Kennels with Alligator blood

[Bubba]

Has anyone ever gotten something from No Quarter Kennels or from Al-Li Combine?? I been talking to NQK for a bit now about picking up some alligator stuff...
BB

[gator]

Never heard of them but let us know what you find out...Has anyone ever gotten something from No Quarter Kennels or from Al-Li Combine?? I been talking to NQK for a bit now about picking up some alligator stuff...
BB

[KURUPT]

I heard NQK has a dog with babesia on his yard.....NQK has said he has a dog with babesia on his yard...So I wouldn't mess with his dogs..

[BigTex]

so what if he has a dog with babesia?.....not like that stuff will float through the air and infect the other dogs....

[Bubba]

Babesia is a concern and a problem for active dog people, and its a reality. As far as I know, we don't have it on our yard, but I also know thats its possible that I could. If NQK does have it, at least he admits it and doesn't try to hide it. Lots of folks would just act like they do not have it and infect someone elses dogs.
When it comes to breeding, it is not highly likely that a male will pass it in breeding, a female may pass it to some of the pups, none of the pups, or all of the pups.
BB

[BigTex]

good point BBK....i also have a dog with babesia....knowledge is power....and i can say from expierence babesia is bad alright.....but WAYYYYYYY over rated

[Bubba]

good point BBK....i also have a dog with babesia....knowledge is power....and i can say from expierence babesia is bad alright.....but WAYYYYYYY over ratedBut here is the difference...you'll admit you have it, where many won't. Babesia is bad, but not the end of the world... but don't play games and let him infect the rest of your yard...
BB

[AC]

But here is the difference...you'll admit you have it, where many won't. Babesia is bad, but not the end of the world... but don't play games and let him infect the rest of your yard...
BB

True but he was seen posting an ad for a babesia infected stud he was selling. I mean if the dog has it no it isn't the end of the world but don't sell it. Especially as a stud.

[Bubba]

True but he was seen posting an ad for a babesia infected stud he was selling. I mean if the dog has it no it isn't the end of the world but don't sell it. Especially as a stud.It is not likely that a male will pass it in breeding...now of course if something happens and the male hits the female, it can be very likely, but in just breeding, its not as likely for it to be passed. At least he is honest that he has it. As far as I know, we don't have it on our yard, but I'm also know that I could have it and don't know it.
BB

[AC]

It is not likely that a male will pass it in breeding...now of course if something happens and the male hits the female, it can be very likely, but in just breeding, its not as likely for it to be passed. At least he is honest that he has it. As far as I know, we don't have it on our yard, but I'm also know that I could have it and don't know it.
BB
I agree on that part bbk but I still don't agree with selling a dog that can get a relapse of the disease in it's lifetime. Better to be safe than sorry and give the dog away in my opinion but as long as the owner knows the risks then there won't be any ifs ands and buts.

[BigTex]

i wouldnt sell him......but to each their own.....

[Big River Kennels]

HERE IS SOMETHING I READ ON BABESIA, I THINK WE ARE IN FOR A RUDE AWAKENING ON THIS.


http://www.marvistavet.com/assets/images/Babesia_1.gif

Babesia organism
inside a
red blood cell

Most people have never heard of Babesia organisms though they have been causing red blood cell destruction in their canine hosts all over the world. Babesia organisms are spread by ticks and are of particular significance to racing greyhounds and pit bulls. Humans may also become infected. There are over 100 species of Babesia but only a few are
found in the U.S. and are transmissible to dogs. Babesia
canis, the “large” species of Babesia is one, “Babesia gibsoni,”
a smaller Babesia which affects pit bull terriers almost
exclusively is another, and a second but unnamed small Babesia has been identified in California. Babesia species continue to be classified and sub-classified worldwide.

HOW INFECTION HAPPENS AND WHAT HAPPENS NEXT

Infection occurs when a Babesia infected tick bites a dog and releases Babesia sporozoites into the dog’s bloodstream. A tick must feed for 2-3 days to infect a dog with Babesia. The young Babesia organisms attach to red blood cells, eventually penetrating and making a new home for themselves within. Inside the red blood cell, the Babesia divests its outer coating and begins to divide, becoming a new form called a “merozoite” which a new tick may ingest during a blood meal. Infected pregnant dogs can spread Babesia to their unborn puppies and dogs can transmit the organism by biting another dog as well.

Having a parasite inside one’s own red blood cells does not go undetected by one’s immune system. Infected red blood cells are identified and destroyed which kills the Babesia organism but, unfortunately, if many red blood cells are infected this leaves the host with anemia, a lack of red blood cells. Often the host’s immune system will begin destroying the uninfected red cells as well. Symptoms include weakness, jaundice, fever, red or orange colored urine. At least 50% of patients will require blood transfusions.

