every seen these?

[TigerStripe15]

while searching for game breeds in my area I came across these guys

yall ever heard of them?

http://www.camelotpitbulls.com/

they look to big to be pitbulls?

[houstonapbt]

"A.) High Prey Drive
B.) Intelligence
C.) Big Head, Muscular Chest and Shoulders"

Am Staff's, perhaps? These are not what I would call APBT. In my eyes they are def. Am Staffs. They're being bred for their size. These dogs are definetely not game dogs. Like it was said in the other thread you created, you should really look into Cane Corsos, Presa Canarios, American Bulldogs, or the "bandogges". Like I asked before, what exactly are you looking to do with your dog?

[TigerStripe15]

no I wasnt showing these thinking of buying one I was seraching for game breeders in my area to show me the ropes before I jump into game dogs like yall advised me to do.

and this site showed up in my search and I thought I should share

[houstonapbt]

no I wasnt showing these thinking of buying one I was seraching for game breeders in my area to show me the ropes before I jump into game dogs like yall advised me to do.

and this site showed up in my search and I thought I should share Thanks for sharing but I think I speak for the majority of this board when I say, this isn't our cup of tea.;)

[TigerStripe15]

the way I see it and correct me if I am wrong. if some one says its a pit but it weights more than 75 pounds its not a pitbull right?

[houstonapbt]

the way I see it and correct me if I am wrong. if some one says its a pit but it weights more than 75 pounds its not a pitbull right?No. If they are not bred for what the pit bull was originally bred for, then they are not pit bulls.;) There are some 75# game bred dogs out there (rocksteady), but most of those dogs you see advertised for JUST their HUGE size are not apbt's, usually have some kind of bigger dog thrown in for size. Which is why a lot of us dislike the bigger dogs that are bred for specifically their size.

[TigerStripe15]

thanks for correnting me

now I know

[JC-Pitbulls]

Those dog's are way to big for me

[SLICK WILLIE]

A dog with a chest that big only leaves room for destruction!

[JC-Pitbulls]

A dog with a chest that big only leaves room for destruction!
I agree, way too much open area

[rocksteady]

yep .. the differences in just a plain old big APBt is this..weight is in proportion to size /height. No exaggerated features .. (like extra wide chests, short legs, lots of wrinkles, flab, extra bulky muscles) granted not every dog is perfect..

and the breeder lol.

Heres a picture of a 90lb game bred APBT. I owned him..to me, he really does look like an Am staff but he wasnt..100% APBT. He came from a litter that was bred a bit to tight but then his daddy was about 90lbs, too.. He doesnt look it in the pic..he was almost 2, about 85 pounds here

[pitty0250]

I belive that I saw there kennels name on a bad breeders list. (I might be mistaken)

[Pluto's Princess]

hee hee hee, they're ugly!

[JEEP]

looks like probably they have a different meaning of gamedogs... i wouldnt waste my money on them or go through them to get any info about gamedogs...

[tiger]

The Camelot Line is old family reds, the old stuff Mr. sidereas started with was real pits I dont know about this new stuff.

[hawk]

The Camelot Line is old family reds, the old stuff Mr. sidereas started with was real pits I dont know about this new stuff.The new stuff is definately not game bred. How far back do you have to go to find the real game bred OFRN? The AKC staff was started with "real" pits back in 1935. Are they "real" pits now, NO!!

[waters]

those are not pits they are ugly beast. i personaly like smaller pits with high energy and lots of game. if i was you i would stay away from those.

[Blitzkrieg]

It should be illegal to breed that many dogs. I also think they need to stop calling dogs like that Pit Bulls. Those are not Pit Bulls. They need to stop confusing people and start calling the dogs what they are, mastiff bulldogs.

[Rockstar]

You said it, Blitz. Camelot, Watchdog, Gotti, Razor's Edge - American Show Mastiff Terriers would be a more suitable name.
"Oh no! Look out! It's Dogzilla!"

[Flawless1]

You said it, Blitz. Camelot, Watchdog, Gotti, Razor's Edge - American Show Mastiff Terriers would be a more suitable name.
"Oh no! Look out! It's Dogzilla!"
You think Watchdog is mixed?

