Vick hit with 23 month sentence

[BoiBoi]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/7544302?MSNHPHCP&GT1=10734

[Titch_Pitbull]

What a bunch of Bullshit.

[FearlessKnight]

What a bunch of Bullshit.Yep...you are right, he should have gotten the FULL 5 YEARS!

[simms]

Oh please...... 23 months is sufficiant.

[BoiBoi]

Oh please...... 23 months is sufficiant.
almost too much in my opinion

[Rocky H. Balboa]

My major issue with how sentences are dealt is that sentences for animal crimes is many times harsher than for human to human crimes. Five years huh? So, he should get same or more jail time than a rapist, robber, pedophile, etc? While animal abuse is unacceptable, its punishment should not be at the same level as human-to-human crimes. The amount of tax payer money that goes into investigating, prosecuting, and maintainin a man in jail should be used for human-to-human crimes, first and foremost.

[jman11]

at least the punishment fits the crime

others these days are getting 30-102 years..

[rusty]

23 months is excessive no matter who is being sentenced, seems like they made a example out of Mike Vick, I know someone who comitted murder and they only recieved 18months and he took a life away.

[Michele]

One of my bosses thinks he should be be-headed:D

[BoiBoi]

personally i believe that any crime towards animals shouldn't be considered a felony, this whole society has fu*ked up the clear line of animal and human. Someone culling an animal should not be punished as though he has just killed someone, shoot he should be praised for keeping the population in check and only allowing the strong to survive. Humans have lived thousands of years without worries of being punished for allowing their animals to do certain things or for culling stock, When has that way of thinking been shifted to this softy, nice to everything way of thinking that society has today?

[Grizzly]

My major issue with how sentences are dealt is that sentences for animal crimes is many times harsher than for human to human crimes. Five years huh? So, he should get same or more jail time than a rapist, robber, pedophile, etc? While animal abuse is unacceptable, its punishment should not be at the same level as human-to-human crimes. The amount of tax payer money that goes into investigating, prosecuting, and maintainin a man in jail should be used for human-to-human crimes, first and foremost.
You are right, human on human crime should have much stiffer punishment. It is not a question of why crime against animals has such harsh punishment ( which I don't think it does) but WHY human on human crime has such lenient sentences.

[Michele]

here's a video of the dogs. Number 30 is my favorite:

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2007/08/24/vo.vicks.dogs.wtvr

[hrdeluxe]

I'm filing a complaint with the ASPCA for the horrible conditions they were living in. The one had an empty bowl. Another one had feces in it's cage. LOL.

[redripper]

It bothers me to see what some on here are saying. What I think is forgotten here is the simple fact that animals are property. While I disdain acts of animal cruelty and I see my dogs as members of my family, those are moral decisions I make for myself and have no standing to make for others. Dogs as much as we love them are no different than any other livestock. Does a man go to prison for slaughtering chickens or cattle? I think not. They are his property. If a man decides to have his dog put to sleep, he can take it to the vet no questions asked, is that so different from shooting the dog in the back yard...apparently the law thinks so. The question we must eventually face is, are animals people or property? Do they have rights or don't they? The danger of course is that if you say they have such rights then by what means are we to use them for work, food, clothing, shelter. Further, from whence do these rights come? From God? From some type of animal popular sovereignty? These are all questions that you would have to answer. As it stands for me they are property, and I feel that a man should be able to do with his property as he pleases so long as his actions don't harm anyone else or their property. So while I think Mike Vick is disgusting for the way he chose to cull his stock that is a moral decision, and Morality is certainly not within the scope of the Federal government. Our founder's would be ashamed. Not only have we taken something that at most should be a local government matter and made it a federal crime by twisting the interstate commerce clause to allow basically unconstitutional action, but we have set the punishment so high that it exceeds the punishment often given for crimes against human beings. The fact that a man can spend time in a federal prison for how he chose to dispose of his own property is outrageous. Regardless how I feel about the man principles are principles. Ask yourself, how far do you want the government to go to enforce the collectives idea of morality into your personal decisions. What if they decide it's cruel to use dogs for agility so they make that a felony. What if someone says it is degrading for a dog to have to be put up in show competitions so they make that a felony. Peta wants total animal liberation...that means no pets. where do we draw the line people? It's easy to hate on Vick, but where do we draw the line? When do we say you don't have the right to enforce your morality on me?

[SMOKIN HEMI]

I read a couple of post that were written while i was at work I could not wait to get home to respond. First of all if you are a member of this forum and have been a member for any length of time you should be disturbed about what has happened today. Mike Vick though what he has done is illegal because of special interest group has been blown totally out of purportion. To say he deserved to get the time he was given is to say all of the old timers that have been in the news lately should suffer the same punishment. These are the same people that cant wait to flash their pedigrees online to show off to the world. To me that is the talk of a hypocrite. It is sad that you get more time for killing a dog than killing a person. Some might say that is not true (oh it's true* read this http://www.chris-sloan.com/kill-a-dog-do-18-months-kill-a-woman-do-90-days/ ) http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/news/story?id=1626742 Danny Heatley . Both of these guys are still playing and I am sure this is just to name a few. This is truely a tragadey, the punishment does not fit the crime..http://www.game-dog.com/forums/images/icons/icon12.gif

[coolhandjean]

Vick got luckier than some of the other dogfighters out there, plus I have a feeling he'll get out even earlier for "good behavior".

It is sad that you get more time for killing a dog than killing a person. Some might say that is not true (oh it's true* read this http://www.chris-sloan.com/kill-a-dog-do-18-months-kill-a-woman-do-90-days/ ) http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/news/story?id=1626742 Danny Heatley . Both of these guys are still playing and I am sure this is just to name a few. This is truely a tragadey, the punishment does not fit the crime..images/icons/icon12.gifI agree with that. I think it's insane that they won't let him play ball when he gets out, because like you already said, there are NFL players who have killed people and are in the game, which doesn't make much sense.

[SMOKIN HEMI]

Vick got luckier than some of the other dogfighters out there, plus I have a feeling he'll get out even earlier for "good behavior".
they said May of 09'

[BoogiemanBlood]

look it don't matter who you are, how much money you got, what your social status is, or what color you are.........if you break the law, you should accept the consequences and not bitch about it. nobody in the court system is sentenced what they COULD be sentenced to, so therefore nobody should be bitching about how much time they got. i do happen to agree about murderers and such getting off easy, but that quite honestly has nothing to do with what vick did, or got. it's a whole other subject you should be writing your lawmakers about........not this forum. ;)

[SMOKIN HEMI]

This is an off topic forum so we can post what we want. This is not a Communism what do you mean accept the punishment without having an opinion. This is America. We still would be in the dark ages if people did not have a opinion. Women and minorities would be second class citizens, Alcohol would be illegal if no one said anything. Democracy is all about challenging the status quo.

[diva]

I do agree that the punishment for human to human crimes should be a lot more harsh. But, I do not agree that a human to animal crime should go over looked. While I understand that dogs are property, it's also a living creature that feels pain. A few days ago there was a beagle on the news that had been skinned alive. After being skinned, the dog returned home and had to be euthanized. There were actually 2 beagles and the other suffered lacerations around the neck and shoulder before apparently escaping. In my opinion, something aint right with a person who enjoys seeing an animal in pain or suffering.
With that being said, I understand the need to cull but I think there are humane ways to do things.

[frenchie1936]

animals certainly should not be afforded the same protections under law that humans are allowed. but to blatantly break the law flies in the face of self preservation. i feel no sympathy towards vick because he knew what he was doing was illegal. whether or not it should be illegal is a different story. if you KNOWINGLY break the law, be ready to deal with it.

[frenchie1936]

i agree with you 100% black. i get tired of all the holier than thou types who think they friggin know everything and what is supposed to be done and what isn't. if these people made such great social leaders why are you not in politics? get a clue, this is america and telling people what they should and should not do doesn't sit well with the majority of people.


and skinning a beagle alive is not comparable to what vick did. i in no way condone his actions, but they certainly are far less cruel than skinning an animal alive.

[BoogiemanBlood]

This is an off topic forum so we can post what we want. This is not a Communism what do you mean accept the punishment without having an opinion. This is America. We still would be in the dark ages if people did not have a opinion. Women and minorities would be second class citizens, Alcohol would be illegal if no one said anything. Democracy is all about challenging the status quo.lol he got over 3 years less than he COULD HAVE! lol yeah i'd shut up and take it considering the hunt for his head if i was him too.....duh why do you think he did? it was the best he could get. that's why! and how in the hell accepting responsibility for the CRIME.....YEAH CRIME you commited turns us into a communist country just completely goes by me? please explain the connection there cuz i think i need some help on that one. like i said you can sit in here and cry all you want. get a hold of the lawmakers if you believe half as strongly as you pretend to here and do something about it then. i really don't see how preaching in an online dog forum is going to get you anywhere. also, please remember like you said....it's your opinion....which juuuuuuuuuuust maybe......doesn't match everyone elses! oh and i never said you couldn't post in the forum. you should comprehend what you read....i said.....it's a whole other subject you should be writing your lawmakers about........not this forum. images/smilies/wink.gifget it right there next time

[SMOKIN HEMI]

BB all I am saying is that I dont see why we cant discuss the biggest dogfighting case in the history of this country in a game dog forum. Especially when you can look in our members gallery and see Badnews Kennels in there. Mike Vick isnt complaining about the sentence I am. I havent done anything wrong I can bitch all I want too. lol. The communistic statment is just shutting up and being quiet. If I dont like something I should be able to voice my opinion about it. This is a forum. this is where I voice my opinion.http://www.game-dog.com/forums/images/icons/icon10.gif

Its all good though....http://www.game-dog.com/forums/images/icons/icon12.gif

[BoogiemanBlood]

BB all I am saying is that I dont see why we cant discuss the biggest dogfighting case in the history of this country in a game dog forum. Especially when you can look in our members gallery and see Badnews Kennels in there. Mike Vick isnt complaining about the sentence I am. I havent done anything wrong I can bitch all I want too. lol. The communistic statment is just shutting up and being quiet. If I dont like something I should be able to voice my opinion about it. This is a forum. this is where I voice my opinion.http://www.game-dog.com/forums/images/icons/icon10.giflol like i said i NEVER said you couldn't....just suggested that if you feel that strongly about it there were better places to direct your efforts (lawmakers) instead of basicly wasting your time bitching about it here. don't read something that's not there BC...LOL i'm all for having your opinion, and standing up for what you believe in. you should know that by now bout me long as we been here. ;)

[youngheeler]

so much for the land of the free

[ColbyDogs]

I too agree his sentence is light. Given the nature of the ENTIRE case not just his unorthadox method of culling, what he did was illegal plain and simple. I also agree that dogs are property and they should be yours to do with as you please however I draw the line when it comes to blatant animal cruelty and if any of you think that slamming a dog to the ground til it dies is humane then you might need to have your own heads checked.

