What if the Game was Legal now?

[Lethalpits]

Anyone ever wonder what if would be like if the game was actually legal in certain areas or parts of the country nowadays? I was just thinkin' about it, like how many great dogs would actually get to showcase their skills, but how much hell PETA people would be raising.

I think we still have some members here who were into these dogs pre 1979. I wonder how controversial things were then and if it would be 10x worse now.

I figure if a state decided to lift that ban on dog fighting, that would be one popular state lol.

[dog-man]

Da game as in dominoes or monopoly lol....... just j/k, Im have my thoughts on this subject, but way to green to state my opinion on an open forum, will be interesting what the more expierenced on da subject will say.

[Lethalpits]

Da game as in dominoes or monopoly lol....... just j/k, Im have my thoughts on this subject, but way to green to state my opinion on an open forum, will be interesting what the more expierenced on da subject will say.
I thought about that lol, but I figured it'd be okay to wonder.

[Scratchy]

IMO, I'm glad it isn't legal because there'd be more dumba$$es into the sport than there are dumba$$es into the breed. Of course there would be that large population that would get into the sport and screw things up by not sticking to the original rules and breeding would three times. IMHO, I think since it's illegal it helps control dumba$$es.

[Lethalpits]

IMO, I'm glad it isn't legal because there'd be more dumba$$es into the sport than there are dumba$$es into the breed. Of course there would be that large population that would get into the sport and screw things up by not sticking to the original rules and breeding would three times. IMHO, I think since it's illegal it helps control dumba$$es.
That's a good oberservation, never thought about it like that.

[simms]

IMO, I'm glad it isn't legal because there'd be more dumba$$es into the sport than there are dumba$$es into the breed. Of course there would be that large population that would get into the sport and screw things up by not sticking to the original rules and breeding would three times. IMHO, I think since it's illegal it helps control dumba$$es.

I dont think it would make things worse. infact I think more folk would get called to the carpet so to speak...acountability. Might clean this breed up...or ppls breeding practices.

[Michele]

I agree with Scratchy. IMO, i think there would be more problems than the ones now (BSL). I'd say alot of people that have this breed now should not have them. Could you imagine if certain things were legal? I think it would be mass chaos and BSL would be nothing compared to what would happen.

[Scratchy]

I dont think it would make things worse. infact I think more folk would get called to the carpet so to speak...acountability. Might clean this breed up...or ppls breeding practices.
I'd have to disagree because yeah more people could and would get called out, but they would just keep acquiring dogs until they found one with a certain color or size that had the go they're are looking for. Hell, some already think they have dogs that could hold it down against any other dog. It's not like people would all of sudden be interested in the facts of the breeds standards or the rules of the [].

[simms]

I agree with Scratchy. IMO, i think there would be more problems than the ones now (BSL). I'd say alot of people that have this breed now should not have them. Could you imagine if certain things were legal? I think it would be mass chaos and BSL would be nothing compared to what would happen.
elaberate please...

If you dont know. I dont sell or place APBT within the public. An No not everyone should have an APBT esp if it is bred to standard! Standard is the gamedog anything less is an imatation. ;)

[dwd58]

I think that that would be the end of these short wide dogs as they would show their weekness very quickly and no one would want one then.

[Scratchy]

I think that that would be the end of these short wide dogs as they would show their weekness very quickly and no one would want one then.
Yeah right:cool: They would match short and wide dogs against other short wide dogs and which ever one was last standing would be the winner. I could see it now, then all of the short and wide dogs would be game:rolleyes:

[Scratchy]

Let me add that most people coming up, don't even know what gameness is. All most know is how many wins so and so has.

[jaystreetsA4]

interesting thread. another ? : do you think overall, if the fastlane was legal, would the dogs get better aftercare since they can be taken to vets?

[simms]

I'd have to disagree because yeah more people could and would get called out, but they would just keep acquiring dogs until they found one with a certain color or size that had the go they're are looking for. Hell, some already think they have dogs that could hold it down against any other dog. It's not like people would all of sudden be interested in the facts of the breeds standards or the rules of the [].
separate the wheat from the shaft! How does color an size figure into the gamedog for you?

Just like any sport, you dont follow the rules you dont participate.

i guess Im narrow minded when it comes to this

[Big Rod]

I dont know if their would be worse sanctions than BSL since in this imaginary world we are discussing, matching dogs would be legal. In other words it would be openly accepted so no worrys about BSL since their would be alot more "true type" APBT.

Perhaps in this imaginary world there would be more laws and fines that would actually do justice to the dogs insted of the majority of the ppl who have no real sincere motive for the animals at stake. These ppl mostly being goverment officals, ppl who have their own alterier motives and are only trying to gain popularity points for their own personal political agendas. Imagine insted of BSL laws they had "proper medical attention" and "breeding ethics" and "dog man/women licenses" laws, cutting away all the wanna be, lazy, half ass, unreputable dog men.

I for one believe it MIGHT help out the APBT community so to be able to stop all this awful breeding practices and only allow the true, fully devoted fanciers the privilege to owning a true specimen. That would be the day...but it is something we can only dream of in this country.

[badboy_caesar]

I could see every single punk kid on the street taking whatever dog they had and pitting it against another, just because they could.

I'd probably fear my own dogs safety if I were out on a walk, if dog fighting were legal. The last thing I'd want is someone asking if I would want to fight my dog and possibly siccing their's on mine because it was legal.

I personally think it would make things worse. It would become popular with all the wrong sorts of people.

[badboy_caesar]

I dont know if their would be worse sanctions than BSL since in this imaginary world we are discussing, matching dogs would be legal. In other words it would be openly accepted so no worrys about BSL since their would be alot more "true type" APBT.

Perhaps in this imaginary world there would be more laws and fines that would actually do justice to the dogs insted of the majority of the ppl who have no real sincere motive for the animals at stake. These ppl mostly being goverment officals, ppl who have their own alterier motives and are only trying to gain popularity points for their own personal political agendas. Imagine insted of BSL laws they had "proper medical attention" and "breeding ethics" and "dog man/women licenses" laws, cutting away all the wanna be, lazy, half ass, unreputable dog men.

I for one believe it MIGHT help out the APBT community so to be able to stop all this awful breeding practices and only allow the true, fully devoted fanciers the privilege to owning a true specimen. That would be the day...but it is something we can only dream of in this country.I could see that. But that would be if dog fighting never became illegal.

I was imagining it as dog fighting suddenly becoming legal, out of the blue.

[miakoda]

I'd have to disagree because yeah more people could and would get called out, but they would just keep acquiring dogs until they found one with a certain color or size that had the go they're are looking for. Hell, some already think they have dogs that could hold it down against any other dog. It's not like people would all of sudden be interested in the facts of the breeds standards or the rules of the [].
If this were the case, how come the APBT as a breed didn't start having the issues it has today & didn't become such a hot commodity until AFTER dog fighting was declared illegal?