[presacanario]

You know a real good friend of mine breeds "dogs" like those specifically the gotti bloodline and has for awhile. The way they got that dog was by line breeding and inbreeding so far and then did an outcross to some type of bulldog... not sure which one but i will find out. so it would be shorter, chest wider, and weigh more..... if you look around every once in awhile the bulldog trait will come out in one and will "EXACTLY" like a bulldog.....lmao people are so stupid as a whole! the reason mankind first started creating different types of dogs was to do different jobs, have we changed so much that all we care about is a pretty teddy bear?

[LadyRampage]

the reason mankind first started creating different types of dogs was to do different jobs, have we changed so much that all we care about is a pretty teddy bear?
Not sure if I understood your post or not so I thought I'd just come out and ask..

Are you saying you approve of the cross or not? By the statement quoted above I'm under the impression that you think its fine to cross as long as the dog can do the job its intended for... Not trying to bash or anything because I think you've brought up a very interesting point.

[hawk]

Not sure if I understood your post or not so I thought I'd just come out and ask..

Are you saying you approve of the cross or not? By the statement quoted above I'm under the impression that you think its fine to cross as long as the dog can do the job its intended for... Not trying to bash or anything because I think you've brought up a very interesting point.
Not speaking for her but what I think she meant is that man originally starting creating breed for work. Now man is creating different breeds just for companionship. At least that's what I got from the post.

[LadyRampage]

Not speaking for her but what I think she meant is that man originally starting creating breed for work. Now man is creating different breeds just for companionship. At least that's what I got from the post.
Ok.. that makes sense..lol Sometimes it has to be spelled out for me, being blonde an all...lol

[miakoda]

I think all this sh*t breeding is a damn shame. Our forefathers & friends before us spent 100+ yrs selectively breeding & culling to make our APBT of today. For those that have passed on, if they were alive to see what moneyloving, jobless sh*theads are doing to this breed, they would probably go jump off a bridge somewhere & for those who remain with us, they too are fighting an uphill battle w/the TRUE lovers of this breed like most of us here to keep this dog in it's true form & glory. I just don't get it? Yeah, so the english bulldog is cute. But it only lives about 6 yrs, can't walk 30 feet w/out having to rest due to his grossly short & distorted nasal passages & elongated soft palate, has to worry about heat stroke anytime it's over 70 degrees (F), has spinal problems, has hip dysplasia (all e. bulldogs have some degree of it), have eye probs, has elbow probs, has shoulder probs, has skin probs, & cannot usually even breed or give birth naturally yet requires medical intervention to accomplish procreation. Are these the kinds of things we want in our breed? By breeding for midget apbts (you know who you are :mad: ) & these too short, too wide bulldogs (which some need b/c they are too big of p*****s to obtain a decent reputation on their own) these are the problems we are creating for this breed. Is this truly how we should show our "love" for these dogs that have done anything & everything possible to please us & to make us happy w/out concern for their own wellbeing? Is it??!! WE OWE IT TO THIS BREED & TO OUR DOGS TO MAINTAIN THE "STANDARD" & KEEP 'EM HEALTHY SO THEY CAN WORK AS INTENDED TO DOING ALL THE MANY JOBS THEY HAVE PROVEN SO ADAPT TO DOING. BY SELECTIVE BREEDINGS & SELECTIVE CULLINGS WE ARE TRYING TO IMPROVE BUT ALSO MAINTAIN THE BASICS THAT MAKE THIS DOG THE COURAGEOUS CANINE THAT IT IS. THERE IS NO OTHER IN COMPARISON SO IF WE RUIN THIS BREED AS A WHOLE, WE WILL NOT BE ABLE TO FIND ANOTHER BREED THAT COMES CLOSE TO BEING THE APBT OF TODAY!!!!!!!