I know in my past I have done some things that got me some time taken away for doing much less than Mikey and I paid alot more than he is doing so he will get no remorse from me.

[dwd58]

I just cant believe that in a gamedog forum, members are piling on Vic. He aint got a prayer out in the regular world..but i thought on here there would be more sympathy. Hell, what he did was not even a crime just a few years ago;. You must remember that they aint going to quit there, next they will be trying to ban hunting, then they will take your guns, and maybe then they might even make it a felony to work a dog on a cow hide? How far are they going to push you? Peta could make one hell of a good front page story about a mean and greedy dog owner that stripped the hides off of poor innocent calves and sold the bloody pieces out to bulldog owners who prodded their dogs to rip the calf hides to shreds and work them up to a frenzy to where they would kill anything in their path! . They could be tearing your a$$ apart next week and you need to remember that.

[BoogiemanBlood]

I just cant believe that in a gamedog forum, members are piling on Vic. He aint got a prayer out in the regular world..but i thought on here there would be more sympathy. Hell, what he did was not even a crime just a few years ago;. You must remember that they aint going to quit there, next they will be trying to ban hunting, then they will take your guns, and maybe then they might even make it a felony to work a dog on a cow hide? How far are they going to push you? Peta could make one hell of a good front page story about a mean and greedy dog owner that stripped the hides off of poor innocent calves and sold the bloody pieces out to bulldog owners who prodded their dogs to rip the calf hides to shreds and work them up to a frenzy to where they would kill anything in their path! . They could be tearing your a$$ apart next week and you need to remember that.lol that's the dumbest shit i ever heard

and what you call "a few years ago" was 31 years. vick wasn't even alive when dog fighting was legal.....not even close you goof! i'd say that's enough time to know that it is illegal. if you didn't get the memo by then it's your own fault! lol now we're comparing killing livestock to dog fighting.....lmao all you vick lovers can't see the damage he's done to our breed....that's sad!

edit: oh and btw, when they make it ILLEGAL to sell beef hides, guess what..........i won't sell them anymore. just like the dumbass vick shouldn't have been doing ILLEGAL things with his dogs. lol i sell beef hides so i'm greedy.....again.....dumbest shit i ever heard! lol

[coolhandjean]

I just cant believe that in a gamedog forum, members are piling on Vic. He aint got a prayer out in the regular world..but i thought on here there would be more sympathy.I've said this many times when the case first came out. While I understand that he should get in trouble for breaking the dogfighting law, that is not my beef with Vick at all. He got caught. It's illegal (whether it should or should not be, it is.) However, my beef with Vick is the way he went about culling his dogs. If he would have just simply put a bullet in the dog's head, then I wouldn't care, but drowning, hanging, etc. is just messed up and un-nessecary. That is where my problem with him came in...

all you vick lovers can't see the damage he's done to our breed....that's sad!That is the unfornate truth. Whether you think dogfighting should be legal or whether you think it should be illegal, the general public sees our dogs as these horrible beast formed to kill anything in its path, and then having a "dogfighting ring" discovered while on a drug bust, just furthers the stereotype that the only people who own APBT are gansters and white trash, and that the breed would be better off extinct, for "its own good."

[FearlessKnight]

lol that's the dumbest shit i ever heard

and what you call "a few years ago" was 31 years. i'd say that's enough time to know that it is illegal. if you didn't get the memo by then it's your own fault! lol now we're comparing killing livestock to dog fighting.....lmao all you vick lovers can't see the damage he's done to our breed....that's sad!In MY opinion....this right here......IS:
ENOUGH SAID!

[simms]

I'm filing a complaint with the ASPCA for the horrible conditions they were living in. The one had an empty bowl. Another one had feces in it's cage. LOL.
GOOD FOR YOU! They are not above the law.

Edit: If you notice the latches on those runs are not secure.

[ABK]

This is insane. MV more than deserved 23 mos. Maybe not for matching dogs, but defintely for the inhumane & cruel way he chose to dispatch his culls! For that right there he deserves to be bashed in the skull IMO. I can't stand anyone who inflicts pain & death on a smaller, helpless creature. So I'm not shedding any tears about that pr*ck gettingf 23 mos. Boo-hoo. Tell it to the dogs who he stomped to death.

And not to go off topic, but where have you been living Black Ceasar? First you think it's cool for folks to post pics of chicks licking feces & now you say women & minorities are equals in the workplace?? Let me tell you friend, they are not. Things have gotten BETTER, but women & minorities are still behind the 8-ball & this is 2007.

[Michele]

I just cant believe that in a gamedog forum, members are piling on Vic. He aint got a prayer out in the regular world..but i thought on here there would be more sympathy. Hell, what he did was not even a crime just a few years ago;. You must remember that they aint going to quit there, next they will be trying to ban hunting, then they will take your guns, and maybe then they might even make it a felony to work a dog on a cow hide? How far are they going to push you? Peta could make one hell of a good front page story about a mean and greedy dog owner that stripped the hides off of poor innocent calves and sold the bloody pieces out to bulldog owners who prodded their dogs to rip the calf hides to shreds and work them up to a frenzy to where they would kill anything in their path! . They could be tearing your a$$ apart next week and you need to remember that.

ah, hello. THIRTY YEARS AGO........

[Michele]

I'm with Boogieman and ABK.

Vick is nothing more than a hoodlum who played "dogman". And IMO, he got off on the way he culled those dogs. Sick bastard. His sentence was nothing compared to the 5 years he could of gotten. He's an embarassment and IMO, mocked what true dogmen really were. And you know what else, I hope someone zaps his ass in jail. And I don't mean with electrical volts.

He contributed in a major way to setting back what people are trying to do to make the public accept this breed.

[misterdogman]

Whoa whoa whoa! Your trying to tell me this is Michael Vick the football player? Whats going on here? Why is he is trouble? Did he get sentenced to prison for being to much of a star athlete or is it because of his leadership skills?. I must be outta the loop because this is news to me and I was wondering when the Falcons were going to unbench him, I was like WTF for the past 13 Sundays.

[Michele]

Whoa whoa whoa! Your trying to tell me this is Michael Vick the football player? Whats going on here? Why is he is trouble? Did he get sentenced to prison for being to much of a star athlete or is it because of his leadership skills?. I must be outta the loop because this is news to me and I was wondering when the Falcons were going to unbench him, I was like WTF for the past 13 Sundays.
surely you jest...Lord, i'm hoping you jest:D

[BoiBoi]

can someone help me find the thread about the dogman that got over 100 years in prison just recently, i would like to read through it.
YIS
B

[misterdogman]

surely you jest...Lord, i'm hoping you jest:DJest about what? I jest want to know whats going on here.

[BoiBoi]

Jest about what? I jest want to know whats going on here.
I think its about time for u to put the vodka down and step away from the PC

[misterdogman]

I think its about time for u to put the vodka down and step away from the PCI aint holding the vodka dummy, its already down on the counter. Also in order to step away from the pc id have to stand up and your Shitouttaluck there.

[simms]

Jest about what? I jest want to know whats going on here.
LOL...............

[BoiBoi]

I aint holding the vodka dummy, its already down on the counter. Also in order to step away from the pc id have to stand up and your Shitouttaluck there.
hmm...so u've lost ur mind a little huh....well i guess this thread has run its course, what do u say mods

[LuvinBullies]

I agree. It's always a good clue when we reduce ourselves "jest" to complete silliness. :)

Thread closed unless anyone can add anything else relevant. ;)

[Suki]

gunna add my .02 here:
fact is Vick broke the law. a law that is NOT new and has been in place in this country since 1976. NO one is above the law: you play, you pay. that simple. Vick had enuff money to take those dogs to countries where it's legal to match them, if he was "that interested". he chose not to do so. again, dog fighting is a FELONY in America. he got caught, plain and simple. culling is and has always been, imo, for the best~ by, and because of, NOT in spit of, its use, we have all come to own the dogs we have today. Vick's methods of culling, were inhumane, at best. too bad all his money couldn't/didn't buy him any common sense...
Edit to add: i will leave this open so long as it stays on topic.

[frenchie1936]

I just cant believe that in a gamedog forum, members are piling on Vic. He aint got a prayer out in the regular world..but i thought on here there would be more sympathy. Hell, what he did was not even a crime just a few years ago;. You must remember that they aint going to quit there, next they will be trying to ban hunting, then they will take your guns, and maybe then they might even make it a felony to work a dog on a cow hide? How far are they going to push you? Peta could make one hell of a good front page story about a mean and greedy dog owner that stripped the hides off of poor innocent calves and sold the bloody pieces out to bulldog owners who prodded their dogs to rip the calf hides to shreds and work them up to a frenzy to where they would kill anything in their path! . They could be tearing your a$$ apart next week and you need to remember that.

i can't fathom why in the world you think mike vick deserves any sympathy? especially on this board. his actions have caused more PR damage than any case i can remember or have ever heard about. that scum will get what he deserves, whether it is in prison or on judgement day. and i hope the NFL bans him for life.

[Suki]

i predict we'll see him in a pro uniform in about 18 months.....

[FearlessKnight]

i predict we'll see him in a pro uniform in about 18 months.....LMAO...I said 12 this morning....I guess we will see.....

[Bullyson]

Damn good post. There are thousands and thousands of people who do the same damn thing Vick did and get busted every day...He was a star so it holds hype. Thats that.:rolleyes: It bothers me to see what some on here are saying. What I think is forgotten here is the simple fact that animals are property. While I disdain acts of animal cruelty and I see my dogs as members of my family, those are moral decisions I make for myself and have no standing to make for others. Dogs as much as we love them are no different than any other livestock. Does a man go to prison for slaughtering chickens or cattle? I think not. They are his property. If a man decides to have his dog put to sleep, he can take it to the vet no questions asked, is that so different from shooting the dog in the back yard...apparently the law thinks so. The question we must eventually face is, are animals people or property? Do they have rights or don't they? The danger of course is that if you say they have such rights then by what means are we to use them for work, food, clothing, shelter. Further, from whence do these rights come? From God? From some type of animal popular sovereignty? These are all questions that you would have to answer. As it stands for me they are property, and I feel that a man should be able to do with his property as he pleases so long as his actions don't harm anyone else or their property. So while I think Mike Vick is disgusting for the way he chose to cull his stock that is a moral decision, and Morality is certainly not within the scope of the Federal government. Our founder's would be ashamed. Not only have we taken something that at most should be a local government matter and made it a federal crime by twisting the interstate commerce clause to allow basically unconstitutional action, but we have set the punishment so high that it exceeds the punishment often given for crimes against human beings. The fact that a man can spend time in a federal prison for how he chose to dispose of his own property is outrageous. Regardless how I feel about the man principles are principles. Ask yourself, how far do you want the government to go to enforce the collectives idea of morality into your personal decisions. What if they decide it's cruel to use dogs for agility so they make that a felony. What if someone says it is degrading for a dog to have to be put up in show competitions so they make that a felony. Peta wants total animal liberation...that means no pets. where do we draw the line people? It's easy to hate on Vick, but where do we draw the line? When do we say you don't have the right to enforce your morality on me?