[simms]

interesting thread. another ? : do you think overall, if the fastlane was legal, would the dogs get better aftercare since they can be taken to vets?
in most cases they do get Excellent after care, within thier meens. dont assume that these guys cant triage on the spot.

An Yes the law does prevent in most cases the aid of a vet and thier facility.

[simms]

If this were the case, how come the APBT as a breed didn't start having the issues it has today & didn't become such a hot commodity until AFTER dog fighting was declared illegal?

Thankyou mia!

[Scratchy]

separate the wheat from the shaft! How does color an size figure into the gamedog for you?

Just like any sport, you dont follow the rules you dont participate.

i guess Im narrow minded when it comes to this
Ok, let's take another look at this in comparison. Let's use boxing and ultimate fighting. What happened? People started making videos and this and that using sites like youtube and myspace to outsource. Except with dogs, people want what they consider the right color and size to breed and make more. Yes, it is a sport and would be still considered one but all I'm saying is that there would still those idiots who searched for that street credit.


Color and size don't matter to me. Hell, not even papers, but that's a different story.;)

[simms]

I dont know if their would be worse sanctions than BSL since in this imaginary world we are discussing, matching dogs would be legal. In other words it would be openly accepted so no worrys about BSL since their would be alot more "true type" APBT.

Perhaps in this imaginary world there would be more laws and fines that would actually do justice to the dogs insted of the majority of the ppl who have no real sincere motive for the animals at stake. These ppl mostly being goverment officals, ppl who have their own alterier motives and are only trying to gain popularity points for their own personal political agendas. Imagine insted of BSL laws they had "proper medical attention" and "breeding ethics" and "dog man/women licenses" laws, cutting away all the wanna be, lazy, half ass, unreputable dog men.

I for one believe it MIGHT help out the APBT community so to be able to stop all this awful breeding practices and only allow the true, fully devoted fanciers the privilege to owning a true specimen. That would be the day...but it is something we can only dream of in this country.
Right on! :)

[Pitbull219]

If it became legal overnight.....you'd have to start reporting your earnings as income! :eek:

[Scratchy]

If this were the case, how come the APBT as a breed didn't start having the issues it has today & didn't become such a hot commodity until AFTER dog fighting was declared illegal?
The APBT became a hot commodity after the Rottweiler became overbred and outdated. Then people started hearing that the APBT had the strongest bite pressure. That's how I remember hearing about it and I'd like to say that many of the people in my city all knew that the APBT had the strongest bite so that's why they wanted it. All it took was for that one rumor and bam. Maybe that was just my city. I never heard anything about dog fighting till maybe 7-8yrs ago.

[simms]

Ok, let's take another look at this in comparison. Let's use boxing and ultimate fighting. What happened? People started making videos and this and that using sites like youtube and myspace to outsource. Except with dogs, people want what they consider the right color and size to breed and make more. Yes, it is a sport and would be still considered one but all I'm saying is that there would still those idiots who searched for that street credit.


Color and size don't matter to me. Hell, not even papers, but that's a different story.;)
sanction folks and kennels in. I advocate culling in any breeding program.

[Scratchy]

Anyone ever wonder what if would be like if the game was actually legal in certain areas or parts of the country nowadays? I was just thinkin' about it, like how many great dogs would actually get to showcase their skills, but how much hell PETA people would be raising.

I think we still have some members here who were into these dogs pre 1979. I wonder how controversial things were then and if it would be 10x worse now.

I figure if a state decided to lift that ban on dog fighting, that would be one popular state lol.
Do you mean if it all of a sudden became legal or as if it's still remains legal?

[simms]

If it became legal overnight.....you'd have to start claiming your earnings as income! :eek:
Yeah but 1 could right every thing off!

[dog-man]

IF it were to become legal, true a lot more people would get into it, heck , its illegal right now, and people still find a way to match dogs , if they cant do it here in the States, just cross south of the border lol, its not %100 legal, but they are less strict on dog events, IM all for the events to be legal, that way it would be controlled by the state, would be a lot less dangerous , checking people that go to these events for weapons or drugs, I say if people are matching their dogs now , why not just make it leagal, but organized, like the Japanese do with the tosa, just my 2 cents....................

[simms]

IF it were to become legal, true a lot more people would get into it, heck , its illegal right now, and people still find a way to match dogs , if they cant do it here in the States, just cross south of the border lol, its not %100 legal, but they are less strict on dog events, IM all for the events to be legal, that way it would be controlled by the state, would be a lot less dangerous , checking people that go to these events for weapons or drugs, I say if people are matching their dogs now , why not just make it leagal, but organized, like the Japanese do with the tosa, just my 2 cents....................
I disagree if anything ppl would know just how many folk are involved. Ya'll make it sound like the hoodlems are going to take over....LOL If anything they would fall to the way side cause they cant compete!

[NcPrisonGuard]

If it became legal overnight.....you'd have to start reporting your earnings as income! :eek:

Hahaha... AHHH! The taxman cometh http://www.game-dog.com/forums/images/icons/icon13.gif

[Red Cocaine]

sanction folks and kennels in. I advocate culling in any breeding program.

I agree, I don't want to post a long ne so I'll keep it short and to the point.

I think it could be like the Race/Show Horse indistry if done right.

[NcPrisonGuard]

I agree with RC... I think if done correctly, and managed properly it would much the same as UFC or any of the mixed martial art leagues they have out now. But again it would have to be done right with the dog's best interest in mind i regards to housing and treatment especially post show treatments.

[koening]

IMO if matching dogs became legal, it would have to be with a surtain set of rules and with a surtain standard, that not all could aford , so it would only be a sport for those who are interested in the breed and passsionate about it.
i have to agree to RC on this, but we have to keep in mind that dog fighting and horse racing are two separate things, and i don't know if they are saw the same in the publics eye, or in PETA's for that matter.

[Lethalpits]

Actually, to really get an accurate answer to my question, we'd have to look at how things were pre 1979, and also how things are governed over fighting in countries that still allow it.

I was thinking more of what if a state decided to lift the ban right now. True, lots of hoodlums and thugs would try to jump on the bandwagon, but like someone said they would get weeded out very quickly. They would come to the realization that this is not their sport and simply tossing a dog into the pit is not all it takes. There would definately would a fine line between an active game dog and any ole APBT.

True, that the sport could be governed like the show/race horse events, but how was this done in the past? From pictures, I've seen that many a people would attend from government officials, law enforcement to women and children.

From what I am imagining, it would pretty much be the same as going to a game dog fun show. Lots of people would attend and bring their sporting dogs.

[Rockstar]

It seems to me that people don't realize dogfighting has been illegal in the US since around 1860, and the ASPCA has been seizing dogs and throwing people in jail since it was given charter in 1866.