[mr_rednose]

yea i heard of them actually a guy i used to associate with owns the dog casino on the web site but if you are lookin for a game pit thats not the place u want to contact try doing web searches for certain bloodlines to shrink your search

[The Watcher]

I think all this sh*t breeding is a damn shame. Our forefathers & ...friends before us spent 100+ yrs selectively breeding & culling to make our APBT of today. For those that have passed on, if they were alive to see what moneyloving, jobless sh*theads are doing to this breed, they would probably go jump off a bridge somewhere & for those who remain with us, they too are fighting an uphill battle w/the TRUE lovers of this breed like most of us here to keep this dog in it's true form & glory. I just don't get it? Yeah, so the english bulldog is cute. But it only lives about 6 yrs, can't walk 30 feet w/out having to rest due to his grossly short & distorted nasal passages & elongated soft palate, has to worry about heat stroke anytime it's over 70 ...degrees (F), has spinal problems, has hip dysplasia (all e. bulldogs have some ...degree of it), have eye probs, has elbow probs, has shoulder probs, has skin probs, & cannot usually even breed or give birth naturally yet requires medical intervention to accomplish procreation. Are these the kinds of things we want in our breed? By breeding for midget apbts (you know who you are :mad: ) & these too short, too wide bulldogs (which some need b/c they are too big of p*****s to obtain a decent reputation on their own) these are the problems we are creating for this breed. Is this truly how we should show our "...love" for these dogs that have done anything & everything possible to please us & to make us happy w/out concern for their own wellbeing? Is it??!! WE OWE IT TO THIS BREED & TO OUR DOGS TO MAINTAIN THE "STANDARD" & KEEP 'EM HEALTHY SO THEY CAN ...WORK AS INTENDED TO DOING ALL THE MANY JOBS THEY HAVE PROVEN SO ADAPT TO DOING. BY SELECTIVE BREEDINGS & SELECTIVE CULLINGS WE ARE TRYING TO IMPROVE BUT ALSO MAINTAIN THE BASICS THAT MAKE THIS DOG THE COURAGEOUS CANINE THAT IT IS. THERE IS NO OTHER IN COMPARISON SO IF WE RUIN THIS BREED AS A WHOLE, WE WILL NOT BE ABLE TO FIND ANOTHER BREED THAT COMES CLOSE TO BEING THE APBT OF TODAY!!!!!!!

you GO GIRL!!!!!!

[hawk]

I think all this sh*t breeding is a damn shame. Our forefathers & friends before us spent 100+ yrs selectively breeding & culling to make our APBT of today. For those that have passed on, if they were alive to see what moneyloving, jobless sh*theads are doing to this breed, they would probably go jump off a bridge somewhere & for those who remain with us, they too are fighting an uphill battle w/the TRUE lovers of this breed like most of us here to keep this dog in it's true form & glory. I just don't get it? Yeah, so the english bulldog is cute. But it only lives about 6 yrs, can't walk 30 feet w/out having to rest due to his grossly short & distorted nasal passages & elongated soft palate, has to worry about heat stroke anytime it's over 70 degrees (F), has spinal problems, has hip dysplasia (all e. bulldogs have some degree of it), have eye probs, has elbow probs, has shoulder probs, has skin probs, & cannot usually even breed or give birth naturally yet requires medical intervention to accomplish procreation. Are these the kinds of things we want in our breed? By breeding for midget apbts (you know who you are :mad: ) & these too short, too wide bulldogs (which some need b/c they are too big of p*****s to obtain a decent reputation on their own) these are the problems we are creating for this breed. Is this truly how we should show our "love" for these dogs that have done anything & everything possible to please us & to make us happy w/out concern for their own wellbeing? Is it??!! WE OWE IT TO THIS BREED & TO OUR DOGS TO MAINTAIN THE "STANDARD" & KEEP 'EM HEALTHY SO THEY CAN WORK AS INTENDED TO DOING ALL THE MANY JOBS THEY HAVE PROVEN SO ADAPT TO DOING. BY SELECTIVE BREEDINGS & SELECTIVE CULLINGS WE ARE TRYING TO IMPROVE BUT ALSO MAINTAIN THE BASICS THAT MAKE THIS DOG THE COURAGEOUS CANINE THAT IT IS. THERE IS NO OTHER IN COMPARISON SO IF WE RUIN THIS BREED AS A WHOLE, WE WILL NOT BE ABLE TO FIND ANOTHER BREED THAT COMES CLOSE TO BEING THE APBT OF TODAY!!!!!!!
GREAT POST!!! It just amazes me that there is a market for these "new" pit bulls. And the funny thing is the day AFTER someone buys one they find this place.