[pittfallin]

the only thing that pisses me off is the way he culled them and how bad it hurts us

[miakoda]

The law is the law.

And this is the reason as to why we ban those who come on here bragging about what they did last weekend against whose dog. It's why we close such threads.

Just look around on this site at the wanna-be's who run their mouths and then get offended when we edit it. We're SAVING YOUR ASS, not hurting you! Not to mention, but if anyone was such a big "playa in the game", you wouldn't be on an internet site bragging about everything you & your dogs have done.

Mike Vick lived in la-la-you-can't-touch-me land with his operation. It was no secret as to what he was doing. He didn't keep anything within any circle. And now he's paying the price.

Come on people. We live in this country. If you don't like the laws, either lie low or move on. But don't continue to think you can do whatever the hell you want to do, brag about it to anyone with ears, and think you are going to get away with it.

What ever happened to common sense? And humility?

[simms]

The law is the law.

And this is the reason as to why we ban those who come on here bragging about what they did last weekend against whose dog. It's why we close such threads.

Just look around on this site at the wanna-be's who run their mouths and then get offended when we edit it. We're SAVING YOUR ASS, not hurting you! Not to mention, but if anyone was such a big "playa in the game", you wouldn't be on an internet site bragging about everything you & your dogs have done.

Mike Vick lived in la-la-you-can't-touch-me land with his operation. It was no secret as to what he was doing. He didn't keep anything within any circle. And now he's paying the price.

Come on people. We live in this country. If you don't like the laws, either lie low or move on. But don't continue to think you can do whatever the hell you want to do, brag about it to anyone with ears, and think you are going to get away with it.

What ever happened to common sense? And humility? Mia,
I get what your saying, an I'm no Vick fan. I stand opposed to AR and AR laws.

[renegadepit]

here's a video of the dogs. Number 30 is my favorite:

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2007/08/24/vo.vicks.dogs.wtvr

What a bunch of good looking dogs!

[toddrock]

I think many people are missing the point here. This is not about culling! If you want to cull a dog fine, cull it. I don't think you'll get that many arguments about that here. But there are correct, humane ways to do it.

Vick is a low-class POS. What he did to those dogs was sadistic and atrocious. He could have just said the word and one his thug yard boys could have culled the dogs. But he had to personally participate in the torturing of these under-performing dogs. This was all about Vick's "hood rep" and his fragile ego. He felt embarrassed by these dogs, the nerve of these dogs to not "represent" for badass Michael Vick. So he decided to kill these dogs in deplorable ways in some twisted attempt to restore his rep to all the homies. If the dogs don't perform it isn't the dogs fault, it's a reflection on the owner/breeder. These dogs are what we make them. But Vick couldn't accept that responsibility, no way. He should have been a man back when no one was watching.

For all those who live vicariously through their dogs like Vick: I doubt they'd have the balls to step into a cage against Couture and the likes and attempt to do what they so easily demand of their dogs. I'm talking about similar conditions for the dogs, no injury time-outs, TV time-outs, no "who cares if I lose, I still make a million dollars and now I'm on vacation sooner" attitudes. Truth is, Vick would cull out just like 99% of the population.

The guy is also a complete frickin' ass for bringing more unneeded, negative publicity to the breed I love. Pieces of shit like Vick are not worthy to own bulldogs!

[Michele]

I think many people are missing the point here. This is not about culling! If you want to cull a dog fine, cull it. I don't think you'll get that many arguments about that here. But there are correct, humane ways to do it.

Vick is a low-class POS. What he did to those dogs was sadistic and atrocious. He could have just said the word and one his thug yard boys could have culled the dogs. But he had to personally participate in the torturing of these under-performing dogs. This was all about Vick's "hood rep" and his fragile ego. He felt embarrassed by these dogs, the nerve of these dogs to not "represent" for badass Michael Vick. So he decided to kill these dogs in deplorable ways in some twisted attempt to restore his rep to all the homies. If the dogs don't perform it isn't the dogs fault, it's a reflection on the owner/breeder. These dogs are what we make them. But Vick couldn't accept that responsibility, no way. He should have been a man back when no one was watching.

For all those who live vicariously through their dogs like Vick: I doubt they'd have the balls to step into a cage against Couture and the likes and attempt to do what they so easily demand of their dogs. I'm talking about similar conditions for the dogs, no injury time-outs, TV time-outs, no "who cares if I lose, I still make a million dollars and now I'm on vacation sooner" attitudes. Truth is, Vick would cull out just like 99% of the population.

The guy is also a complete frickin' ass for bringing more unneeded, negative publicity to the breed I love. Pieces of shit like Vick are not worthy to own bulldogs!
BRAVO!!!!!...excellent post

[SMOKIN HEMI]

In the beginning of the investigation we all talked about how the media and the goverment sensationalizes pit bull issues. If you remember they were saying that he had rape stands for the dogs. are you kidding me. The general consenses was that we were not going to jump to conclusions about this whole thing. But now after you guys know that that boy was set up and all of that was thrown in his lap you still fall for the hype. He had no other choice but to plead guilty to those charges. I can not imagine him worth 2-3 hundred million drowning a dog. Give me a break, he probably got one of those flunkys to do it. If that is actually what happened. But it is just funny how you take everything that the goverment says as gospel, you minus well go join PETA if you are going to be like that. To me it like Bush talking about WMD you take that crap with a grain of salt. Now I am not stupid in the grand sceme of things this has hurt the breed and it is going to take alot for us to win this battle. But that is because people are so influenced by the media.

[Grizzly]

lol he got over 3 years less than he COULD HAVE! lol yeah i'd shut up and take it considering the hunt for his head if i was him too.....duh why do you think he did? it was the best he could get. that's why! and how in the hell accepting responsibility for the CRIME.....YEAH CRIME you commited turns us into a communist country just completely goes by me? please explain the connection there cuz i think i need some help on that one. like i said you can sit in here and cry all you want. get a hold of the lawmakers if you believe half as strongly as you pretend to here and do something about it then. i really don't see how preaching in an online dog forum is going to get you anywhere. also, please remember like you said....it's your opinion....which juuuuuuuuuuust maybe......doesn't match everyone elses! oh and i never said you couldn't post in the forum. you should comprehend what you read....i said.....get it right there next timeI agree with you BoogiemanBlood.

[Grizzly]

I think many people are missing the point here. This is not about culling! If you want to cull a dog fine, cull it. I don't think you'll get that many arguments about that here. But there are correct, humane ways to do it.

Vick is a low-class POS. What he did to those dogs was sadistic and atrocious. He could have just said the word and one his thug yard boys could have culled the dogs. But he had to personally participate in the torturing of these under-performing dogs. This was all about Vick's "hood rep" and his fragile ego. He felt embarrassed by these dogs, the nerve of these dogs to not "represent" for badass Michael Vick. So he decided to kill these dogs in deplorable ways in some twisted attempt to restore his rep to all the homies. If the dogs don't perform it isn't the dogs fault, it's a reflection on the owner/breeder. These dogs are what we make them. But Vick couldn't accept that responsibility, no way. He should have been a man back when no one was watching.

For all those who live vicariously through their dogs like Vick: I doubt they'd have the balls to step into a cage against Couture and the likes and attempt to do what they so easily demand of their dogs. I'm talking about similar conditions for the dogs, no injury time-outs, TV time-outs, no "who cares if I lose, I still make a million dollars and now I'm on vacation sooner" attitudes. Truth is, Vick would cull out just like 99% of the population.


The guy is also a complete frickin' ass for bringing more unneeded, negative publicity to the breed I love. Pieces of shit like Vick are not worthy to own bulldogs! Another good post!! The Vic sympathizers on this board can't seem to see past the ends of their noses when it comes to the damage and bad press things like this do to our breed of dogs
And no it's NOT a moral issue or a loss of freedom issue...it's the law. You know the law and you know the consequences of breaking the law. If you choose to do it anyway them you have no one to blame but yourself when you are caught and punished. No reason for sympathy!!!

[Michele]

In the beginning of the investigation we all talked about how the media and the goverment sensationalizes pit bull issues. If you remember they were saying that he had rape stands for the dogs. are you kidding me. The general consenses was that we were not going to jump to conclusions about this whole thing. But now after you guys know that that boy was set up and all of that was thrown in his lap you still fall for the hype. He had no other choice but to plead guilty to those charges. I can not imagine him worth 2-3 hundred million drowning a dog. Give me a break, he probably got one of those flunkys to do it. If that is actually what happened. But it is just funny how you take everything that the goverment says as gospel, you minus well go join PETA if you are going to be like that. To me it like Bush talking about WMD you take that crap with a grain of salt. Now I am not stupid in the grand sceme of things this has hurt the breed and it is going to take alot for us to win this battle. But that is because people are so influenced by the media.
If I was innocent of a crime, there would be NO WAY that I would admit to it. If Vick was innocent of inhumanely putting these dogs down, with all his money he could of hired cream of the crop lawyers and fought it. I would of never admitted to something if I didnt do it. Unless Vick is stupider than I thought he was.

I can imagine him with 2-3 million and drowning a dog. He's a hoodlum, a low life, a piece of shit. He thought he was untouchable. And he got an easy sentence, very easy sentence.

And yes, he damaged an already damaged breed. And it's his own fault.

[DryCreek]

So, does anyone know what happened with his druggie cousin that invited the police over in the first place?

Also, does anyone have a reputable link (not news story) that shows which exact charges he pled guilty to?

I know what I've read in the papers, but I hold no faith in their accuracy.;)

Do any of you think that the publicity surrounding this case might actually have helped the breed as well? Is there not also an outpouring of sympathy for the breed and what it was used for?

Look at it this way.

Those that are soooo anti "Pit Bull" will never change their ways so this only fueled their fire (negative impact)

Others that may have been on the fence about it may have been swayed towards helping the breed due to sympathy factors (positive impact)

Those who are for the breed are knowledgeable enough for it to have no effect about their views (no impact)

The fact that the media runs rampant with negative stories about the breed (Huge Negative Impact)

Vick broke the law and will do his time. I'll not second guess the judges decision as he has a lot more facts about this than I ever will.

[Grizzly]

In the beginning of the investigation we all talked about how the media and the goverment sensationalizes pit bull issues. If you remember they were saying that he had rape stands for the dogs. are you kidding me. The general consenses was that we were not going to jump to conclusions about this whole thing. But now after you guys know that that boy was set up and all of that was thrown in his lap you still fall for the hype.

He had no other choice but to plead guilty to those charges. I can not imagine him worth 2-3 hundred million drowning a dog. Give me a break, he probably got one of those flunkys to do it.

