with the issue.. He is a good person to get a dog from when one simply don't know any other source. He isn't doing anything special, he just does it in larger volume than most anyone else does or can. Being a millionaire he can do that. He has produced many winning dogs and there is no denying that but who wouldnt when having 20 litters on the ground any day of the year? ANYONE WOULD lol..... He mass produces dogs for sale, thats what it is, nothing more... Some make the grade, some don't.

 

Shit Bucklover you dug in Ol' Tom's colon deeper then a tick on one of his papered as he pleases hounds, boy it was Frisco with the golden dick not Tom get off it for a while.

 

Buying back the proven stock, seems like a good strategy to maintain a bloodline and elevate it. You don't even put your head on the line and you still can go mainstream and commercial to get the big $.
What about the unknown bitches that are around there? Too much drama on his studs and he can easily hang papers on the dams and noone will ever suspect nothing!
For example, if he wanted to infuse Redboy in his bloodlines, keeping "pedigrees" linebred, why don't do it with his unknown bitches?

 

Perfectly said.