[socks]

I think all this sh*t breeding is a damn shame. Our forefathers & friends before us spent 100+ yrs selectively breeding & culling to make our APBT of today. For those that have passed on, if they were alive to see what moneyloving, jobless sh*theads are doing to this breed, they would probably go jump off a bridge somewhere & for those who remain with us, they too are fighting an uphill battle w/the TRUE lovers of this breed like most of us here to keep this dog in it's true form & glory. I just don't get it? Yeah, so the english bulldog is cute. But it only lives about 6 yrs, can't walk 30 feet w/out having to rest due to his grossly short & distorted nasal passages & elongated soft palate, has to worry about heat stroke anytime it's over 70 degrees (F), has spinal problems, has hip dysplasia (all e. bulldogs have some degree of it), have eye probs, has elbow probs, has shoulder probs, has skin probs, & cannot usually even breed or give birth naturally yet requires medical intervention to accomplish procreation. Are these the kinds of things we want in our breed? By breeding for midget apbts (you know who you are :mad: ) & these too short, too wide bulldogs (which some need b/c they are too big of p*****s to obtain a decent reputation on their own) these are the problems we are creating for this breed. Is this truly how we should show our "love" for these dogs that have done anything & everything possible to please us & to make us happy w/out concern for their own wellbeing? Is it??!! WE OWE IT TO THIS BREED & TO OUR DOGS TO MAINTAIN THE "STANDARD" & KEEP 'EM HEALTHY SO THEY CAN WORK AS INTENDED TO DOING ALL THE MANY JOBS THEY HAVE PROVEN SO ADAPT TO DOING. BY SELECTIVE BREEDINGS & SELECTIVE CULLINGS WE ARE TRYING TO IMPROVE BUT ALSO MAINTAIN THE BASICS THAT MAKE THIS DOG THE COURAGEOUS CANINE THAT IT IS. THERE IS NO OTHER IN COMPARISON SO IF WE RUIN THIS BREED AS A WHOLE, WE WILL NOT BE ABLE TO FIND ANOTHER BREED THAT COMES CLOSE TO BEING THE APBT OF TODAY!!!!!!!
couldnt have said it any better myself!!!

[presacanario]

Whoa, i think a few people took my post this morning the wrong way.... I in no way cundone nor care for this wannabe pit! I was just stating what i knew on the topic seeing how a friend of mine breeds fake pits so i thought i would share... ( by the way he isnt talking about doing anything with the big teddy bears! lmao

[Dpres1]

GREAT POST!!! It just amazes me that there is a market for these "new" pit bulls. And the funny thing is the day AFTER someone buys one they find this place.

Ha ha! Burn!
:eek: "You mean I paid $2000 for a WHAT?!" :eek:

[miakoda]

Whoa, i think a few people took my post this morning the wrong way.... I in no way cundone nor care for this wannabe pit!
My rant was in no way directed at you!;) Those to whom it was/is directed to know who they are as they approve of what they're doing b/c they make a living off their dogs vs. making a living to support their dogs. I'm up to my neck w/rage for all their b.s.

[jadedpitgirl]

The Camelot Line is old family reds, the old stuff Mr. sidereas started with was real pits I dont know about this new stuff.

You are correct. Art Sideras bred real pits! Yes they were larger than what most of us like to see, but they could still perform wonderfully at tasks such as hog hunt and weight pull.

The camelotpits.com site is owned/run by a dumbass named Kenny Sonia. He stole the name of Camelot's and started registering his dogs under this name. So, understandably, people confuse his dogs with the original line. The "founder" of the original Camelot line does not have a web site and he doesn't peddle pups. Most of his dogs are sold by word of mouth. Kenny started out with a few good Camelot dogs, but his greed over took his sensibility. He doesn't breed to maintain the quality of the breed. His mongrels are not game, but simply dog aggressive. Just because your dog will attack anything that runs in front of it, doesn't make him game. As far as I am concerned, Kenny Sonia is the most worthless thing to ever happen to this breed. He is even worse than the RE/Gotti big blue dog breeders. He wouldn't know a real pit bull if it bit him in the ass!!