If that is actually what happened. But it is just funny how you take everything that the goverment says as gospel, you minus well go join PETA if you are going to be like that. To me it like Bush talking about WMD you take that crap with a grain of salt. Now I am not stupid in the grand sceme of things this has hurt the breed and it is going to take alot for us to win this battle. But that is because people are so influenced by the media.
"Jump to conclusions"? The trial is over and the guilt was determined

"You can't imagine him drowning dogs cause he is worth 2-3 hundred million?" A low life is a low life whether he has 2-3 hundred million in his pocket or not. Character and integrity are not determined by how much you are worth.

"People are so influenced by the media?" If you feel that way then just where did you get your information regarding the outcome of this trial??????

[miakoda]

Mia,
I get what your saying, an I'm no Vick fan. I stand opposed to AR and AR laws.
Me too, simms, me too. Animal welfare? Yes. Animal rights? Absolutely not!

[Tonka03]

http://www.dothaneagle.com/gulfcoasteast/dea/local_news.apx.-content-articles-DEA-2007-11-14-0009.html


IS THIS TOO MUCH OR WHAT.... I THINK THIS IS A BIT REDICULOUS MYSELF...


Tony

[Michele]

Me too, simms, me too. Animal welfare? Yes. Animal rights? Absolutely not!
I also agree with this UNLESS the dog is abused. Abuse is a crime.

[SMOKIN HEMI]

http://www.dothaneagle.com/gulfcoasteast/dea/local_news.apx.-content-articles-DEA-2007-11-14-0009.html


IS THIS TOO MUCH OR WHAT.... I THINK THIS IS A BIT REDICULOUS MYSELF...


Tony
Your right Tony that is crazy

[coolhandjean]

I also agree with this UNLESS the dog is abused. Abuse is a crime.I just wish they put as much care into child abuse as they seem to put into animal abuse. It's like abuse a child, get two-five months (give or take). Abuse a dog, go to jail for 5 years or more. That doesn't add up at all.

[Dreamer]

This was all about Vick's "hood rep" and his fragile ego. He felt embarrassed by these dogs, the nerve of these dogs to not "represent" for badass Michael Vick. So he decided to kill these dogs in deplorable ways in some twisted attempt to restore his rep to all the homies.

exactly....this is why I am so against what Vick (and his ilk) do. for them, it's not about the dogs at all. everything he (and the many like him) does is about "restoring their rep to all the homies".

Dreamer

[SMOKIN HEMI]

"Jump to conclusions"? The trial is over and the guilt was determined

"You can't imagine him drowning dogs cause he is worth 2-3 hundred million?" A low life is a low life whether he has 2-3 hundred million in his pocket or not. Character and integrity are not determined by how much you are worth.

"People are so influenced by the media?" If you feel that way then just where did you get your information regarding the outcome of this trial??????

Grizzly Look man I live in Atlanta I see this crap every day on tv on radio etc. The 2 co defendant turned on MV early in the case and basicily threw everything in his lap. Ok, I do believe that he was fighting dogs plain and simple but why should I believe or give and credence to after they said that he own rape stand. Anyone who has owned this breed for any length of time knows what that is and that is crap. So why should I believe all the other things that they had to say. If you think putting a bullet in a dogs head is a better way of culling then do that and go to the AC and tell them and you will suffer the same fate that MV has.
As far as him being a thug I want you to tell me what has he done that makes you call him that? Not just talking to you grizzly talking to all that has called him that. Cause if it is about him fighting dogs then that can be said about all of the old timers that we all hold in high esteem. Dont let me go through thread histroy and find some of these old post

[Michele]

I just wish they put as much care into child abuse as they seem to put into animal abuse. It's like abuse a child, get two-five months (give or take). Abuse a dog, go to jail for 5 years or more. That doesn't add up at all.
I agree..............

[Michele]

As far as him being a thug I want you to tell me what has he done that makes you call him that? Not just talking to you grizzly talking to all that has called him that. Cause if it is about him fighting dogs then that can be said about all of the old timers that we all hold in high esteem.
Do a search. Galadriel, I think, made a couple posts with what other issues MV has had in the past. And you can't compare the old timers to MV. No comparison.

[SMOKIN HEMI]

See the only thing that you have heard about him were things that were bad or negative. That was done to prove the media and the govt. point. We will have to agree to disagree on this thing. I do believe that things are going to be tough for us but as far as that other stuff. IMO it is a tactic used by the media to separate us.

[FearlessKnight]

The law is the law.

And this is the reason as to why we ban those who come on here bragging about what they did last weekend against whose dog. It's why we close such threads.

Just look around on this site at the wanna-be's who run their mouths and then get offended when we edit it. We're SAVING YOUR ASS, not hurting you! Not to mention, but if anyone was such a big "playa in the game", you wouldn't be on an internet site bragging about everything you & your dogs have done.

Mike Vick lived in la-la-you-can't-touch-me land with his operation. It was no secret as to what he was doing. He didn't keep anything within any circle. And now he's paying the price.

Come on people. We live in this country. If you don't like the laws, either lie low or move on. But don't continue to think you can do whatever the hell you want to do, brag about it to anyone with ears, and think you are going to get away with it.

What ever happened to common sense? And humility?It has been long gone.....to never exsist in most any longer...sadly!


Mia, this was the BEST post I have read in this thread. You have hit the nail on the head.

As far as other hollaring about pedigrees that get thrown around, well what the hell else is there to throw these days..unless you all would care to share something with us......you got some secrets.......:rolleyes:

[SMOKIN HEMI]

The law is the law.

And this is the reason as to why we ban those who come on here bragging about what they did last weekend against whose dog. It's why we close such threads.

Just look around on this site at the wanna-be's who run their mouths and then get offended when we edit it. We're SAVING YOUR ASS, not hurting you! Not to mention, but if anyone was such a big "playa in the game", you wouldn't be on an internet site bragging about everything you & your dogs have done.

Mike Vick lived in la-la-you-can't-touch-me land with his operation. It was no secret as to what he was doing. He didn't keep anything within any circle. And now he's paying the price.

Come on people. We live in this country. If you don't like the laws, either lie low or move on. But don't continue to think you can do whatever the hell you want to do, brag about it to anyone with ears, and think you are going to get away with it.

What ever happened to common sense? And humility?


^ You are right FK that is a great post would give a rep point if I could..lolhttp://www.game-dog.com/forums/images/icons/icon10.gif

[FearlessKnight]

I can not imagine him worth 2-3 hundred million drowning a dog. I promise I am not calling you out in any way...nothing personal here at all....
but this is the STUPIDEST shit I EVER heard....

MONEY NEVER HAS AND NEVER WILL BUY CLASS, MORALS OR INTEGRITY....

[SMOKIN HEMI]

I promise I am not calling you out in any way...nothing personal here at all....
but this is the STUPIDEST shit I EVER heard....

MONEY NEVER HAS AND NEVER WILL BUY CLASS, MORALS OR INTEGRITY....

It is all good FK, sorry you feel that way.

I wont comment any more on the topic.....

[FearlessKnight]

It is all good FK, sorry you feel that way.

I wont comment any more on the topic.....Its not just you....thats why I said, nothing personal....
There are a lot of people that think if you are rich you are holier than thou....
but it simply is not true......
thats why these rich people kill spouses and cheat and everything else...they are human no materr the amount of money in their bank...

[SMOKIN HEMI]

Its not just you....thats why I said, nothing personal....
There are a lot of people that thing if you are rich you are holier than thou....
but it simply is not true......
thats why these rich people kill spouses and cheat and everything else...they are human no materr the amount of money in their bank...
That was not the point that I was trying to make..

Its all good though

[FearlessKnight]

That was not the point that I was trying to make..

Its all good though.Oh....well enlighten me please...:D silly...

[Michele]

Fearlessknight: you are right about rich people. They really don't live in reality. I work for a law firm, a top notch firm in Manhattan. Most of the lawyers here are rich. In order to be a client, you have to be rich too. I mean really really rich. You would not believe how stupid, as far as common sense and street smarts is concerned, that these lawyers are. And they think they can do anything and say anything, no matter how rude and arrogant just because. And I truly think that MV had this kind of attitude.

[BoogiemanBlood]

Grizzly Look man I live in Atlanta I see this crap every day on tv on radio etc. The 2 co defendant turned on MV early in the case and basicily threw everything in his lap. Ok, I do believe that he was fighting dogs plain and simple but why should I believe or give and credence to after they said that he own rape stand. Anyone who has owned this breed for any length of time knows what that is and that is crap. So why should I believe all the other things that they had to say. If you think putting a bullet in a dogs head is a better way of culling then do that and go to the AC and tell them and you will suffer the same fate that MV has.
As far as him being a thug I want you to tell me what has he done that makes you call him that? Not just talking to you grizzly talking to all that has called him that. Cause if it is about him fighting dogs then that can be said about all of the old timers that we all hold in high esteem. Dont let me go through thread histroy and find some of these old postoh BC you're so brainwashed it's not even funny. i think there are 2 things clouding your judgement here. first of all you live in atlanta. of course mv is a hero to most there for his football talent. pure and simple. finally something atlanta could be proud of. second, you're black and don't dare want to seem like you sided against somebody who was black. if that's not true sorry, but it sure seems like it when you post. i don't think you're a racist or anything don't take it that way, i just think you feel like you have to defend him for the reasons given. if you bother to pick up the USA TODAY there is some good info in there on WHY vick got the time he got....which also may go to the thug thing somewhat also. the judge said he didn't believe mv fully accepted responsibility. which i'm sure you will disagree with, BUT the reason the judge said this is because when he accepted the plea he said he DID participate in the killing of dogs, and in the pre-sentence investigation he said he DIDN'T participate in it. OK MV WHICH IS IT? it is in written testimony that he carried a dog that lost to one of the co-defendants. the co-defendant placed a rope around the dogs neck, and mv dropped the dog. what a piece of shit! lying to the judge and investigators once you've accpeted the plea doesn't bode well for ya BC. second.......the DUMBASS goes and gets himself busted smoking pot while waiting sentencing. now just how freakin' stupid can you get????????????? THEEEENNNNNNNNNNNNNNN give different accounts of the pot smoking and how he tested dirty......again lying to the feds after accpeting the plea isn't helping there mv! this guy is just so stupid he can't do what's best for himself.......yet you want to sit here and defend him like he's the almighty to the APBT and has been done wrong by all of society. i say bullshit! he's a complete loser who, IF, didn't have any football skills would have been in prison a long time ago. i'd hate to see the faking of gpa virginia tech had to do to keep him playing ball, cuz it's obvious he doesn't have the brains for college. also in the USA TODAY were quotes by plenty of young black children who feel mv has let them down bad! one said he didn't believe his public apology he made back when he accepted the plea and thought it was all made up to try and help him. i say it's a sad day when children can see the truth, but adults want to stand on half assed principles that really have nothing to do with the truth.