The legalization of dogfighting would certainly bring about change; some good, but some, potentially catastrophic.

Armchair fatass megalomaniacal animal rights fanatics would scream ever the more loudly. They wouldn't take such a thing lying down. We could expect them to step up efforts to ban fighting breeds, and it's very likely they'd have much more ammunition to do so, as puppy peddlers would be breeding the hell out of anything with teeth, promising the next great canine equivalent of Rocky Marciano. Think there's an overpopulation issue with pit bulls today? Think there are too many unstable man-biting mutts being bred by the greedy, careless, and ignorant? It's difficult to imagine the scope of these problems should dogfighting become legal.

The fights would have to be tightly regulated, for the sake of tax revenue, if nothing else. Sanctioning organizations would take control of everything. You'd have to be "licensed" to fight a dog, and you'd have to pay your dues to the organization. There would be a huge demand for professional handlers, conditioners, and managers, all of which would require high dollars. Owners and breeders of winning dogs would conceivably become quite wealthy, as multimillion-dollar matches would be a thing of the norm.
Meanwhile, those who couldn't afford to compete in the sanctioned "fastlane" would continue to do just what dogfighters are doing now and remain outside the law.

[Scratchy]

Even with what RC said, I still don't see it happening. The underground ring of dogfighting that goes on now has bets up in the 25k and up range and the number of people accomodating these dogs seems like nothing when someone can own this breed starting at $500 and up.

I have to say that if someone wanted to own this breed, it should be as if they entering a business or buying a car. Their credit should be checked, an FBI background check, a professional personality survey and etc. Until then there will always be idiots with this breed in their hands or until those idiots find another breed to intrude upon.

[jaystreetsA4]

Even with what RC said, I still don't see it happening. The underground ring of dogfighting that goes on now has bets up in the 25k and up range and the number of people accomodating these dogs seems like nothing when someone can own this breed starting at $500 and up.

I have to say that if someone wanted to own this breed, it should be as if they entering a business or buying a car. Their credit should be checked, an FBI background check, a professional personality survey and etc. Until then there will always be idiots with this breed in their hands or until those idiots find another breed to intrude upon.
not to nitpick...but wouldn't that be a form of BSL?

[14rock]

"What if the Game was Legal now?"

-The police would be out arresting real criminals.

[Suki]

I dont think it would make things worse. infact I think more folk would get called to the carpet so to speak...acountability. Might clean this breed up...or ppls breeding practices.

i don't think it would make things worse, either, and i agree, perhaps ethics would once again be in the forefront of breeder's brains!

[jaystreetsA4]

interesting thread.:)

[ChiaPit]

i don't think it would make things worse, either, and i agree, perhaps ethics would once again be in the forefront of breeder's brains!

Yeah, I think alot of people who get these dogs as "status" symbols. wouldn't be so quick to buy from a BYB and hopefully wouldn't have access to game bred dog due to cost and just general accessibility.

Of course many dogs would be abandoned during the "realization" phase.

[Scratchy]

not to nitpick...but wouldn't that be a form of BSL?
In a way yes, but it would be for the benefit of the breed, not the distinction of it.

[Chef-Kergin]

I've been reading through the thread, and saw some dates I'm confused about.

Maybe I'm lost, but didn't the Animal Welfare Act get passed in 76 and not 79? I saw 79 posted, that's why I'm asking.

And I think Rockstar nailed it with:


Meanwhile, those who couldn't afford to compete in the sanctioned "fastlane" would continue to do just what dogfighters are doing now and remain outside the law.
Also, 14rock had a point with the cops would be out arresting criminals.

[miakoda]

In a way yes, but it would be for the benefit of the breed, not the distinction of it.That's exactly what PETA & the HSUS say too. I don't get it. ARe you for BSL?

And good post, Rockstar.

[Attila]

pre 1976 not 79.

It would be fine if done in the old ways not this new street bull shit. It would take a real turn around in our nations current liberal path. It would take a hostile take over by the people to change anything for the better. A internal war. Probably will happen in time anyway. People get tired enough of rights being shit upon they will start to act. However as always in history they wait till it is way past too late and it is a real fight. Where as if they never let it happen in the first place it wouldn't come to war. People have been lazy from the begining. Rather let some one else govern till the point they have no control of anything. Then they bitch. It isn't a one generation thing. Takes generations to screw up a good thing.

I see it as an interesting dream. Make it happen. But don't stop there.

And if those armchair AR got their panties in a wad that would be good too. I hate their guts and livers. Anything to piss them off as they have done me for all these years. I can be quite vengful.

[NcPrisonGuard]

"What if the Game was Legal now?"

-The police would be out arresting real criminals.


Amen brother.

[Scratchy]

That's exactly what PETA & the HSUS say too. I don't get it. ARe you for BSL?

And good post, Rockstar.

for the benefit of the breed, not the distinction of it

[miakoda]

for the benefit of the breed, not the distinction of it
BSL in no way or form can benefit the breed. Period.

We as "pit bull" owners need to begin legislating ourselves; we don't need the government to step in & say which of us can own these dogs & which of us cannot. If people would stop buying from back yard breeders & pretty pedigree puppy peddlers then those people would have no selling market. If we would quit selling/giving pups to the first person to raise their hand, then the idiots & irresponsible people wouldn't be able to get their hands on these dogs. This is the way things need to be done.

[Sid Finster]

To those who equate the current state of the breed with the Federal ban on dog-fighting: correlation does not equal causation.

[SAM_I_AM]

I think It would only work if it was held just like cock fighting is here in Louisiana. No governtment checkpoints, no lisences, just a bunch of people there for the common purpose. The establishment should be held resopnisble for any drugs or guns being brought in. As a matter of fact there are alot of rooster pits that would be able to accomidate such an event with little modifications. JMO

[Scratchy]

BSL in no way or form can benefit the breed. Period.

We as "pit bull" owners need to begin legislating ourselves; we don't need the government to step in & say which of us can own these dogs & which of us cannot. If people would stop buying from back yard breeders & pretty pedigree puppy peddlers then those people would have no selling market. If we would quit selling/giving pups to the first person to raise their hand, then the idiots & irresponsible people wouldn't be able to get their hands on these dogs. This is the way things need to be done.You mean to tell me if dog fighting was legal then you(general) would allow people to freely own these dogs and participate? Sounds like the breed would be in a worse state to me. I spit on BSL, the only cause they have is to destroy the breed. If dog fighting was legal then BSL would be no good, but we as breed advocates would have to be political in some way to keep street punks from staying underground so much.

I'll stay in this boat by myself. I don't need to life raft.

[Michele]

elaberate please...

If you dont know. I dont sell or place APBT within the public. An No not everyone should have an APBT esp if it is bred to standard! Standard is the gamedog anything less is an imatation. ;)I sent ya a PM:D I'm having a problem sending you a PM.....