[pitlver]

if u all were riding mias bra strap any harder she would be wearing double d's or is it that u cant find any of your own words. i agree with what she said but if we all just start bashing other people and their opinions are we any better.

[planterspeanut]

I cant believe no one has ever heard of these dogs??? They arent a full pit, but have a little mastiff in them. The are hot and heavy weight pull dogs. And 75# is small compared to some of them. With you get into the eddington lines of "I wanna be a whopper" you will see them around 100 to 110 pounds. Some people call them Cur dogs..but havent found out exactly what that means.. lol. But if you have a chance, goto a pit bull weight pull, especially ADBA and you will see the monsters at play

[houstonapbt]

I cant believe no one has ever heard of these dogs??? They arent a full pit, but have a little mastiff in them. The are hot and heavy weight pull dogs. And 75# is small compared to some of them. With you get into the eddington lines of "I wanna be a whopper" you will see them around 100 to 110 pounds. Some people call them Cur dogs..but havent found out exactly what that means.. lol. But if you have a chance, goto a pit bull weight pull, especially ADBA and you will see the monsters at playOk, so there bandogges. So why do they insist in calling them PIT BULLS and registering them as pure bred APBT's when in fact, they're not?

[PorsA]

Are way to big for my. If you like this over grown big, fat, wide bulldogs with melonheads you better take an American Bulldog.

[schlebs]

Question...i know that the adba (and even ukc) make money off of all these registries of "show" APBT's. but why don't they at least have a separate category for each one, show APBT (or Amstaff) and then a game bred APBT category. they would still get revenue from all of these registries but people would know what they are getting and there wouldn't be as much confusion or animosity. doesn't this seem like a good simple solution? they say they have "been handed a great legacy" but it seems to me that by allowing all these APBT/mastiff/bulldog to be registered under the sam pretense as a true APBT is killing that legacy. if they want the money from these registries at least give them a new name (if you dont want to call them amstaffs).

I think part of the problem is that these people who are buying show APBT's think that Amstaff somehow has a negative connotation and that it means that they are p*****s (which shows how alot of these people are looking for a staus symbol). Amstaff simply means your dog is not from game bred lines and has been bred for show/size/looks, there is nothing wrong with that as long as it is not mixed with a game ABPT and you call it what it is. People on this site should quit making it seem like an Amstaff is somehow substandard. granted its not alot of people on heres cup of tea, but we all know it is a different dog bred for different purposes so what makes it any worse than one of our dogs. thats like saying a poodle is worse than our dogs. its not its just DIFFERENT nothing except the people who want to call it an apbt. by giving amstaffs a negative connotation we just make these people want to call their dogs APBT's even more. I think the solution up top would be in everybody's including the breeds best interest.

[jasong]

No. If they are not bred for what the pit bull was originally bred for, then they are not pit bulls.;) There are some 75# game bred dogs out there (rocksteady), but most of those dogs you see advertised for JUST their HUGE size are not apbt's, usually have some kind of bigger dog thrown in for size. Which is why a lot of us dislike the bigger dogs that are bred for specifically their size.
Although I do agree with you that it isn't a true APBT if it is only bred for size I do know of a few 80+ lbs. dogs that are game as hell. I personally know of one in the Norristown PA (right outside of Philly) area that was 95+ lbs. and was retired 12-0. His name was MAN. Don't know his blood but I know his owner very well. I never understood why he put him in the ring that many times but boy was he game. I don't hink he ever bred him b/c I would of got a dog off him but I know for a fact what he did, I saw it wih my own eyes.

[DEADGAME14]

what disgust me the most about this so called apbt breeder is that he has like 4 different breedings going on at one time!definate puppy mill, back yard breeder type of dealer,of sort.I hope this guy ownes a whole damn mountain cuz hes gonna need one to keep all the pups that wont sell.And a whole lot of bank roll for all that dog food.