[JuckingFerk]

I have read and seen movies about drug dealers that cater to needs of the people in their neighborhood. For example, around Christmas times they give out presents for the kids and at Thanksgiving they give out turkey dinners. These are kind and generous acts that they perform, but the bottem line is they are still thugs. No matter what good MV has done he is still a thug.

I have not a problem one with anyone that wants to cull a non productive animal. If a horse dont pull a plow, it gets culled. If a cow wont produce milk, it gets culled. If a gelded race horse breaks its leg and cannot race it gets culled. That animal gets culled by a bullet to the head or some of the pink juice, not by being hung, or drown or slammed to the ground. That was out of line and had not call for. A thug is as a thug does and MV showed by his actions he is a sadistic thug.

Ferk out

[FearlessKnight]

oh BC you're so brainwashed it's not even funny. i think there are 2 things clouding your judgement here. first of all you live in atlanta. of course mv is a hero to most there for his football talent. pure and simple. finally something atlanta could be proud of. second, you're black and don't dare want to seem like you sided against somebody who was black. if that's not true sorry, but it sure seems like it when you post. i don't think you're a racist or anything don't take it that way, i just think you feel like you have to defend him for the reasons given. if you bother to pick up the USA TODAY there is some good info in there on WHY vick got the time he got....which also may go to the thug thing somewhat also. the judge said he didn't believe mv fully accepted responsibility. which i'm sure you will disagree with, BUT the reason the judge said this is because when he accepted the plea he said he DID participate in the killing of dogs, and in the pre-sentence investigation he said he DIDN'T participate in it. OK MV WHICH IS IT? it is in written testimony that he carried a dog that lost to one of the co-defendants. the co-defendant placed a rope around the dogs neck, and mv dropped the dog. what a piece of shit! lying to the judge and investigators once you've accpeted the plea doesn't bode well for ya BC. second.......the DUMBASS goes and gets himself busted smoking pot while waiting sentencing. now just how freakin' stupid can you get????????????? THEEEENNNNNNNNNNNNNNN give different accounts of the pot smoking and how he tested dirty......again lying to the feds after accpeting the plea isn't helping there mv! this guy is just so stupid he can't do what's best for himself.......yet you want to sit here and defend him like he's the almighty to the APBT and has been done wrong by all of society. i say bullshit! he's a complete loser who, IF, didn't have any football skills would have been in prison a long time ago. i'd hate to see the faking of gpa virginia tech had to do to keep him playing ball, cuz it's obvious he doesn't have the brains for college. also in the USA TODAY were quotes by plenty of young black children who feel mv has let them down bad! one said he didn't believe his public apology he made back when he accepted the plea and thought it was all made up to try and help him. i say it's a sad day when children can see the truth, but adults want to stand on half assed principles that really have nothing to do with the truth.holy geezards...lucy!

[Michele]

holy geezards...lucy!
I went blind from that..LMAOO

[ABK]

oh BC you're so brainwashed it's not even funny. i think there are 2 things clouding your judgement here. first of all you live in atlanta. of course mv is a hero to most there for his football talent. pure and simple. finally something atlanta could be proud of. second, you're black and don't dare want to seem like you sided against somebody who was black. if that's not true sorry, but it sure seems like it when you post. i don't think you're a racist or anything don't take it that way, i just think you feel like you have to defend him for the reasons given. if you bother to pick up the USA TODAY there is some good info in there on WHY vick got the time he got....which also may go to the thug thing somewhat also. the judge said he didn't believe mv fully accepted responsibility. which i'm sure you will disagree with, BUT the reason the judge said this is because when he accepted the plea he said he DID participate in the killing of dogs, and in the pre-sentence investigation he said he DIDN'T participate in it. OK MV WHICH IS IT? it is in written testimony that he carried a dog that lost to one of the co-defendants. the co-defendant placed a rope around the dogs neck, and mv dropped the dog. what a piece of shit! lying to the judge and investigators once you've accpeted the plea doesn't bode well for ya BC. second.......the DUMBASS goes and gets himself busted smoking pot while waiting sentencing. now just how freakin' stupid can you get????????????? THEEEENNNNNNNNNNNNNNN give different accounts of the pot smoking and how he tested dirty......again lying to the feds after accpeting the plea isn't helping there mv! this guy is just so stupid he can't do what's best for himself.......yet you want to sit here and defend him like he's the almighty to the APBT and has been done wrong by all of society. i say bullshit! he's a complete loser who, IF, didn't have any football skills would have been in prison a long time ago. i'd hate to see the faking of gpa virginia tech had to do to keep him playing ball, cuz it's obvious he doesn't have the brains for college. also in the USA TODAY were quotes by plenty of young black children who feel mv has let them down bad! one said he didn't believe his public apology he made back when he accepted the plea and thought it was all made up to try and help him. i say it's a sad day when children can see the truth, but adults want to stand on half assed principles that really have nothing to do with the truth.WHEEEEEE!!!! ***** Five rep point stars to you BB!!!!

(Yeah, I set up my own rep system. lol.) :D

[Titch_Pitbull]

He did not even fight the dogs. Just "bankrolled" the operation as they say. We got people Buying/importing crack that hits the streets get a lesser sentance

[Michele]

He did not even fight the dogs. Just "bankrolled" the operation as they say. We got people Buying/importing crack that hits the streets get a lesser sentance
He hanged a dog. That's a damn crime. So is drowning them and so is electrocuting them. And so is dogfighting, whether he actually was present at these events or not, he was involved. And MV did get a lesser sentence than 5 years, unfortunately.

[Grizzly]

oh BC you're so brainwashed it's not even funny. i think there are 2 things clouding your judgement here. first of all you live in atlanta. of course mv is a hero to most there for his football talent. pure and simple. finally something atlanta could be proud of. second, you're black and don't dare want to seem like you sided against somebody who was black. if that's not true sorry, but it sure seems like it when you post. i don't think you're a racist or anything don't take it that way, i just think you feel like you have to defend him for the reasons given. if you bother to pick up the USA TODAY there is some good info in there on WHY vick got the time he got....which also may go to the thug thing somewhat also. the judge said he didn't believe mv fully accepted responsibility. which i'm sure you will disagree with, BUT the reason the judge said this is because when he accepted the plea he said he DID participate in the killing of dogs, and in the pre-sentence investigation he said he DIDN'T participate in it. OK MV WHICH IS IT? it is in written testimony that he carried a dog that lost to one of the co-defendants. the co-defendant placed a rope around the dogs neck, and mv dropped the dog. what a piece of shit! lying to the judge and investigators once you've accpeted the plea doesn't bode well for ya BC. second.......the DUMBASS goes and gets himself busted smoking pot while waiting sentencing. now just how freakin' stupid can you get????????????? THEEEENNNNNNNNNNNNNNN give different accounts of the pot smoking and how he tested dirty......again lying to the feds after accpeting the plea isn't helping there mv! this guy is just so stupid he can't do what's best for himself.......yet you want to sit here and defend him like he's the almighty to the APBT and has been done wrong by all of society. i say bullshit! he's a complete loser who, IF, didn't have any football skills would have been in prison a long time ago. i'd hate to see the faking of gpa virginia tech had to do to keep him playing ball, cuz it's obvious he doesn't have the brains for college. also in the USA TODAY were quotes by plenty of young black children who feel mv has let them down bad! one said he didn't believe his public apology he made back when he accepted the plea and thought it was all made up to try and help him. i say it's a sad day when children can see the truth, but adults want to stand on half assed principles that really have nothing to do with the truth.5 Star ***** rep to you BoogiemanBlood !! Once again an excellent post!!

[BullDozer]

Well I can appreciate a good debate about Morality just as much as the next person but it is much easier to be so one sided about an issue when you do not take the time to understand from a different perspective.

Our court system judges everything in black and white with an attempt to keep things fair however these issues are rarely black and white. What Michael Vick is psychologically and monetarily losing is a loss very incomparable to any other charge in this similar arena. It is also a loss several hundred times what he cohorts have lost with their charge exactly the same. The millions of dollars is in the uncountable - the blow to his self-perception - unimaginable.<O:p</O:p

Another thing folks usually forget to see is that you cannot imagine what his life must be like. Most of the members on this board will achieve a modest at best lifestyle, while his daily life was one of a living idol. Where do you think this was created? In fact we as a country and idiolistic society are most definitely partly to blame for the failures of Michael Vick - WE HELPED CREATE HIM! People are very much who they are as individuals; there is no denying that, however - people are also defined by how they are seen by others, or how they see others viewing themselves. I often wonder while watching these superstars how difficult it must be to maintain a level head and live a virtuous life with such power. My opinion is that most people given great power can be tempted into doing things they otherwise could not be capable of. Take a look at most government politicians!<O:p</O:p

I know there are some members in here who have committed no transgressions against animals, however there are members here who very likely poisoned mice to rid them of burden, caught and killed rabbits and other rodents that infested their gardens and who hunt wild game. As a matter of fact most here benefit from the luxuries of animal meat and flesh on a daily basis, more often because it is more pleasurable to the senses, or it achieves a certain type of arousal. I would be curious to know how many have visited a factory farm to make sure these kind animals where disposed of in a “humane” manner before they grilled them and added some A1 sauce. So please - it is hard to understand such a compassion for animals without compassion for all of them. Where do you draw the line? Is it because you feed it or give it a name that the animal becomes human to you? Maybe it is the dependency, like a child. Or you feel you have a responsibility, well last I remembered we where put in charge of all animals. I won’t expound further upon that.<O:p</O:p

Now if we could jump into the head and experience what Michael Vick was going through at these moments where he reportedly finished off these dogs - you might be surprised to see what he felt. If it was happiness and enjoyment then by all means morally I would say that is wrong to feel happiness or joy to submit another animal to punishment for one's own pleasure. However - what if it was a feeling of obligation - of guilt, of a person who was just trying to be the Michael Vick everyone always "knew" he was: a strong, confident, unrelentless, never backing from challenge, touchdown scoring, pain enduring athlete, super idol that happened to take the form of a human being? Than I would have to say we need to look more at a problem amongst society than just at Michael Vick. As Michael Vick could probably tell you though, people don’t see superstar athletes as those also supposed to possess other feelings like remorse and be scared and too weak to make smart decisions instead of impulsive ones.<O:p</O:p

I can't imagine having that much power and also having my life in the hands of so many people who owned a part of me, so all I can say is I think there is more here than many of us will ever understand. But when a person is going to jail for 23 months that is probably many times what most of us here could ever imagine - and no one should be happy about it.<O:p</O:p

Anyhow – I’d love to continue but the real reason I am typing this is just to hopefully provoke some thoughtful discussion out of more of a one sided bashing. I honestly myself am not a fan of Michael Vick – more of just a fan of people not having their lives ruined over public opinion. However, I do think he is being punished severely for his actions and most likely he’ll never do it again… lol.<O:p</O:p

<O:p</O:p

[ABK]

Good post Bull Dozer, but I have to disagree. Here is why:

- We did not create Vick. His upbringing & his parents did. If it were merely fame & fourtune who made him the way he is, why are not superstars like Madonna or Sean Connery out strangling dogs?