[miakoda]

You mean to tell me if dog fighting was legal then you(general) would allow people to freely own these dogs and participate? Sounds like the breed would be in a worse state to me. I spit on BSL, the only cause they have is to destroy the breed. If dog fighting was legal then BSL would be no good, but we as breed advocates would have to be political in some way to keep street punks from staying underground so much.

I'll stay in this boat by myself. I don't need to life raft.Say what? Just a few posts back you say you are all for government legislation on who can own these dogs & who cannot & don't oppose rules/regulations "for the betterment of the breed."

Their credit should be checked, an FBI background check, a professional personality survey and etc.So which is it? You are saying in 1 post that BSL can be good in some ways to "better the breed" & yet in this post you say you spit on BSL. You've got to make up your mind.

And you state that if dog fighting was legal then we would have to self-regulate the street fighters (my words on your statement), but IMO we need to do that now. Quit selling to these idiots. Denounce them. Do what you've got to do. I don't understand why you think we cannot do that now; that we could only do that if dog fighting was legal.

And you can stay in that boat by yourself. Your just going in circles & not getting anywhere. ;)

(EDIT: And why in the heck would someone with a lower credit score not be allowed to own a "pit bull" while someone with a higher credit score could? What does credit scores have to do with anything?)

[Scratchy]

Your just going in circles & not getting anywhere.You're just trying to rid of what little credibility I do have because of the pm I sent you. Let's not make this personal.

It's simple, if dog fighting were legal then yeas there should be strict rules and regulations on who can own this breed and who can't. Since it's not I don't see a reason for BSL to get involved in anything. I say this because the breed would go further down the drain.

BTW: read more of the previous post, a few others said the same thing about it being controlled so don't get specific with me.



P.S. pm me if you're still having that monthly problem and feeling a bit naggish. We can talk it out like grown men and women do;)

[Scratchy]

Here ya go Mia, I made a list of other people to harrasss who also feel that it should be ruled and regulated. Have fun!

Big Rod:there would be more laws and fines that would actually do justice to the dogs insted of the majority of the ppl who have no real sincere motive for the animals at stakedog-man:IM all for the events to be legal, that way it would be controlled by the state, would be a lot less dangerous
Red-Cocaine:I think it could be like the Race/Show Horse indistry if done right.

NCPrisonGuard:I think if done correctly, and managed properly it would much the same as UFC or any of the mixed martial art leagues they have out now

Koening:IMO if matching dogs became legal, it would have to be with a surtain set of rules and with a surtain standard, that not all could aford

RockStar:The fights would have to be tightly regulated

Don't slack on'em now. Work!

[hrdeluxe]

I think if it were made legal all of the big blue bluffs' owners would get the urge to pit there monsters and find out that they ain't so tough. Talk is cheap. Come time to put up you would find the popularity of blues will hopefully decline. If it were legal hopefully the real dog men would know to hold on to their stock even tighter and we could root out the fakes making it harder for wanna-be's to be dogmen.

[14rock]

MMA, Horseraising, and cock-fighting, where legal, is regulated by the people who participate and their organizations...not regulated by an outside government or group of any kind.

The gov't "regulating" it simply means a bunch of people who have no idea of whats going on, passing laws and telling people who to do something, they themselves have no idea on the pre-existing set of values, tradition, and code of ethics. As well, if the gov't was the sanctioning body, it would mean they would surely want their tax cut, in which case, the more money that can be generated by dog-fighters, the more money they would be able to pocket. Any system of regulation run not based on regulation in the best sense of the organization, but instead based on financial gain-is a recipe for disaster.

Owning guns is legal. The gov't has laws to "regulate" it. Surely that means, no "unregulated" murderers use a firearm as their method of crime?

The simple fact is people will do what they want. If they step outside of the accepted manner of acting in their own circles, their peers should be the ones responsible for enforcing punishments. Nobody takes seriously threats from people who are based thousands of miles away. These laws make people feel better, to get officials elected, and not much more.

I'm not sure if I would like the sport of dog-fighting legalized or not. It would inevitably bring people into the sport who have unpure reasons for joining/enforcing. It wouldn't stop street doggers, and it would give more ammunition to humaniacs. If the sport was continued to resume the way it was pre-76, and dogmen simply claimed their extra income and expenses in tax form, I would be satisfied with that compromise if officials would stop murdering innocent animals and taking petty offenders to prison for essentially life sentences. Jay walking is illegal, yet it is rarely enforced so long as it does not harm others. When people are prosecuted for such petty crimes, it is normally as a "bonus" tacked on to an already solid case of more serious crimes.

[Michele]

It would inevitably bring people into the sport who have unpure reasons for joining/enforcing. It wouldn't stop street doggers, and it would give more ammunition to humaniacs. absolutely........

[Rocky H. Balboa]

What if dog matching was legal?

The sport of dog matching would go into evolutionary phases leading to a new and "improved" (aka marketable) sport.

At the beginning, there would be masses of canines entered and showed in the sport. Out of these masses, 20 % of them would remain active in a lapse of 3-5 years. Within this same time period, The modified C. rules would be modified once again to include time limits, point system, and Vet/Referee stoppage. In addition, ability would take priority over gameness. This change would be directly related to the addition of a time limit rule. Furthermore, bone crushing dogs would be elevated to ACE status by the average fan of the sport.

The economic changes would also be obvious after the 3-5 years phase. Dog prices would at least triple in cost because of the public proven records of successful dog breeders AND the demand for those puppies. In other words, supply and demand laws would make it impossible for the public to attain high caliber dogs. These pups would be sold before the breeding was made. The waiting list would contain the highest bidders for "X" pick of litter. The price per pup would be around 5, 10, and 20 thousand depending on the quality (track record). This increase in price would void the average street "resident" from owning quality dogs.

Under a legal venue, our dogs would benefit from improved aftercare. Today, many participants in the underground sport learn through practice and error. If it was legal, we would be able to care for our dogs much more than allowed thanks to the many restrictions and obstacles found in getting proper supplies.

The dogs themselves would improve tremendously through open competition. No longer would the dogs be "locally" great. We would have the way and means to prove which breeding program or specific dog is "better". My main concern would be the definition of "better". This word should be defined in order to prevent subjectivity. Anyway, as i was saying, caliber of dogs would be unimaginably improved.....no doubt about that. A great example of this lays in the European circuit. "Europeans" have about 25 years in the sport and dogs. The level of dogs and competition in general has improved many times over since its inception. Their dogs today are constantly reported as crossing the 2-hr mark. In addition, i have read of many that have continued working past the 5-hour mark.

Personally, I wish the sport was legal and regulated for the sake of our dogs. For now, those in it should police one another and strive to make it a "gentlemen's sport" even when many of the old-timers Dogmen were mediocre men.

Yours in Script,


Rocky H.

[miakoda]

14rock, good post!