Making matters worse is the fact that animals seem to get sicker than the degree of anemia would suggest so that there is more to this infection than the actual destruction of red blood cells. The severe inflammation that is associated with this parasitism can be overwhelming and completely separate from the anemia. Platelet counts can drop thus impairing normal blood clotting (especially a problem for Babesia gibsoni). An assortment of neurologic signs of can occur with Babesia infection when parasites sequester inside the central nervous system and generate a more localized focus of inflammation. In severe cases there is a lung injury similar to what people with late stage malaria can experience. The new California Babesia species seem predisposed to creating liver disease.

If the acute symptoms are relatively mild or at least non-lethal, a chronic infection can develop. This is usually without symptoms but the dog may continue to be a source of infection to feeding ticks. Relapses can also occur with stress.

Because Babesia is a tick-borne infection, it is not unusual for infected dogs to have other tick-borne infections such as Ehrlichiosis, Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever, and others. These infections may interact to make each other more severe.

Young dogs tend to be most severely infected, especially. Pit Bull terriers.

DIAGNOSIS OF BABESIOSIS

If one is very lucky, the Babesia organisms can be seen on a blood smear. Babesia canis organisms are tear-shaped and occur in pairs. Other Babesia species have several forms in which they appear. Odds of finding the organism are improved by checking freshly drawn blood taken from a capillary source ( a small cut to an ear, for example) rather than from a blood vessel. If Babesia organisms are found, the patient is definitely infected but they are hard to find so an alternative method of diagnosis is needed.

Antibody testing has been problematic as infected animals may have circulating antibodies long after the organism is gone or may have no antibodies circulating while a few organisms remain hidden inside red blood cells.

The current method of diagnosis involves PCR testing. This is extremely sensitive testing and can distinguish 4 different species of Babesia. While only certain laboratories run this type of testing, this is really the best method of answering the Babesia infection question.

BABESIA TREATMENT

Therapy for Babesia is not a benign under-taking. In fact, if a dog is asymptomatic with Babesia, treatment is not worth the side effects. Further, even with treatment Babesia gibsoni, and probably the other small Babesia species, cannot be fully cleared by any of the drugs listed. Female dogs testing positive for Babesia should not be bred.

Diminazene Aceturate
This drug is not available in the U.S. but in other countries is the most commonly used treatment. A single injection is needed and is best used on Babesia canis. Side effects include: nausea, blood pressure drop, painful injection, seizures, and some fatal reactions.

Imidocarb Dipropionate
This is the only drug approved for Babesiosis in the U.S. A single dose is usually effective for Babesia canis but two given two weeks apart are needed for Babesia gibsoni and the other smaller Babesias. The injection is painful plus causes muscle tremors, drooling, elevated heart rate, shivering, fever, facial swelling, tearing of the eyes, and restlessness. Pre-treatment with an injection of atropine helps palliate these side effects.

Trypan Blue
This medication serves to block the parasite from entering red blood cells and may help minimize the symptoms of the infection. Side effects are minimal and it is given as an IV drip.

Phenamidine Isethionate
This drug is not available in the U.S. but a similar drug, Pentamidine isethionate, is. It is more effective on Babesia canis.

Quinuronium Sulfate
This drug is not available in the U.S. It is similar to malarial treatment. It is given as a series of two injections two days apart generally with marked improvement in the patient by the second injection.

A combination therapy of quinine, azithromycin, atovaquone, and/or clindamycin are promising and may become prominent in the future.

A vaccine is available against Babesia in France but only seems effective against certain strains. Vaccination is 89% effective in France. The best prevention is aimed at tick control.

HUMAN BABESIOSIS

In the U.S. chiefly occurs on the East Coast and along the Great Lakes. Babesia microti is the species that infects humans and is associated with a 5% mortality rate. Treatment is similar to that for malaria: blood transfusion, quinine, and clindamycin. New species of Babesia have been diagnosed in humans in California, Washington State, and Missouri.

For more detail on human infection visit:

http://www.visitmonmouth.com/06270_mcmec/babesia.html (http://www.visitmonmouth.com/06270_mcmec/babesia.html)

[Big River Kennels]

Based on this article that I found, I believe that you should put the animal out of its misery, before it infects you and other dogs in the yard and unborn puppies as well, as the article states "treatment is not worth the side affects"

[Texasbulldogs]

Why in the hell would you put a dog with Babesia down? If you culled your whole yard, would you be any less at risk? Would that mean you would never again have it on your yard? I think NOT!

Babesia has been around for a long time. What do you think Chinaman died from? Ding, ding, ding… that’s right Babesia and a lot of others in that era. Because people were not informed about it like they are/should be today. It is all over the world, the Greyhound racing dogmen have been dealing with it for many years.

Now that it is becoming more prevalent in various canine breeds. Vets and Universities are studying it and sometime in the near future there will be a commonly used vaccine. Just like parvo, or distemper it caused a lot of headaches to dogmen now it is very manageable and easy to treat.

[crossfire]

There is a recent Study done by Dr Birkenhower (sp) that he said over 80% of the dogs treated in a field study with babesia showed no signs of babesia in the dna after treated using the medicines in that study. A guy on the peds online board posted the names of these meds.