[houstonapbt]

Although I do agree with you that it isn't a true APBT if it is only bred for size I do know of a few 80+ lbs. dogs that are game as hell. I personally know of one in the Norristown PA (right outside of Philly) area that was 95+ lbs. and was retired 12-0. His name was MAN. Don't know his blood but I know his owner very well. I never understood why he put him in the ring that many times but boy was he game. I don't hink he ever bred him b/c I would of got a dog off him but I know for a fact what he did, I saw it wih my own eyes.You misunderstood, I never related size with gameness. Another thing, how well do you understand the concept of gameness? Just because his hunting record was so good does not make that dog game at all. What if he took down all those hogs in less than 10 min? Does that make him game? No. Remember there is a difference between game and game bred.

[miakoda]

if u all were riding mias bra strap any harder she would be wearing double d's
After reading all this debate, this is the only statement you could muster up?? :rolleyes:

[Empire]

Big useless dogs not Pits.

[Bluepit50]

Big useless dogs not Pits.
Good one, in just 5 words you answered this thread better than the previous 42 posts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Empire]

Thanks, I try my best, LOL :D

[rockysteel]

Dogs like those big ones are bred for their size only and are not what you would call a GAME dog , they dont have any wind to speak of and are slow however they are strong but thats not anything if they dont have wind and stamina, if he is over 85 or 90 pounds id be wary about his gameness , thats like a champ dosent mean he s gonna make a champ and being big in size isnt neccessarly a good thing (meaning gameness), hey if you like em big then by all means go big and dont let anyone stop you but if you like a game dog then take the matter to heart and choose wisely.

[Pitbullmenace]

how could they be staffs if most of them have a rednose.

[CominStrong]

I'll tell you why they think there staffs. becuase most of these people on this board think the know and have a true apbt....with "GAMENESS". I guarantee you most on here don't have real tested game pits, they just like to talk about what a "true" pit is with his appearance. I think alot in here would shit there pants if they saw two true game dogs head off. as a breeder of 19 years, i can pick up on so called dog people easy and this board is full of shit talkers. now i'm not saying everybody, just a whole lot.
BTW: this post has nothing to do with the camelot pits breeders. I have seen some of them though and for there size they are pretty tough SOB's. the ones i've seen and catch and slam and nasty boar with little effort.

[NOLEFAN]

I would like this explained to me please.....What exactly do you so called life long breeders and experts mean by a real APBT? If two pits are mated, then I would think they would produce pits. Are you talking comformation, size, shape or whether or not it is used for, well you know? It seems to me that most of you experts seem to think any dog that isn't game is not a real dog. Or are you saying it has no purpose?

Slave owners used to breed the biggest and the strongest for better workers, but just because they are big doesn't mean they weren't human. I know, I know, the big dogs aren't game, and are not to true specifications for the breed, but who, other than a select few give a rats ass? If anyone wanted a game dog they would already know to stay away from the big ones.

[scooter]

I just simply dont like the overall look of the dog. That enormous head is just not attractive to me personally. It was so obviously bred for looks.

[lonesharkpits]

I'll tell you why they think there staffs. becuase most of these people on this board think the know and have a true apbt....with "GAMENESS". I guarantee you most on here don't have real tested game pits, they just like to talk about what a "true" pit is with his appearance. I think alot in here would shit there pants if they saw two true game dogs head off. as a breeder of 19 years, i can pick up on so called dog people easy and this board is full of shit talkers. now i'm not saying everybody, just a whole lot.
BTW: this post has nothing to do with the camelot pits breeders. I have seen some of them though and for there size they are pretty tough SOB's. the ones i've seen and catch and slam and nasty boar with little effort.
ONE OF THE TRUEST STATEMENTS I HAVE SEEN ON THIS SITE IN A LONG TIME!!

[NOLEFAN]

how do you test for gameness without illegal practices, I am really asking......

[14rock]

What exactly do you so called life long breeders and experts mean by a real APBT?
A dog bred to the standards of the breed. In our breed, this standard is above all gameness. If your not breeding for standard, your not breeding that breed any longer, but you are breeding a variation of the breed (Amstaff). In technical terms-a APBT mated with an APBT for a big head and blue color, can still be registered as APBT...but that paper is the only thing left APBT about them in a few generations.

I dont understand where your coming from in your thinking if its not game, its not worth anything. Completely untrue. IN THIS BREED however, the game dogs are the ones worth keeping. Same as in greyhound racing you keep the fastest. Bloodhound sports, the best nose. I love most all breeds of dogs, there is no "well, its not a game bulldog so this dog is worthless" going on in my head. I look at each dog as an individual of their breed, and do not compare breed standards of one breed to another to determine which is a worthy dog.