And Scratchy, I'm not harassing you. I've commented on other people's posts as well. It's just no one seems to contradict themselves like you do. ;)

[Lethalpits]

Yes, I meant to say 1976 but didn't catch it till later.

Honestly, the ideal of lifting the ban on dog fighting in certain states could be feasable. I don't believe it would blow up into utter chaos immedietely. Of course the animal righteous would be raising hell, but on the flip side the serious doggers of today would be come into the light. I'm sure there would be a nice arena setup with entry fees and weapons/firearms/drugs checks and whatnot.
The only downfall would be the gambling part, as gambling in itself has to be governed. That there would be the taxation.

Yes, amateurs would also try to make their walk to fame, but like stated before very few would achieve their goal. I can imagine the prices of best producing kennels would sky rocket, but there would be too much competition for it to be outrageous.

Someone said here before how they could see it being done like cockfighting in LA. Is gambling allowed and how is that regulated??

Also, if just ONE state or even a county allowed it be legal, we could show liberals and anti-pitbull how the sport is a SPORT, and not some underground back alley yard fight. They could actually see for themselves how the dogs do not have to participate if they do not wish, I.E. scratching. They could understand more through the turns and box jumping curs. Hell, it'd probably end up on television lol.

As with alot of things nowadays and like Atilla said, we'd damn near have to go to war to enforce something like this. It's a great idea; but our modern day country has been brainwashed so bad that there are seldom any people left in politics that would even glance at a proposal like this thread.

Like I've always said...

"The All-American, Made by Americans, but being Banned by Americans, American Pitbull Terrier."

[SAM_I_AM]

The only downfall would be the gambling part, as gambling in itself has to be governed. That there would be the taxation.


Someone said here before how they could see it being done like cockfighting in LA. Is gambling allowed and how is that regulated?
yes gambling is very much allowed and is governed by the ones making the bet with each other, or if betting in the main pot that money is collected before the match and the referee is the one holding the cash during the match and he hands the winnnings to the winning corner after the match. If you make a side bet with another spectator it is your responisblity to collect. There are rarely major problems with paying up. its simple just dont bet with someone you dont know or dont seem to trust to pay up. and the person winning the money is responsible for filing or not filing with uncle sam.

[PirbulBongo]

If i remember right dog fighting is legal on Japan, one of the most advanced countrys in the world, i dont have more details on this but i always been curious about how this is around there.

And my opinion about this is simple,there is no room for dog fighting nowadays, things changed too much and cannot be compared to old times.

If dog fighting was legal now, then it'd eventually get outlawed again.

[Suki]

Like I've always said...

"The All-American, Made by Americans, but being Banned by Americans, American Pitbull Terrier."
...ain't THAT the truth!!!;)

[Scratchy]

It's just no one seems to contradict themselves like you do. ;)
No one else misinterprets my post like you do.:cool:

To sum up my post for the mentally challenged, I said that dumba$$es would make things worse unless the sport was ruled and regulated. There's no way anyone can misinterpret that, but I feel somehow you'll work very hard trying to.


BTW: Whoever left me the bad rep, that's cool at least I stay to true to myself and if you see it as being rude then that's your right to state your perception. I'm just trying to be the bigger person.I'm the one being antagonized.

[Rocky H. Balboa]

No one else misinterprets my post like you do.:cool:

To sum up my post for the mentally challenged, I said that dumba$$es would make things worse unless the sport was ruled and regulated. There's no way anyone can misinterpret that, but I feel somehow you'll work very hard trying to.


BTW: Whoever left me the bad rep, that's cool at least I stay to true to myself and if you see it as being rude then that's your right to state your perception. I'm just trying to be the bigger person.I'm the one being antagonized.
"Let it go chivato, let it go" lol

Just relax and post your thoughts.

[Scratchy]

"Let it go chivato, let it go" lol

Just relax and post your thoughts.
I just had to sum it up so no one else would feel or be misguided. She has been trying to push my buttons but I remain cool and keep posting my thoughts. I don't think it's cool to be calling people out on a public forum as she always does but moderators can do what they want.

Thanks for the advice. This is a great "What if" thread

[simms]

MMA, Horseraising, and cock-fighting, where legal, is regulated by the people who participate and their organizations...not regulated by an outside government or group of any kind.

The gov't "regulating" it simply means a bunch of people who have no idea of whats going on, passing laws and telling people who to do something, they themselves have no idea on the pre-existing set of values, tradition, and code of ethics. As well, if the gov't was the sanctioning body, it would mean they would surely want their tax cut, in which case, the more money that can be generated by dog-fighters, the more money they would be able to pocket. Any system of regulation run not based on regulation in the best sense of the organization, but instead based on financial gain-is a recipe for disaster.

Owning guns is legal. The gov't has laws to "regulate" it. Surely that means, no "unregulated" murderers use a firearm as their method of crime?

The simple fact is people will do what they want. If they step outside of the accepted manner of acting in their own circles, their peers should be the ones responsible for enforcing punishments. Nobody takes seriously threats from people who are based thousands of miles away. These laws make people feel better, to get officials elected, and not much more.

I'm not sure if I would like the sport of dog-fighting legalized or not. It would inevitably bring people into the sport who have unpure reasons for joining/enforcing. It wouldn't stop street doggers, and it would give more ammunition to humaniacs. If the sport was continued to resume the way it was pre-76, and dogmen simply claimed their extra income and expenses in tax form, I would be satisfied with that compromise if officials would stop murdering innocent animals and taking petty offenders to prison for essentially life sentences. Jay walking is illegal, yet it is rarely enforced so long as it does not harm others. When people are prosecuted for such petty crimes, it is normally as a "bonus" tacked on to an already solid case of more serious crimes.good post....

Edit: I'm surprised to come back an see this thread still up....LOL
Michelle I'll empty my pm box out.

[Red Cocaine]

OK, what about Matching with out being prosecuted. It would still be illegal in the States but you could go to say a virgin islands do what you wanted there with no fear of the Law and then go home with your dog since you did not break an American law in America.

[Fedor23]

Like in boxing, you need a license to fight right. Well if it was legal, you would need to be a certain age, and pass a test of some sort to get your license, but I think more dogs would end up in the pound and/or put to sleep.

[MinorThreat]

Michele, since you have input on a thread with the title the game, how about speaking from your personal experience. What type of people have you experienced in the game? You think street thugs would be in the game if it was legal today, what kind of people are involved today in the illegal game?

or are you posting just to post?

[cheekymunkee]

Michele, since you have input on a thread with the title the game, how about speaking from your personal experience. What type of people have you experienced in the game? You think street thugs would be in the game if it was legal today, what kind of people are involved today in the illegal game?

or are you posting just to post?
And are YOU posting just to start crap? If her posts bother you so much, be an ADULT & ignore them. You will be a much happier person.

Good post 14!

