breeding question

[BoiBoi]

Here's a question for those experienced with breeding dogs, i see all the time pictures of dogs locked up and my question is how long do the dogs stay locked up and whats the reason for them staying locked up for so long.

[Pitbull219]

they stay that way until the male is done ejaculating.....usually about 20 minutes I think. The reason for this is in the wild, wolves engaged in procreation would be vulnerable to attack from other predators, so being back to back like that decreases the chance of getting snuck up on.

[jeeperino]

It all depends on the male. When hes done he leaves, how it should be. There is no time limit or anything and 10 mins is about how long u gotta wait. Could be more or less time depending on if hes a minute man or marathon man.

The reason for the tie is because when inside, he swells up like a balloon and the bitch cant escape until the balloon pops inside her.

[BoiBoi]

One thing i've heard and im not sure if there's any truth to it is the reason they stay locked up for a little while is because the male wants to make sure that he is the only one to fertilize her eggs, so he stays in her for a little while to allow his sperm to reach her eggs and fertilize her so no other male can come right behind him and try to get some eggs fertilized with his sperm, does this have any truth to it?

[ABK]

I don't know if there is any truth to that Boi. Mia would probably know the best. But here is what I heard & you can take it for what it is worth.

When a dog ejaculates it consists of 3 stages. The 1st stage is consists of a watery fluid devoid of semen, the 2nd stage is the actual semen & the 3rd stage is the watery fluid again. Because the ejaculate consists of 3 different parts instead of just one, it takes longer for a dog to "finish his business."

They lock up (called a tie) b/c the male dog has a bulb at the base of his penis that swells during intercourse. This prevents the male or female from disengaging while the male is making his "deposit."

Ties, as one poster has already said, vary dog to dog. Some last a few as 5 minutues while others can last as long as 30.

Hope this helps.

[BoiBoi]

Thanks ABK that helps a lot, just was always curious why they stayed tied, oh yea and whats the deal with the dogs facing opposite ways once they're tied, doesn't it hurt the males thingy to twist like that lol

[Michele]

Because the ejaculate consists of 3 different parts instead of just one, it takes longer for a dog to "finish his business."
now why can't it be like this for human men? LOL....

[Pitbull219]

oh yea and whats the deal with the dogs facing opposite ways once they're tied, doesn't it hurt the males thingy to twist like that lolthat's why you have to lift the male up and over very carefully

[Phebes]

A Tie is a natural phenomenon of dog breeding in which the bulbus glandis of the male's penis swells inside the bitch's vagina. The dogs are virtually locked together for 15-20 minutes (2 to 30 minutes is also normal), during which time ejaculation has taken place. The sperm was released at the beginning of the tie. During the tie, he is releasing prostatic fluid.
Don't ever try to force mating dogs apart, once they have 'tied'. It can cause serious injury to either dog.

[DryCreek]

The tie is to ensure there is no leakage of semen therefor enhancing the chances of fertilization.



When copulating (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copulating), a male canine initially mounts the female from behind, as with most tetrapods (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetrapod), a position known informally as doggy style (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doggy_style). The female will hold her tail to the side and allow this if receptive. If unreceptive she may sit or lie down, snap, move away, or otherwise be uncooperative or not allow mating. The male will often move about as he tries to get a good purchase upon her, and whilst attempting penetration (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_penetration) of his penis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penis) to the female's vulva (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vulva). At this point, the penis is not erect (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erection), it is slender and held rigid by a small bone inside, known as the baculum (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baculum).

When the male achieves penetration, he will often hold tighter and thrust faster, and it is at this point when he is mating that the male's penis expands. Canine reproduction is different from human sexual intercourse (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_intercourse), because human males become erect first, and then enter the female; canine males enter first, then swell and become erect.

The male dog has a bulbus glandis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bulbus_glandis), a spherical area of erectile tissue (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erectile_tissue) at the base of the penis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penis), which traps the penis inside the female's vagina (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vagina) during copulation as it becomes engorged with blood. [1] (http://arbl.cvmbs.colostate.edu/hbooks/pathphys/reprod/semeneval/dog.html)

Once the penis is locked into the vagina by the bulbus glandis, the male will usually lift a leg and swing it over the female's back while turning around. The two stand with their hind ends touching and the penis locked inside the vagina while ejaculation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ejaculation) occurs, decreasing leakage of semen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semen) from the vagina. After some time, typically 5 - 20 minutes (but sometimes longer), the bulbus glandis disengorges, allowing the mates to separate.

[ABK]

Phebes - Where did you come across this information that semen is deposited first? I am curious, as I have done several collections for AIs & found that the first fluid deposited was a watery fluid that did not resemble semen in any way.

Further, all text I have read on the matter states dog ejaculate consists of pre-semen first, semen second & prostatic portion last.

[14rock]

Right, however, it doesn't stop other males from fertilizing. Bitches are receptive and fertile, much longer then a 20 minute tie. If 30-40 minutes was the only time bitches could take, can you imagine how few breedings would be successful? Even experienced breeders sometimes miss and don't produce any puppies, when dealing with a few days time frame. Can you imagine 20-30 minute window of opportunity?

[BoiBoi]

Right, however, it doesn't stop other males from fertilizing. Bitches are receptive and fertile, much longer then a 20 minute tie. If 30-40 minutes was the only time bitches could take, can you imagine how few breedings would be successful? Even experienced breeders sometimes miss and don't produce any puppies, when dealing with a few days time frame. Can you imagine 20-30 minute window of opportunity?
In that case how do u determine the correct time to tie them together?