[NOLEFAN]

"but that paper is the only thing left APBT about them in a few generations. "

and that is because they are so out of conformation to the breed specs right?


I wasn't saying I think a non-game dog is worthless, I was asking if tha is what some people think, because that is the tone of their speech

[14rock]

I would necessarily say "out of conformation", just out of standard. They may still look the part, but again, heart is the standard and without it-they arent fitting the standard, thus arent a upstanding part of the breed.

Non-game-dogs arent worthless, its just simply not a true bulldog, and a good representation of the breed. Thus, they shouldnt be bred!

Earlier you asked "how do you test gameness if its illegal"...the simple answer is you cant legally.

You either break the law.

You lie about your dogs being game.

Or you have the wrong definition of the word game (think game means the same as gamebred, or maybe because a dog is dog-aggressive and will fight its game).

[NOLEFAN]

Well i appreciate you explaining these things without being an a$$hole, of which there are no shortages of on this site.

One last question if you don't mind. Does gamebred mean you hope to get game dogs from the breeding because of the proven gamenees of the parents?, and that doesn't guarantee that they are game, right?

[14rock]

Gamebred simply means they come off of proven game lines. In the truest form, yes gamebred means they are coming off of game parents also...but alot of people use the term to simply breed untested dogs if they have game ancestors in the pedigree. Maybe all the grandparents were game proven, but the parents did not...some people would call this "Gamebred". Its not a black and white subject most of the time, because of everyones own interpretation of words.

If you have any further questions, we can discuss it in pm's so as to not take this thread any further off track please. Thank you :)

[findrodhere]

Wow, I guess no one uses the search function, it seems like the "what is game" question is asked once a day.

[NOLEFAN]

Wow, I guess no one uses the search function, it seems like the "what is game" question is asked once a day.

lol...your right it probably does, but without questions how wopuld some of yuou ever get to be the smart asses you are?

[findrodhere]

lol...your right it probably does, but without questions how wopuld some of yuou ever get to be the smart asses you are?Research...if you can't find the answer, then ask the question.

Sorry for being a smart ass:D, I realize that I may have to be more tactful with sensitive people.

[NOLEFAN]

lmao.........that is the first time i have ever been called sensitive, i am going to have to fix that

[roughin_it_up]

IMO I think those dogs look disgusting. It just isn't normal

[pitbull_luvr0090]

Ok this is frustrating the crap out of me. The man that made the "whopper/eddignton" line of dogs crossed American Bulldogs into his to make them bigger, however the ADBA accepted this and that is what they are. However bad mouthing every person that may like a larger dog is not the best thing in the world. They don't bad mouth us because we like the more original of the breed. In fact I have been to one of their BBQ's and they are not that bad of a people they just prefer their dogs bigger. Ok that is what they want. And now they have a registry solely for these dogs called the Bloodlines Kennel Club that it is required before you can register with them to have the dogs mandatorily microchipped and dna'p before they can register and also they must compete 3 times a year in weight pull, conformation, and/or agility. They have to have this every year or their registration will be provoked. I know in my area almost all of the original/game type dogs are solely for fighting, with the exception of a few that are in good homes, and all of these larger dogs are generally just pets. I know that from here and also in my town and area these larger dogs are generally sought after as pets and pulling dogs and many of them are used for hog dogs in our area because of hog over abundance. There was just over the last weekend and dad and his 2 sons were at out local lake and they were charged by a hog and the police got two men here in town (I know both) to catch and relocate the animals to a more rural area. They have the larger dogs. But I am going to say this for sure I do not believe these dogs should be called American pit Bull Terriers. I believe they should be called American Bull Terriers or American Bullies. I also think that the ADBA or UKC should have them as separate type than the original like they have the Johnson (Bully) and Scott/performance (Smaller "Gameyer") American Bulldogs. These are dogs that are shown separately. I guess I'm ranting. Well my final opinion is I believe if you are breeding your dogs right and health/temperment testing and working your dogs you have the right to breed whatever you want regardless of size! please don't shoot me guys I love the original type more than anything i just get tired of people getting bad mouthed that don't deserve it. That's like saying just because you like your scrambled eggs with pepper other people that like theirs with salt are idiots and morons....I don't believe this is a subject that will ever be resolved. But thats just my 2 cents.