[Rocky H. Balboa]

Damn, you made me log on to reply to your post.

Michele, since you have input on a thread with the title the game, how about speaking from your personal experience.
I would rather here your thoughts since you seem so eager to scrutinize posts.

I had to look back two pages to find her last post. She agreed with the point made by another poster. Why not scrutinize the point of THAT poster?

What type of people have you experienced in the game?
You asking her to drop names? lmao. I guess you have most (of them) on speed dial to confirm?

You think street thugs would be in the game if it was legal today, what kind of people are involved today in the illegal game?
I do not know about her answer but mine is yes and same as today. Yes there would be thugs in the game if it was legal the same way there are thugs in it today. The thug influence is not exclusive to this sport. "thugness" of one sort of another can be found in most popular sports today.

What are YOU trying to say?

or are you posting just to post?
are you?

Why are you

[MoEttaWinnyMOM]

It would be a terribly sad day in my opinion.
http://bahamashumanesociety.com/albums/photos/Injured_Pit_Bull.sized.jpg

[simms]

It would be a terribly sad day in my opinion.
http://bahamashumanesociety.com/albums/photos/Injured_Pit_Bull.sized.jpgSad day for you.....Well it's not for all. So what's the deal with you posting that pic? Why didnt you post the details behind it?

By the looks it appears to only be supperficial type wounds. Nothing to dramaticly shocking. Was this dog seized or was he running a muck? back yard scuffle? surely you have a story.....


Edit: Dont waiste your time or mine with the mention of bait dog. You wanna kick it around start another thread.....

[MoEttaWinnyMOM]

Sad day for you.....Well it's not for all. So what's the deal with you posting that pic? Why didnt you post the details behind it?

By the looks it appears to only be supperficial type wounds. Nothing to dramaticly shocking. Was this dog seized or was he running a muck? back yard scuffle? surely you have a story.....That is why I said it was my opinion. In my opinion it is cruel. I realize not many people on here will agree with me but I hope that I can state my opinion without being flamed and give a different viewpoint from the glorious side of pit fighting.

[simms]

That is why I said it was my opinion. In my opinion it is cruel. I realize not many people on here will agree with me but I hope that I can state my opinion without being flamed and give a different viewpoint from the glorious side of pit fighting.

theres nothing wrong with an oppinion. I said that it's not for every one.....Just like this breed isnt for every one.That's my oppinion. However if you are going to depict this thread in that manner, i'm asking what the story is.....

i know you deal in rescue ....I dont like the Idea of rescue an the APBT for obvious reasons. But I'm not going to be little you for that, or take away from what you do.

But I will tell you, that 95% of rescue solitfies my convictions of why a culling program within the gamedog community is vital to its exsistance and future!

[Scratchy]

It would be a terribly sad day in my opinion.
http://bahamashumanesociety.com/albums/photos/Injured_Pit_Bull.sized.jpg
We really don't know the story behind this dog and really posting a picture online can have all kinds of captions and stories added and taken away. It's only animal cruelty when the dogs are forced to fight. Some people don't understand these dogs have it in them to want a scrap with another dog, hence why we contain, hence why dog fighting is a sport. True man made it an event of it's own years upon years ago, and that just can't be bred out of'em. Banning them won't help, because people will always remain underground and that can't be stopped. I'm not stating that's my lifestyle, but why complain about that something that we as humans created. Mind you it was/is upstanding, working, men who were into this sport.

[Scratchy]

i know you deal in rescue ....I dont like the Idea of rescue an the APBT for obvious reasons. But I'm not going to be little you for that, or take away from what you do. It's our right as humans to have choices and make them, but people seem to wanna stick their noses in others decisions when the ones they make aren't any better. Rep points to ya;)


But I will tell you, that 95% of rescue solitfies my convictions of why a culling program within the gamedog community is vital to its exsistance and future
I agree 100%

[MoEttaWinnyMOM]

theres nothing wrong with an oppinion. I said that it's not for every one.....Just like this breed isnt for every one.That's my oppinion. However if you are going to depict this thread in that manner, i'm asking what the story is.....

i know you deal in rescue ....I dont like the Idea of rescue an the APBT for obvious reasons. But I'm not going to be little you for that, or take away from what you do.

But I will tell you, that 95% of rescue solitfies my convictions of why a culling program within the gamedog community is vital to its exsistance and future!
I respect your opinion and value the pit bulls heritage. But you understand that not everyone who loves this breed yearns for a day when pit fighting could be legal. I do obedience with my dogs, rally and soon, agility.

I understand your concerns about rescue and they are valid. However the dogs i rescue and place are all speutered with no hopes of passing on their genes. They are great ambassadors and very sound. There are many dogs that deserve to live simply because of that. They are pet dogs and that is all they are meant to be.

That pic is from a bahama humane site that claims the dog was injured in a dog fighting match.

[simms]

I respect your opinion and value the pit bulls heritage. But you understand that not everyone who loves this breed yearns for a day when pit fighting could be legal. I do obedience with my dogs, rally and soon, agility.

I understand your concerns about rescue and they are valid. However the dogs i rescue and place are all speutered with no hopes of passing on their genes. They are great ambassadors and very sound. There are many dogs that deserve to live simply because of that. They are pet dogs and that is all they are meant to be.

That pic is from a bahama humane site that claims the dog was injured in a dog fighting match.
Not all APBT pet owners are as exceptional as you either.

I'm going to split hairs here. for example the greyhound racing industry is battleing the same thought pattern that plagued the APBT. Instead of being gratefull for the opprotunity to care for a fine working animal.... the thought has turned into.....they have No right to raise and handle these animals in this manner anymore. it is thier right( insert group) to take posessesion of these animals. this greyhound racing serves no purpose for the animal or todays society...Make more laws!ect,ect.

I think you get my point. Is it realy a right or a privillage to own and or raise a working breed with out any dictatorship.....

[MoEttaWinnyMOM]

Not all APBT pet owners are as exceptional as you either.

I'm going to split hairs here. for example the greyhound racing industry is battleing the same thought pattern that plagued the APBT. Instead of being gratefull for the opprotunity to care for a fine working animal.... the thought has turned into.....they have No right to raise and handle these animals in this manner anymore. it is thier right( insert group) to take posessesion of these animals. this greyhound racing serves no purpose for the animal or todays society...Make more laws!ect,ect.

I think you get my point. Is it realy a right or a privillage to own and or raise a working breed with out any dictatorship.....
And the idiots ruin it for everyone. Crap if any of us had the answers would we be in this horrible predicament? Whether you are a "gamer" or "rescuer" i think the overpopulation and unsound dogs being bred problem keeps us all up at night. we all do what we can to help and fight for the breed--all in our different ways.

[Red Cocaine]

And the idiots ruin it for everyone. Crap if any of us had the answers would we be in this horrible predicament? Whether you are a "gamer" or "rescuer" i think the overpopulation and unsound dogs being bred problem keeps us all up at night. we all do what we can to help and fight for the breed--all in our different ways.