[14rock]

An ovulation test is preferred, with usually a vaginal swab to tell you when is the best day. Unfortunately, we only had a limited ammount of time to breed to him, and we were forced to stick a few days later then our ideal time, and she was no longer ovulating. In a perfect world, we'd be able to swab once, stick it, and be done. Aside from vaginal swabs, there are other signs you can look for, with varying success. Count the days, analyze the discharge, stick every other day and cross your fingers, etc.

Alot of people will breed a dog 10+ times a day, for a few days in a row to "make sure". You may get lucky the first time you bred him, the bitch took, because doing that, will decrease your chances of him getting sperm to her later on. Once the sperm is discharged, it takes awhile to replenish. It varies of course, depending on the dog and who you talk to, but most believe it takes between 24-48 hours for him to be fertile again. Sticking after he ejaculated all his sperm, is counterproductive.

[jadedpitgirl]

In that case how do u determine the correct time to tie them together?
The best way is to do a swab test, unless, you can keep track of the female's cycle. I have heard any where from the 8th day after bleeding and every other day for three days all the way to the 14th day after bleeding and every other day until the female no longer allows the male to breed to her....There are so many different ways you could go with this, LOL. I guess it just depends on breeder preference and previous experience. I have heard some say the more she is stuck, the more pups she will have. Out of the two breedings I have done, we had a female sent to Ga and she was bred 3 times. She had 4 pups. On our second female, she was AI'd one time and she had 8. Personally, I believe it is just luck of the draw when breeding. Your female will either get prego or not:p

Oh yeah, I once talked to someone who said he had two dogs in a tie that lasted almost 45 mins, both dogs were completely exhausted after that and slept for some time. Wether it's true or not who knows:confused:

[Old Timer]

The best way is to do a swab test, unless, you can keep track of the female's cycle. I have heard any where from the 8th day after bleeding and every other day for three days all the way to the 14th day after bleeding and every other day until the female no longer allows the male to breed to her....There are so many different ways you could go with this, LOL. I guess it just depends on breeder preference and previous experience. I have heard some say the more she is stuck, the more pups she will have. Out of the two breedings I have done, we had a female sent to Ga and she was bred 3 times. She had 4 pups. On our second female, she was AI'd one time and she had 8. Personally, I believe it is just luck of the draw when breeding. Your female will either get prego or not:p

Oh yeah, I once talked to someone who said he had two dogs in a tie that lasted almost 45 mins, both dogs were completely exhausted after that and slept for some time. Wether it's true or not who knows:confused:yes it is true for dogs to be tied for that long.i had a male once not finish up for a full hour.thought he was going to stay like that forever.but it just depends on the dog it can last from 1 mintue on and what i do is after they tie i just let them take their time.i don't bother them or nothing i just keep a watchfull eye to make sure neither try to bolt or anything like that.the reason they tie all goes back to nature in a wolf pack only the dominate pair get to breed.and the male ties to give his boys a better chance of reaching the egg and keeping a watchfull eye on the other males and for predators.now when your dogs tie you have got to let them take it at their own speed because the head of it can swell up to the size of a tomato and if you pull him off or the female decides to bolt he can be forever damaged and could possably have to be put down.2 things to remeber is never pull them apart and make sure at least yourself is always present to make sure neither tries to run away.you should have a helper so you can have one on the male and one on the female if your not experinced enough to handle it yourself but even me i still like having my wife with me to just be safe.i once had a female get out of my grip and take off and my poor male just had to go along for the ride thank god he wasn't hurt but he never would breed again.it is not at all uncommon to have a female try and run when she feels the male start to ejaculate it can startle them and if it is her first time they can get even more scared because just as with human females the first time hurts.it is always better if you have a virgin male to back your male into a bitch that has been bred a few times that way everything should go smoothly.but expect and be ready for everything.

[semo]

interesting stuff!

[ABK]

I don't have anyone to help me in any breedings I do, so I myself always tie the female close & snug to an immovable object just to make sure I don't have any bust & run incidents.

As for the head of the male's penis swelling like a tomato, where did you see than old timer? I know the entire penis will swell, most significally the bulb at the base of the penis, but I have not heard of the head swelling so much that it became as bulbous as a tomato.

I agree semo, this IS an interesting thread! I am learning a lot.

[Old Timer]

I don't have anyone to help me in any breedings I do, so I myself always tie the female close & snug to an immovable object just to make sure I don't have any bust & run incidents.

As for the head of the male's penis swelling like a tomato, where did you see that old timer? I know the entire penis will swell, most significally the bulb at the base of the penis, but I have not heard of the head swelling so much that it became as bulbous as a tomato.

I agree semo, this IS an interesting thread! I am learning a lot.i went with a buddy of mine to have a vet collect some on his dog and he did it wrong and the dog ended up finishing on it's self wich is pretty distressing to the dog.but like you said the whole deal swelled up but the head was about the size of a small tomato.

[ABK]

i went with a buddy of mine to have a vet collect some on his dog and he did it wrong and the dog ended up finishing on it's self wich is pretty distressing to the dog.but like you said the whole deal swelled up but the head was about the size of a small tomato.
Oh my! Poor dog! http://www.thesmilies.com/smilies/confused0005.gif

[Turner]

Interesting thread. Slightly.... yucky but interesting :D ;)