- His losses are comparable to anyone elses. Yes, Vick lost millions - but he also had millions to lose. However if ole backwoods Bubba Joe who live in a house trailer & got paid minimum wage gets caught he will not lose millions but he'll likely lose thousands. In the end, both are broke. Furthermore, Bubba Joe will probably lose not only money but his house & car as well, while Vick will not. Thus, Vick still comes out the winner.

- As for how we treat animals, I think everyone here has realistic view about how our food comes to be. What they take issue w/ is not that the animals were dispatched, but in the MANNER in how it was done. I'm sure if the folks here who are crying out against Vick found out that chicken & cows they ate for dinner were stomped to death, they'd be just as outraged. Culling & killing is needed for a sound breeding program & the production of food, there is NO reason whatsoever for it to be done in a cruel manner.

Well, SSS but that is just my take on it. I'd write more, but the hubby is home. :rolleyes:

[simms]

He did not even fight the dogs. Just "bankrolled" the operation as they say. We got people Buying/importing crack that hits the streets get a lesser sentance
True.......

[Dred Lok Kennels]

Good post Bull Dozer, but I have to disagree. Here is why:

- We did not create Vick. His upbringing & his parents did. If it were merely fame & fourtune who made him the way he is, why are not superstars like Madonna or Sean Connery out strangling dogs?

- His losses are comparable to anyone elses. Yes, Vick lost millions - but he also had millions to lose. However if ole backwoods Bubba Joe who live in a house trailer & get paid minimum wages gets caught he will not lose millions but he'll likely lose thousands. In the end, both are broke. Furthermore, Bubba Joe will probably lose not only money but his house & car as well, while Vick will not. Thus, Vick still comes out the winner.

- As for how we treat animals, I think everyone here has realistic view about how our food comes to be. What they take issue w/ is not that the animals was dispatched, but in the MANNER in how it was done. I'm sure if the folks here who are crying out against Vick found out that chicken & cows they ate for dinner were stomped to death, they'd be just as outraged. Culling & killing is needed for a sound breeding program & the production of food, there is NO reason whatsoever for it to be done in a cruel manner.

Well, SSS but that is just my take on it. I'd write more, but the hubby is home. :rolleyes:I really don't care what happens to Mr. Vick, but if I did this would be along the lines that I would put it...........

Except for the hubby part :) just my 2 cents............

[ABK]

He pled to FIGHTING. His lawyer would not have advised him to take the plea unless there was enough evidence to convict.

And as for the drug dealer thing, there are also drug dealers who get sentences as long or longer than Vick's!

[Marty]

Readers react to Vick sentencing

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22192191/

[BullDozer]

Good post Bull Dozer, but I have to disagree. Here is why:

- We did not create Vick. His upbringing & his parents did. If it were merely fame & fourtune who made him the way he is, why are not superstars like Madonna or Sean Connery out strangling dogs?
Lucky for all of us human people the developmental process stretches through your entire lifespan until at the end you learn to adapt and change for death. As for my wife, who's last remaining parent died on her 16th birthday, she was lucky to be able to move on and grow spiritually and learn who she was during this and through this, and I thank my lucky stars everytime I am reminded of this. Yes, I can say as fact the developmental process does not begin and end with parenting. Matter of a fact if the two dollar lottery ticket I bought today at work cashes in big enough, I can guarantee some developmental change by tomorrow afternoon.

- His losses are comparable to anyone elses. Yes, Vick lost millions - but he also had millions to lose. However if ole backwoods Bubba Joe who live in a house trailer & got paid minimum wage gets caught he will not lose millions but he'll likely lose thousands. In the end, both are broke. Furthermore, Bubba Joe will probably lose not only money but his house & car as well, while Vick will not. Thus, Vick still comes out the winner.
If I have two dollars in to my name and I loose it all, is this the same as the Warren Buffet going bankrupt. Thank god not. Life would be pretty depressing for us all. Thank god if there are more celebrities doing these things with dogs it had not been found out. Or there was more favorable news that day. ps. I think Vick has lost his cars and in the process of losing homes as we speak!

- As for how we treat animals, I think everyone here has realistic view about how our food comes to be. What they take issue w/ is not that the animals were dispatched, but in the MANNER in how it was done. I'm sure if the folks here who are crying out against Vick found out that chicken & cows they ate for dinner were stomped to death, they'd be just as outraged. Culling & killing is needed for a sound breeding program & the production of food, there is NO reason whatsoever for it to be done in a cruel manner.
I am not sure what constitutes cruel to you but you might want to investigate that statement a bit more.

Well, SSS but that is just my take on it. I'd write more, but the hubby is home. :rolleyes:Thanks - and no my post was far from rock solid but these wouldn't be the areas I would say are without basis. :)

[ColbyDogs]

He pled to FIGHTING. His lawyer would not have advised him to take the plea unless there was enough evidence to convict.

And as for the drug dealer thing, there are also drug dealers who get sentences as long or longer than Vick's!
Your preaching to the chior on that note LOL. I feel zero remorse for MV. I see there are alot of people on both sides here, there was an incident that happened here on the boards in the past involving a pup that was starved to death. Most folks here were outraged, what i want to know is where is all that outrage for the hanging and beating of MV culls ? I understand why some stick up for what he was doing, given the past from which our dogs came from I see that side of it however I do not recall the dogmen of old culling in such bad fasion.

As far as the comment on us making MV who he is ? Please, he made himself like that. I don't see Peyton Manning out busting caps off in the bars nor have I heard of him running any kind of ilegal operations.

And for those of you who think he got the shaft think again, there are quite a few more cases of people getting alot more time than what MV got and alot of those weren't even federal cases. Mikey got off pretty easy concidering the charges vs the penalties, he only got less than half of what could've been a 5 year stretch.

[ColbyDogs]

If I have two dollars in to my name and I loose it all, is this the same as the Warren Buffet going bankrupt. Thank god not. Life would be pretty depressing for us all. Thank god if there are more celebrities doing these things with dogs it had not been found out. Or there was more favorable news that day. ps. I think Vick has lost his cars and in the process of losing homes as we speak!

I agree with ATK , if your only worth 5 thousand dollars and you lose it all your broke period, it doesn't matter how much you started with your on the welfare line now looking for handouts. As far as MV losing money, thats just too damn bad. He breached his contract with the Falcons and he should lose what ever money the paid him. They paid him for a service that he can no longer perform, how is that fair to the company that bought his services ? Are they not out money too ? The Atlanta Falcons are now out of alot more money than MV is thats for damn sure and for what , for thier star QB to operate an ilegal operation making alot less money than he was making playing football ? So if MV is out alot of money he only has himself to blame.

[BullDozer]

I agree with ATK , if your only worth 5 thousand dollars and you lose it all your broke period, it doesn't matter how much you started with your on the welfare line now looking for handouts. As far as MV losing money, thats just too damn bad. He breached his contract with the Falcons and he should lose what ever money the paid him. They paid him for a service that he can no longer perform, how is that fair to the company that bought his services ? Are they not out money too ? The Atlanta Falcons are now out of alot more money than MV is thats for damn sure and for what , for thier star QB to operate an ilegal operation making alot less money than he was making playing football ? So if MV is out alot of money he only has himself to blame.I think you are missing the point which is when you have alot to lose, it is a much bigger impact than than if you are without. I find it fascinating that youi cannot see that. However, let me try and make this easier to understand. When you are on top of the world and have cars, money, women, and anything you could ask for and then you have nothing, you have just lost MORE than if you were a homeless bumb that lost a wallet with nothing in it. I think if you can agree with this maybe we can meet in the middle. Michael Vick lost more than any animal "abuser" in history because he had more to loose. SIMPLE! Therefore his leaching friends who went down for the same crime recieved LESS punishment because they had LESS to lose. So it is hardly comparable to lose 200 million and 23 months to losing the clothes on your back and 18. Understand? ;) Actually, if you ever watched an NFL game, bought a Jersey or hat, you unknowingly backed his illegal operation as well. So it is really not about the backing, just the knowledgeable support of it.

[ColbyDogs]

I think you are missing the point which is when you have alot to lose, it is a much bigger impact than than if you are without. I find it fascinating that youi cannot see that. However, let me try and make this easier to understand. When you are on top of the world and have cars, money, women, and anything you could ask for and then you have nothing, you have just lost MORE than if you were a homeless bumb that lost a wallet with nothing in it. I think if you can agree with this maybe we can meet in the middle. Michael Vick lost more than any animal "abuser" in history because he had more to loose. SIMPLE! Therefore his leaching friends who went down for the same crime recieved LESS punishment because they had LESS to lose. So it is hardly comparable to lose 200 million and 23 months to losing the clothes on your back and 18. Understand? ;)
I'm not gonna get into a pissing contest here but what your saying is no different than what some other folks have gone through, myself included. Just because I didn't have the money MV had/has didn't lessin the blow. I too lost cars, money, freinds, girls and my house over the crimes I commited. In the end I was pratically broke and never again to live the life style I was living. So it doesn't matter how much money i lost, too me it was more than I could have dreamed of at the time. When its all gone its gone, it sucks to start life over again regardless of the dollar amount that was lost.

[XxKonnectionsxX]

I feel that this whole MV incident has been blown WAAAAAY out of proportion. They wanted him to look like a criminal and they were successful. That man lost EVERYTHING.. I'm sure he had a stash of money somewhere, but still the point is, he has lost his dignity, fame, etc. They pretty much took his balls and threw them against the wall.. SPLAT!! 23 months for being associated with DOG FIGHTING is silly. Why get so much time? Isn't it crazy how rapists, murders, and these crazy ass pedofiles can do what they do and then get off the hook, but if you get caught fighting a couple of dogs, then you get locked up for some serious time and get hit with all sorts of fines to make sure you are broke. Our govt. is pretty much full of shit if you ask me. America...LOL yeah ok.. WOW home of the brave...Land of the free... what a crock of shit.

This has nothing to do with race or anything.. Our country is just twisted. Kinda like a pair of filthy crap streaked drawls turned inside out. To me thats what it is. Yeah we have rights, but how long are we going to have the few rights that we have. Its like trying to hold a stick of hot melting butter in your hands..And being a man of color, well you that know know how that goes.. Rights are already damn near thrown out the window.