[Nitrous]

RodK's dogtown dogs comes from alligator and mayfield, real pure.

[AC]

I'd stay away from rod k unless you know exactly what you want from his yard of dogs.

[Nitrous]

Yea I know

[Big River Kennels]

The disease is like malaria or AIDS, i guess if a person didn't want to put the dogs down, they can just let it infect all the rest of the yard and unborn pups, it is primarily transmitted thru ticks. the first step is to clean the yard with positive tests, then disinfect the yard thru pesticides heavily, the rest of the treatments are not worth the sideaffects, check with the university of oaklahoma. they will concur.

[Big River Kennels]

Why in the hell would you put a dog with Babesia down? If you culled your whole yard, would you be any less at risk? Would that mean you would never again have it on your yard? I think NOT!

Babesia has been around for a long time. What do you think Chinaman died from? Ding, ding, ding… that’s right Babesia and a lot of others in that era. Because people were not informed about it like they are/should be today. It is all over the world, the Greyhound racing dogmen have been dealing with it for many years.

Now that it is becoming more prevalent in various canine breeds. Vets and Universities are studying it and sometime in the near future there will be a commonly used vaccine. Just like parvo, or distemper it caused a lot of headaches to dogmen now it is very manageable and easy to treat.No it would not guarantee that you would not have it again on your yard, just like putting one down for cancer won't stop cancer! Think of the sideaffects that poor dog is going to go thru. Vets concur the side affects are not worth the treatment, all of the meds put two are located outside the USA. France has one but is only 85% effective. The yard has to be disinfected After it is cleaned of positive animals. it is passed primarily by the tick, they are also passed birth, death can be put off but is emminent. your yard has to be pesticided very well and maintained very well, my suggestion is to have gravel on the ground no trees and spray once a week, use shade apperatices versus trees and bushes. if you use diazinon granules in a spreader and then lightly water the area they will stay effective for about a month or so until reapplication is necessary.

[Texasbulldogs]

“No it would not guarantee that you would not have it again on your yard”

Then what was the purpose of killing you dog? I have to worm my dogs monthly, maybe I should just kill them instead? They (intestinal worms) can kill your dog and are also past on to pups. Most of the Babesia meds (Zithromax, Minazene, Berenil, Phenamidine, Antirobe, Doxy, Flagyl, Biaxin) are easily obtained through the mail legally.

“Vets concur the side affects are not worth the treatment”

These so called Vets don’t have years invested in creating a line of dogs. To them it is just another dog. Most of the people they deal with are just your run of the mill pet owners. If I only had a mutt worth close to nothing, I might just follow there advise. But I don’t!

There are many for of Babesia (acute, mild, and chronic). Sometimes it is best to put one down with acute Babesia (hit them like a ton of bricks). Acute Babesia will take a other-wise healthy dog from normal to death’s door in a matter of days.

“it is passed primarily by the tick”

It is also passed from mosquitoes, and biting flies.

[Redtail74]

This thread is getting off topic. Lets please try to stick to the topic at hand here. Thanx.

[Big River Kennels]

whatever you think TBG, whatever.

[GrChPitBitch]

I have a deposit for a pup down at Al-li Combine.... Im waiting for a black and tan to drop.... Hoping for a Sorrells/Hammonds Cross....

Has anyone ever gotten something from No Quarter Kennels or from Al-Li Combine?? I been talking to NQK for a bit now about picking up some alligator stuff...
BB

[cgar]

U Said Nqk. I Dont Know About That Guy Sometimes. He Has Hammonds Dogs Though. U Should Try Mtoa Kennels. I Heard He Had A Bad Dog. And Ali Combine Is Very Good Person I Speak To Her All The Time. Later
Cgar

[sbkz]

What traits are the alligator line known for mouth, ability? just wondering have some nice bred gator dogs crossed with pure bolio bitch.

[TxDogger]

I just don't understand why if you know your dog is infected in the first place.. Why keep it on the yard.. there is no cure and even the best yards have accidents.. It is just a risk I would never be willing to take.. You might as well just go ahead a cull the dog, even if you are open about having it I would definately think twice before getting a dog from their yard.. Just my opinion....

[TxDogger]

wow that was a really old post didn't notice that before i responded to it.... im a dumb as$ just ignore me lol

[KURUPT]

You can try Ntense Kennels they have some good Alligator x Eli dogs

[gsxrated]

I guess u can tell I'm new to the game andI want to know how I can get a GAME breed dog

[lilpitgirl]

there has been so much more research do on this protazole and there is a treatment out there that cures 90% of the dogs treated thats 9 out of 10 dogs
its atovaquone and azithramisine and the dogs are dna tested for a year so I would say that its as close to a cure as you can get Ive treated 3 dogs with babasia and I know that all three are as healthy as horses 2 of the dogs contracted it through contact and one was born with it as far as we can tell (damn had it when she welped the litter) the one born with it never shown any real sighns except she never had a normal heat cycle and her muscle structure was lacking