And don't you see that your ppl caused this! the Liberals and the Humanic's caused this! it is their falt that pits are over populated and out of controle! 30 years later.

[Red Cocaine]

I respect your opinion and value the pit bulls heritage. But you understand that not everyone who loves this breed yearns for a day when pit fighting could be legal.

And some ppl Love coonhounds but hate the fact that they were bred to hunt. they shutter of the thought of killing an anminal. but they LOVE CoonHounds and thus breed their coonhounds down and down until they no longer will/want to hunt. Thats distorying the breed! The CoonHound was created to HUNT COONS! so the breed should remain able to hunt Coons no matter what! if it doesn't then what do you have? a Shell!

You say D/F is cruel ok what part of it is cruel? is this cruel? They are not forced to do something that they do not want to do.
http://www.addkennels.com/alligator_jack4bigcolor.jpg

[MoEttaWinnyMOM]

And don't you see that your ppl caused this! the Liberals and the Humanic's caused this! it is their falt that pits are over populated and out of controle! 30 years later.
what is a humanic? since no responsible rescuers are causing pit bulls to come into existence and spay/neutering the ones that they do place and educating people to spay and neuter and paying for people to spay and neuter, and advocating the euthanization of unsounds dogs, how are they causing the overpopulation problem?

wouldn't that be the people breeding irresponsibly and not spay/neutering unworthy breeding dogs causing it? Like the idiots i encounter when i walking my dogs that ask me if i want to breed my dog with theirs?

[Scratchy]

what is a humanic? since no responsible rescuers are causing pit bulls to come into existence and spay/neutering the ones that they do place and educating people to spay and neuter and paying for people to spay and neuter, and advocating the euthanization of unsounds dogs, how are they causing the overpopulation problem?

wouldn't that be the people breeding irresponsibly and not spay/neutering unworthy breeding dogs causing it? Like the idiots i encounter when i walking my dogs that ask me if i want to breed my dog with theirs?

Culling is not for everyone, I understand where you're coming from, but as a real true APBT lover, I have to say you're just placing poor bred pups into homes. The dogs still have the potential to be on the 6 o' clock news because of some idiot, irresponsible, uneducated owner but the whole breed gets blamed.

[Red Cocaine]

what is a humanic? since no responsible rescuers are causing pit bulls to come into existence and spay/neutering the ones that they do place and educating people to spay and neuter and paying for people to spay and neuter, and advocating the euthanization of unsounds dogs, how are they causing the overpopulation problem?

wouldn't that be the people breeding irresponsibly and not spay/neutering unworthy breeding dogs causing it? Like the idiots i encounter when i walking my dogs that ask me if i want to breed my dog with theirs?

Reread what I said. They are not (present tense) causing the problem however they caused (past tense) and are responsible for the problem. 30 YEARS later.

[Red Cocaine]

You know i don't understand why some ppl get all on a tissy about the state putting down dogs. I really don't get it, it's the same as we cull bad dogs.

[MoEttaWinnyMOM]

Culling is not for everyone, I understand where you're coming from, but as a real true APBT lover, I have to say you're just placing poor bred pups into homes. The dogs still have the potential to be on the 6 o' clock news because of some idiot, irresponsible, uneducated owner but the whole breed gets blamed.
the dogs are temperament tested and i test them in numerous situations while in foster care. these are sound dogs. put into carefully screened homes that have Pit Bull experience. the only time they will wind up on the 6 o'clock news is for the good ambasador work they do.

here is my dog Morris on the morning news with my husband:
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c364/semantyks/UPN_Mo2.jpg

[MoEttaWinnyMOM]

Reread what I said. They are not (present tense) causing the problem however they caused (past tense) and are responsible for the problem. 30 YEARS later.well they sure as hell aint my people then because i was only 4 years old 30 years ago.:eek:

[Red Cocaine]

well they sure as hell aint my people then because i was only 4 years old 30 years ago.:eek:

WOW, Your people as in you Liberals.

EDIT: and i wasn't born yet whats your point?

[MoEttaWinnyMOM]

You know i don't understand why some ppl get all on a tissy about the state putting down dogs. I really don't get it, it's the same as we cull bad dogs.i have no problem with a human aggressive pit bull being euth'ed.

[Scratchy]

the dogs are temperament tested and i test them in numerous situations while in foster care. these are sound dogs. put into carefully screened homes that have Pit Bull experience. the only time they will wind up on the 6 o'clock news is for the good ambasador work they do.

here is my dog Morris on the morning news with my husband:
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c364/semantyks/UPN_Mo2.jpg
Everyone thinks their dog is the greatest, same with kids, everyone thinks their kid is the cutest. A temperment test doesn't mean the dog was bred from a lineage of dogs poorly bred with bad temperments. I can show you a dog with a child kissing, hugging, rolling over and I can show you another pic with that same dog handling it's business with another dog. See where I'm going?

[MoEttaWinnyMOM]

WOW, Your people as in you Liberals.

EDIT: and i wasn't born yet whats your point?
I would appreciate if you dont label me simply because I have a different opinion than yours. I am here to learn other perspectives. If rescuers and APBT lovers like myself are not welcome here than just say so.

[MoEttaWinnyMOM]

Everyone thinks their dog is the greatest, same with kids, everyone thinks their kid is the cutest. A temperment test doesn't mean the dog was bred from a lineage of dogs poorly bred with bad temperments. I can show you a dog with a child kissing, hugging, rolling over and I can show you another pic with that same dog handling it's business with another dog. See where I'm going?it is much more extensive than a simple temperament test.
and human aggression and dog aggression are completely different so yes i could imagine you posting that.

[Scratchy]

I would appreciate if you dont label me simply because I have a different opinion than yours. I am here to learn other perspectives. If rescuers and APBT lovers like myself are not welcome here than just say so.You don't even have to own an APBT to be here, just be willing to learn. True this is more of a petbull site, but some folks here can really school ya on the history of the sport. Some people have seen or heard of dogs fighting and they just automatically yell animal cruelty. These dogs do this with their tails wagging. Now as a common pet owner, what does that mean?



Here's your sign

[MoEttaWinnyMOM]

You don't even have to own an APBT to be here, just be willing to learn. True this is more of a petbull site, but some folks here can really school ya on the history of the sport. Some people have seen or heard of dogs fighting and they just automatically yell animal cruelty. These dogs do this with their tails wagging. Now as a common pet owner, what does that mean?



Here's your signa common pet owner would probably think tail wagging always means a happy dog. but someone who knows dogs would tell you that a wagging tail can simply mean excitement and a flagging tail means watch out! a wagging tail= safe happy dog is one of the BIGGEST misconceptions out there.