[miakoda]

They don't bad mouth us because we like the more original of the breed. Ummmmm, & what reason would they have to badmouth us? Because we own true APBTs? Because we haven't changed the breed's image to suit our own egotistical fashion needs?

Well my final opinion is I believe if you are breeding your dogs right and health/temperment testing and working your dogs you have the right to breed whatever you want regardless of size!
The problem with this statment is that one cannot possibly be breeding "right" & yet totally throwing the breed's standard right out the window.

& as for catch dogs, I will NEVER hunt with a dog over 80lbs. Too many of these larger dogs are getting maimed for their lack of agility & stamina. "True" APBTs do NOT have a problem bringing down a hog (unless they prefer to bring down a bay dog like 1 of my idiots did :o ).

[PitBull_30]

"True" APBTs do NOT have a problem bringing down a hog (unless they prefer to bring down a bay dog like 1 of my idiots did :o ).
LOL! Mine have done that too. Heck with the hog, bring down the dog! :rolleyes:

[pitbull_luvr0090]

Ummmmm, & what reason would they have to badmouth us? Because we own true APBTs? Because we haven't changed the breed's image to suit our own egotistical fashion needs?


The problem with this statment is that one cannot possibly be breeding "right" & yet totally throwing the breed's standard right out the window.

& as for catch dogs, I will NEVER hunt with a dog over 80lbs. Too many of these larger dogs are getting maimed for their lack of agility & stamina. "True" APBTs do NOT have a problem bringing down a hog (unless they prefer to bring down a bay dog like 1 of my idiots did :o ).
hey I'm sorry I didn't mean anything like that. Alas, I don't feel that if you are breeding what you love and are proud of you shouldn't be breeding at all. I mean what it comes down to is that some people do not want a dog as high energy as A "Game" bred dog. But they love the look of an animal similar maybe bigger. So they chose to breed an animal the way they wanted too. I'm not trying to offend or anything I'm simply giving an opinion. It seems that if you have an opinion slightly different than someone elses you get your butt jumped. I didn't say anything about dogs over even 90lbs. I understand what everyone means by puppy peddlers and what not but there are people out there that really care about what they have and are being responsible dog owners and breeders. I cannot say that all people that breed these larger dogs are bad because I know many that are good friends that don't even hardly ever sell to the public. They just prefer their dogs that way. Like you like your dogs smaller they like theirs bigger. Is that a crime? I honestly think this is too touchy of a subject to be discussed without somebody talking crap about somebody else and somebody getting into a fuss or something else all together. I just wish people would stop bad mouthing other people and their dogs that they do not know and have no idea what their goals are. I myself do not want a dog that large but I'm not going to talk crap to someone that does. I just hope they did their research and know where to buy one responsibly and the same goes for the "original" type as well. There are bad breeders on both types. I'm afraid to say much more as I don't want to offend or upset anyone. ok now I've said my peace.

[MR BIGGS]

I myself went and got a RExGotti dog before I learned about APBTs'. The only dog on that site that looks like he has a chance of being proportionate with some excercise and diet is this one:
http://www.camelotpitbulls.com/images/DOC2005_small.JPG (http://www.camelotpitbulls.com/images/DOC2005.JPG)http://www.camelotpitbulls.com/males.htm
As for the rest of them: short, wide and ugly. My male is on DVP now so I pray he doesnt get fat and nasty. I will be working him out real good once he is ready. Believe that!

[redgatorkennels]

gameness= is willing to die before getting deffeted. your dog is not GAMEBRED because he growls or barks at another dog. the best of the best make no noises at all when going into the hunt. the only thing i can tell you is find out what you want and do some checking before you purchase a dog. an intense dog in the hands of somone who has not owned somthing with a pray drive like gamebred pitbull could change your mind or open your eyes to what we are trying to accomplish as pitbull owners.

[Marty]

I think hes refering to the camelot dogs ;)