It really amazes me how some people on here are snarling at him by saying.." He fought dogs... whine whine whine.. SO WHAT!! There are more things in life to be sweatin than a bunch of people fighting dogs. Hell my firends chow chows got into a fight in the middle of the street and people walked by like it was nothing. If it had been two pitbulls animal control would have confiscated the dogs and I'm sure raided his home...Since when did animals have more rights than people.. LOL.. Thats crazy. Some of you need to look in the mirror and make sure you aren't an animal yourselves. Who ever supports PETA or any other animal organization of that nature should be bashed against a wall or something, because IMO their minds are more twisted than a dogfighter.. LOL.

When did it become such a huge crime to kill a dog versus killing other live stock. People really need to grow up and look at the bigger picture here. Anyone who is on the side of the judge and all these other animal activists are just BRAIN WASHED. Why do dope dealers get lesser senteces than a dog fighter? Why did the child molester up the street from us get 6 months jail time and 1 year probation for raping a BABY!!! Someone please answer that for me, because I'm really confused about that. I guess thats "normal" for some here. I guarantee we have pedaphiles(hope I spelled it right) on this board as we speak. I'm sure there are some members of this board who probably deal a few drugs here and there as well. I'm sure theres a member or two on here who have raped someone. Trust me you never know who is who.

I know I just rambled, but this whole situation is just crazy to me......I guess I'm better off murdering a person than a dog huh...

GOOD OLE US of A

[BullDozer]

I'm not gonna get into a pissing contest here but what your saying is no different than what some other folks have gone through, myself included. Just because I didn't have the money MV had/has didn't lessin the blow. I too lost cars, money, freinds, girls and my house over the crimes I commited. In the end I was pratically broke and never again to live the life style I was living. So it doesn't matter how much money i lost, too me it was more than I could have dreamed of at the time. When its all gone its gone, it sucks to start life over again regardless of the dollar amount that was lost.No pissing match here. I was never/currently am not a Vick fan. The only reason I was willing to post is because I see quite a few people here with big hearts for the dogs obviously relating to their plight and I am not saying they are wrong. I just don't understand how someone with a big heart for the dogs has such a hard time relating to another HUMAN being who is going through something pretty terrible as well. It is not a good situation for either the dogs or M. Vick, but here if you relate more to a dog than a person I think you must be the dog whisperer or something. Like I said before I am not trying to say anyone is right or wrong but there is always two sides to a debate not one and to understand and debate you have to sympathise with both sides you just can't show supporting information for one arguement it shows you are bias in the whole situation. Hey, I understand it is easy to hate a successful person and be happy when they fall, that is why I don't watch "Cribs" anymore!

[bullydogs]

oh BC you're so brainwashed it's not even funny. i think there are 2 things clouding your judgement here. first of all you live in atlanta. of course mv is a hero to most there for his football talent. pure and simple. finally something atlanta could be proud of. second, you're black and don't dare want to seem like you sided against somebody who was black. if that's not true sorry, but it sure seems like it when you post. i don't think you're a racist or anything don't take it that way, i just think you feel like you have to defend him for the reasons given. if you bother to pick up the USA TODAY there is some good info in there on WHY vick got the time he got....which also may go to the thug thing somewhat also. the judge said he didn't believe mv fully accepted responsibility. which i'm sure you will disagree with, BUT the reason the judge said this is because when he accepted the plea he said he DID participate in the killing of dogs, and in the pre-sentence investigation he said he DIDN'T participate in it. OK MV WHICH IS IT? it is in written testimony that he carried a dog that lost to one of the co-defendants. the co-defendant placed a rope around the dogs neck, and mv dropped the dog. what a piece of shit! lying to the judge and investigators once you've accpeted the plea doesn't bode well for ya BC. second.......the DUMBASS goes and gets himself busted smoking pot while waiting sentencing. now just how freakin' stupid can you get????????????? THEEEENNNNNNNNNNNNNNN give different accounts of the pot smoking and how he tested dirty......again lying to the feds after accpeting the plea isn't helping there mv! this guy is just so stupid he can't do what's best for himself.......yet you want to sit here and defend him like he's the almighty to the APBT and has been done wrong by all of society. i say bullshit! he's a complete loser who, IF, didn't have any football skills would have been in prison a long time ago. i'd hate to see the faking of gpa virginia tech had to do to keep him playing ball, cuz it's obvious he doesn't have the brains for college. also in the USA TODAY were quotes by plenty of young black children who feel mv has let them down bad! one said he didn't believe his public apology he made back when he accepted the plea and thought it was all made up to try and help him. i say it's a sad day when children can see the truth, but adults want to stand on half assed principles that really have nothing to do with the truth.Man great post, i tryed so hard to not reply to this thread. I said nah, this topic is alittle to touchy. I just dont understand why so many people are comparing what MV did to other cases or crimes. I am pretty sure everyone agrees that the justice system sometimes fails. However, MV brought all this chit on himself. POINT BLANK. The guy cant spell the word Truth. Continually, lie after lie, i dont believe he is sorry one bit. I believe he is sorry he got caught. I hope everday feels like 20 for MV. I am glad he got culled out for 23 months.

[redripper]

I have to bring it up again folks. It's not about mike vick. It's not about defending the man or not. It's not even about how he culled the animals, even though his choice of method is disgusting and makes him a bad fella in my opinion. It's about the fact that the federal government shouldn't have the right to put a man in jail for how he decides to cull his stock. I can't beleive people on here are coming with this hanging a dog is criminal stuff. Sure it's illegal, but it shouldn't be. Granted it's sick, but the government is created to protect you'r life liberty and PROPERTY. Dogs are property! My dogs are members of my family, but if I want to kill them tommorow that shouldn't be a crime. Who's rights has he violated? Who has he harmed? Where do dog rights come from? At most, someone will be offended...but you're desire to not be offended should not invade another's right to use his property in whatever private manner he sees fit. Come on folks they are sentencing people to 100 yrs in prison now for having "heavy chains," "parting sticks," and alot of dogs, and people everywhere are applauding that action. Granted, MV is a lot less sympathetic, but the principle is the same. people are so emotional and so passionate about protecting furry little creatures that they are blind to human rights. Mike vick broke the law...he was stupid...but the law is stupid and the sentence is unjust as a result. If you can't see that...I don't know what to tell you. But it's a slippery slope, remember PETA and the other folks that push for these federal laws and harsh punishments want total animal liberation. That means no meat, no fur, and no pets. MV may be a bad guy and may have been dumb to openly break the law, but 23 months for something he should have the right to do if he so chooses is outrageous. There are alot of things I don't like, but I don't want people locked up for them.

[Grizzly]

Well I can appreciate a good debate about Morality just as much as the next person but it is much easier to be so one sided about an issue when you do not take the time to understand from a different perspective.

Our court system judges everything in black and white with an attempt to keep things fair however these issues are rarely black and white. What Michael Vick is psychologically and monetarily losing is a loss very incomparable to any other charge in this similar arena. It is also a loss several hundred times what he cohorts have lost with their charge exactly the same. The millions of dollars is in the uncountable - the blow to his self-perception - unimaginable.<O:p</O:p

Another thing folks usually forget to see is that you cannot imagine what his life must be like. Most of the members on this board will achieve a modest at best lifestyle, while his daily life was one of a living idol. Where do you think this was created? In fact we as a country and idiolistic society are most definitely partly to blame for the failures of Michael Vick - WE HELPED CREATE HIM! People are very much who they are as individuals; there is no denying that, however - people are also defined by how they are seen by others, or how they see others viewing themselves. I often wonder while watching these superstars how difficult it must be to maintain a level head and live a virtuous life with such power. My opinion is that most people given great power can be tempted into doing things they otherwise could not be capable of. Take a look at most government politicians!<O:p</O:p

I know there are some members in here who have committed no transgressions against animals, however there are members here who very likely poisoned mice to rid them of burden, caught and killed rabbits and other rodents that infested their gardens and who hunt wild game. As a matter of fact most here benefit from the luxuries of animal meat and flesh on a daily basis, more often because it is more pleasurable to the senses, or it achieves a certain type of arousal. I would be curious to know how many have visited a factory farm to make sure these kind animals where disposed of in a “humane” manner before they grilled them and added some A1 sauce. So please - it is hard to understand such a compassion for animals without compassion for all of them. Where do you draw the line? Is it because you feed it or give it a name that the animal becomes human to you? Maybe it is the dependency, like a child. Or you feel you have a responsibility, well last I remembered we where put in charge of all animals. I won’t expound further upon that.<O:p</O:p

Now if we could jump into the head and experience what Michael Vick was going through at these moments where he reportedly finished off these dogs - you might be surprised to see what he felt. If it was happiness and enjoyment then by all means morally I would say that is wrong to feel happiness or joy to submit another animal to punishment for one's own pleasure. However - what if it was a feeling of obligation - of guilt, of a person who was just trying to be the Michael Vick everyone always "knew" he was: a strong, confident, unrelentless, never backing from challenge, touchdown scoring, pain enduring athlete, super idol that happened to take the form of a human being? Than I would have to say we need to look more at a problem amongst society than just at Michael Vick. As Michael Vick could probably tell you though, people don’t see superstar athletes as those also supposed to possess other feelings like remorse and be scared and too weak to make smart decisions instead of impulsive ones.<O:p</O:p

I can't imagine having that much power and also having my life in the hands of so many people who owned a part of me, so all I can say is I think there is more here than many of us will ever understand. But when a person is going to jail for 23 months that is probably many times what most of us here could ever imagine - and no one should be happy about it.<O:p</O:p

Anyhow – I’d love to continue but the real reason I am typing this is just to hopefully provoke some thoughtful discussion out of more of a one sided bashing. I honestly myself am not a fan of Michael Vick – more of just a fan of people not having their lives ruined over public opinion. However, I do think he is being punished severely for his actions and most likely he’ll never do it again… lol.<O:p</O:p

<O:p</O:pWhat in the world are you talking about!!
You Say........"We're partly to blame for Michael Vic's crime!!" We helped create him!!! the blow to poor, poor Michael Vic's self-perception!!!! "how difficult it must be to maintain a level head and live a virtuous life with such power". I feel so sorry for him!!!!! I did not realize so much of this was MY FAULT!!!

You say.... "As a matter of fact most here benefit from the luxuries of animal meat and flesh on a daily basis, more often because it is more pleasurable to the senses, or it achieves a certain type of arousal . You gotta help me with that one...maybe I should start feeding my wife an all meat diet!!!!!

You say....."we should consider what Michael Vic was going through in his head at the time he committed the crime"(remorse, scared and too weak to make smart decisions instead of impulsive ones). Should we<O:p</O:p worry and concern ourselves with how everyone convicted of a crime felt in their head at the time they broke the law???? I believe he felt like he could pull it off.

You say....." I can't imagine having that much power and also having my life in the hands of so many people who owned a part of me, so all I can say is I think there is more here than many of us will ever understand." I'd like to give it a shot...maybe just for a little while!!!

Why has Michael Vic been convicted!!!!! It should be us doing the time...after all, it's our fault. He's just a poor mis-understood rich man.

[Titch_Pitbull]

I hope he survives jail and gets his life back together when he comes out.

I think the courts have failed us in many aspects this one included. We have become deluded and so self obsessed with animal rights that we have forgotten our rights as humans.

[bullydogs]

It's about the fact that the federal government shouldn't have the right to put a man in jail for how he decides to cull his stock. I can't beleive people on here are coming with this hanging a dog is criminal stuff. Sure it's illegal, but it shouldn't be. Oh my, hanging dogs should be legal...are you funking kiddin me. These couple of sentences take the cake.:mad:

[redripper]

Oh my, hanging dogs should be legal...are you funking kiddin me. These couple of sentences take the cake.:mad:
Is it sick? yes. Would I do it? of course not. But you're gonna have to explain to me in a rational way based on logic and not emotion why it should be illegal. Trust me, if you can do that I'll jump right on the bandwagon. I love animals. I want to protect them if I can. But I draw the line when I think the government is getting involved where it doesn't have the right.

[LuvinBullies]

I have been really avoiding this thread. But here it goes since every one seems to want the last word I'll throw my thoughts out there, too. I feel that this whole MV incident has been blown WAAAAAY out of proportion. They wanted him to look like a criminal and they were successful. That man lost EVERYTHING.. I'm sure he had a stash of money somewhere, but still the point is, he has lost his dignity, fame, etc. They pretty much took his balls and threw them against the wall.. SPLAT!! I agree that it's all been blown way out of proportion by the masses but it's the ripple effect which has been devastating. The collateral damage will know no end- legitimate breeders everywhere now must fear they will lose EVERYTHING...they are the real ones who stand to lose the most. MV handed over his dignity (and cohones) on a silver platter when he cozied up to Ingrid Newkirk. I would have had a lot more respect if he woulda just said "ya caught me, damn it man.". But you see...he did not. He cut deals, he danced the dance. If "they" woulda had out their shoes he woulda been a shinin' them to get out of trouble. We will probably see him on Animal Planet within a year doing a PSA. He is a CELEBRITY- one of the fortunates who really got a leg up in life- it's just plain common sense to anyone who has ever indulged with an 'Enquirer' magazine to know that celebrities are under the magnifying glass. Nobody felt sorry for Whitney Houston when she got caught smokin' the crack. She shoulda lost a helluva lot more than she did, too. MV didn't lose a thing- he flushed it down the crapper, period.
23 months for being associated with DOG FIGHTING is silly. Why get so much time? Isn't it crazy how rapists, murders, and these crazy ass pedofiles can do what they do and then get off the hook, but if you get caught fighting a couple of dogs, then you get locked up for some serious time and get hit with all sorts of fines to make sure you are broke. Our govt. is pretty much full of shit if you ask me. America...LOL yeah ok.. WOW home of the brave...Land of the free... what a crock of shit. Yes yes...nothing is logical in this country anymore...but you see if the jackass wouldn't have been playing dirty he wouldn't have got caught. Friggin' paparrazi dangle from trees to get shots of celebrities in candid moments...and they also pay people darn good money to sell them stories. He knew this, and if he didn't he's more of a jackass than I thought he was. MV isn't a babe in the woods here- he knew what was at stake and he chose to gamble it all. Double or nothing and he lost. At the end of the day he still admitted to disgusting allegations and he also hopped into bed with Ingrid Newkirk to try and smooth things over. He's an even bigger wuss for that.

This has nothing to do with race or anything.. Our country is just twisted. Kinda like a pair of filthy crap streaked drawls turned inside out. To me thats what it is. Yeah we have rights, but how long are we going to have the few rights that we have. Its like trying to hold a stick of hot melting butter in your hands..And being a man of color, well you that know know how that goes.. Rights are already damn near thrown out the window. I was tempted to edit this part of your post...but I'd hate to be accused of anything so I will simply respond and I hope you will respond back directly.
Put the doggone race card back where it belongs. How can you say this has nothing to do with race yet in the same paragraph refer to yourself as a man of color with no rights? [By the way, Black Caesar is a damn good person and I understand why this issue is a squishy spot for him. He's no more brainwashed than anyone else who looks up to someone who duped them and let them down.] We're always shocked when someone let's us down who we -or our children- look up to. MV was a damn good pioneer for awhile. Kids loved him, "white folk" did too- the whole nine yards. But black, white, red or purple he screwed up big time by being cocky and stupid. Yes it certainly has been a long hard road for black people in america, so let's not forget that or the fact that MV was a symbol of accomplishment and integrity for an entire race. He wasn't just a dumb dude with athletic ability...he was more than that to a lot of folks. Can our caucasian members at least try to make the effort to understand that? Can our african american members try to understand that if he had been Pee Wee friggin' Herman the public woulda been just as ticked off? I can't stand saying that, but the race card is being tossed around from both sides here and I'm over it. Let's do our best to stop it, eh?!
It really amazes me how some people on here are snarling at him by saying.." He fought dogs... whine whine whine.. SO WHAT!! There are more things in life to be sweatin than a bunch of people fighting dogs. I don't know how many times it has to be said:
We really like our dogs. Most here would say we love them. We'd like to keep our dogs. We don't want anybody in a three piece suit passing a law saying we can't have our dogs. Now- when people continue to make headlines breaking the law with our breed of dog it only makes the case for those who want to ban them from existance. If he would have been caught smoking crack or filming kiddie porn with his Pit Bulls I would have been equally (if not more so) horrified. What it comes down to is this: we are trying to save an entire breed from extinction. If you haven't realized that yet then welcome to your reality check. Stop making negative headlines, period. I don't care if you are an ignorant petbull owner or Michael Vick- Stop getting put on the front page bringing negative hype to the dogs we love. Why is that so hard to understand?!

[redripper]

I don't know how many times it has to be said:
We really like our dogs. Most here would say we love them. We'd like to keep our dogs. We don't want anybody in a three piece suit passing a law saying we can't have our dogs. Now- when people continue to make headlines breaking the law with our breed of dog it only makes the case for those who want to ban them from existance. If he would have been caught smoking crack or filming kiddie porn with his Pit Bulls I would have been equally (if not more so) horrified. What it comes down to is this: we are trying to save an entire breed from extinction. If you haven't realized that yet then welcome to your reality check. Stop making negative headlines, period. I don't care if you are an ignorant petbull owner or Michael Vick- Stop getting put on the front page bringing negative hype to the dogs we love. Why is that so hard to understand?!
This is the best thing said so far. A compromise between those of us that think the law is silly and those who think he should fry. Point is MV's actions brought bad press to a breed that's in danger, and we are all more at risk of losing dogs that are very important to us as a result. Good post

[Grizzly]

I have been really avoiding this thread. But here it goes since every one seems to want the last word I'll throw my thoughts out there, too. I agree that it's all been blown way out of proportion by the masses but it's the ripple effect which has been devastating. The collateral damage will know no end- legitimate breeders everywhere now must fear they will lose EVERYTHING...they are the real ones who stand to lose the most. MV handed over his dignity (and cohones) on a silver platter when he cozied up to Ingrid Newkirk. I would have had a lot more respect if he woulda just said "ya caught me, damn it man.". But you see...he did not. He cut deals, he danced the dance. If "they" woulda had out their shoes he woulda been a shinin' them to get out of trouble. We will probably see him on Animal Planet within a year doing a PSA. He is a CELEBRITY- one of the fortunates who really got a leg up in life- it's just plain common sense to anyone who has ever indulged with an 'Enquirer' magazine to know that celebrities are under the magnifying glass. Nobody felt sorry for Whitney Houston when she got caught smokin' the crack. She shoulda lost a helluva lot more than she did, too. MV didn't lose a thing- he flushed it down the crapper, period.
Yes yes...nothing is logical in this country anymore...but you see if the jackass wouldn't have been playing dirty he wouldn't have got caught. Friggin' paparrazi dangle from trees to get shots of celebrities in candid moments...and they also pay people darn good money to sell them stories. He knew this, and if he didn't he's more of a jackass than I thought he was. MV isn't a babe in the woods here- he knew what was at stake and he chose to gamble it all. Double or nothing and he lost. At the end of the day he still admitted to disgusting allegations and he also hopped into bed with Ingrid Newkirk to try and smooth things over. He's an even bigger wuss for that.
I was tempted to edit this part of your post...but I'd hate to be accused of anything so I will simply respond and I hope you will respond back directly.
Put the doggone race card back where it belongs. How can you say this has nothing to do with race yet in the same paragraph refer to yourself as a man of color with no rights? [By the way, Black Caesar is a damn good person and I understand why this issue is a squishy spot for him. He's no more brainwashed than anyone else who looks up to someone who duped them and let them down.] We're always shocked when someone let's us down who we -or our children- look up to. MV was a damn good pioneer for awhile. Kids loved him, "white folk" did too- the whole nine yards. But black, white, red or purple he screwed up big time by being cocky and stupid. Yes it certainly has been a long hard road for black people in america, so let's not forget that or the fact that MV was a symbol of accomplishment and integrity for an entire race. He wasn't just a dumb dude with athletic ability...he was more than that to a lot of folks. Can our caucasian members at least try to make the effort to understand that? Can our african american members try to understand that if he had been Pee Wee friggin' Herman the public woulda been just as ticked off? I can't stand saying that, but the race card is being tossed around from both sides here and I'm over it. Let's do our best to stop it, eh?!
I don't know how many times it has to be said:
We really like our dogs. Most here would say we love them. We'd like to keep our dogs. We don't want anybody in a three piece suit passing a law saying we can't have our dogs. Now- when people continue to make headlines breaking the law with our breed of dog it only makes the case for those who want to ban them from existance. If he would have been caught smoking crack or filming kiddie porn with his Pit Bulls I would have been equally (if not more so) horrified. What it comes down to is this: we are trying to save an entire breed from extinction. If you haven't realized that yet then welcome to your reality check. Stop making negative headlines, period. I don't care if you are an ignorant petbull owner or Michael Vick- Stop getting put on the front page bringing negative hype to the dogs we love. Why is that so hard to understand?!I'll give you the last 5 positive rep stars I have***** for a good post. A good defense of our dogs.

[simms]

I have to bring it up again folks. It's not about mike vick. It's not about defending the man or not. It's not even about how he culled the animals, even though his choice of method is disgusting and makes him a bad fella in my opinion. It's about the fact that the federal government shouldn't have the right to put a man in jail for how he decides to cull his stock. I can't beleive people on here are coming with this hanging a dog is criminal stuff. Sure it's illegal, but it shouldn't be. Granted it's sick, but the government is created to protect you'r life liberty and PROPERTY. Dogs are property! My dogs are members of my family, but if I want to kill them tommorow that shouldn't be a crime. Who's rights has he violated? Who has he harmed? Where do dog rights come from? At most, someone will be offended...but you're desire to not be offended should not invade another