[Red Cocaine]

I would appreciate if you dont label me simply because I have a different opinion than yours. I am here to learn other perspectives. If rescuers and APBT lovers like myself are not welcome here than just say so.

Are you not a liberal? I'm not labeling you because we disagree I'm labeling you because of where you stand and what you have said! All are welcome here to learn about this side. This place is to learn about the origanal APBT as it was ment to be.

[Red Cocaine]

If you do not know what you are then test your self and let me know so i can correctly call you by witch you are.

http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html

[Scratchy]

I'm referring to your comment about neutering them and temperment testing them as if that really makes much of a difference. Just because you do those things doens't mean you should trust the dog not to fight. All it takes is that one favorite toy, bone or whatever.

Yes, a wagging tail simply means a happy/excited dog.

[Grizzly]

I would appreciate if you dont label me simply because I have a different opinion than yours. I am here to learn other perspectives. If rescuers and APBT lovers like myself are not welcome here than just say so.
You have to realize that there seem to be several people on this board that feel as is every rule in society is an infringement on their "so-called" rights, such as dogfighting...a macho sport that seems to give them some kind of pleasure in seeing dogs injured such as the one posted. It never ceases to amaze me how narrow minded and seemingly immature people like the one you just responded to seem to get off on dogs tearing each other up for their owners pleasure. But just remember to remind the dogs torn apart what a good time they had.

[Scratchy]

ding ding ding, this is me: LIBERTARIAN, I'm all about being free, not freedom

[Scratchy]

You have to realize that there seem to be several people on this board that feel as is every rule in society is an infringement on their "so-called" rights, such as dogfighting...a macho sport that seems to give them some kind of pleasure in seeing dogs injured such as the one posted. It never ceases to amaze me how narrow minded and seemingly immature people like the one you just responded to seem to get off on dogs tearing each other up for their owners pleasure. But just remember to remind the dogs torn apart what a good time they had.
Why are you on "game-dog.com" Are you policing the board. You have no respect for the history of this breed. and what this was bred for. So why bother? Being apart of this board must mean something to you for you to be here. True you can be here to educate yourself but first you must learn to be open to the education being offered. Read around before making another critical, prejudice post please.

[MoEttaWinnyMOM]

I'm referring to your comment about neutering them and temperment testing them as if that really makes much of a difference. Just because you do those things doens't mean you should trust the dog not to fight. All it takes is that one favorite toy, bone or whatever.

Yes, a wagging tail simply means a happy/excited dog.a wagging tail does NOT always mean a happy dog. But this is really get too off topic now.

[Scratchy]

a wagging tail does NOT always mean a happy dog. But this is really get too off topic now.
I don't see it getting off topic until somewhere comes here and starts bad mouthing a historic sport that has been outlawed by people who never took the time to understand it.

Please enlighten me on what else a wagging tail can mean. Excitement? Eagerness? Willingness? Anxiety? All sound good to me. That's what happens in the pit when a dog wants to go.

[Grizzly]

Why are you on "game-dog.com" Are you policing the board. You have no respect for the history of this breed. and what this was bred for. So why bother? Being apart of this board must mean something to you for you to be here. True you can be here to educate yourself but first you must learn to be open to the education being offered. Read around before making another critical, prejudice post please.

I have great respect for the breed and am very much aware of their history as I am of other great fighting dogs such as the Bully Kutta, Gull terr,Tosu and Kangals. Believe me I am not the only one on this board that opposes dogfighting. It may be that some hesitate to speak out because of the hateful responses they get, but hey I've heard more than one on this board say you have to have tough skin and thick shells so if I or someone else disagrees with you all....why not just toughen up. I know how I will be treated because of my views, but I own and love pitbulls along with all the molosus type dogs. I just don't think it is right to have them tear each other apart to get my enjoyment from them........and believe it or not I think there is alot of information on this board. Have a good night!!

[MoEttaWinnyMOM]

If you do not know what you are then test your self and let me know so i can correctly call you by witch you are.

http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html
sorry- i left grade school a long time ago!

[Red Cocaine]

I have great respect for the breed and am very much aware of their history as I am of other great fighting dogs such as the Bully Kutta, Gull terr,Tosu and Kangals. Believe me I am not the only one on this board that opposes dogfighting. It may be that some hesitate to speak out because of the hateful responses they get, but hey I've heard more than one on this board say you have to have tough skin and thick shells so if I or someone else disagrees with you all....why not just toughen up. I know how I will be treated because of my views, but I own and love pitbulls along with all the molosus type dogs. I just don't think it is right to have them tear each other apart to get my enjoyment from them........and believe it or not I think there is alot of information on this board. Have a good night!!

How can you "respect" this breed but you just blatantly disrespected those who created this breed and those who believe in persevering this breed in it's true form?

[Scratchy]

I have great respect for the breed and am very much aware of their history as I am of other great fighting dogs such as the Bully Kutta, Gull terr,Tosu and Kangals. Believe me I am not the only one on this board that opposes dogfighting. It may be that some hesitate to speak out because of the hateful responses they get, but hey I've heard more than one on this board say you have to have tough skin and thick shells so if I or someone else disagrees with you all....why not just toughen up. I know how I will be treated because of my views, but I own and love pitbulls along with all the molosus type dogs. I just don't think it is right to have them tear each other apart to get my enjoyment from them........and believe it or not I think there is alot of information on this board. Have a good night!!You'll be back to read this post and when you do just know that for you to say it's for "our enjoyment" is where your lack of knowledge proves fatal. It's for the better of the breed. Back then it was amongst men who had great working dogs and wanted to create more and better working dogs. So people continued to try and preserve that. Judging by the date you joined this site, how many post you made and how many bad rep points you got. You haven't learned anything. Simply owning this breed doesn't make you educated about it. Reading something doesn't make you educated about it. Study the plays. Get your head in the game or sit on the bench.
Now may you rest in peace!

[Grizzly]

How can you "respect" this breed but you just blatantly disrespected those who created this breed and those who believe in persevering this breed in it's true form?

I've seen pictures of many of the dogs on this board. Some ( no, many) are excellent examples of pitbulls true to form and it is obvious with many of them that they have not been fought. Should I have no respect for the dogs or their owners simply because they have no battle scars? That is very poor reasoning red cocaine.

[Lethalpits]

I didn't intend for this thread to be a question of whether or not dog matching was cruel or not, but rather just a thought about what would happen if the ban were lifted somewhere in the country.

There are plenty points to argue on the subject of dog fighting, but it's a pointless argument in today's society like abortion or citizen rights.

True, that APBTs were designed to match against eachother, but through the years some Americans have changed the breed's attitude, some haven't. Some have ruined the game by no rules boxing or backalley fighting and have given a bad name for APBTs by malicious use. So there's always going to be those that can use those percentages of irresponsible owners to argue the morale of dog matching.

More or less, we should focus more on the distinction of the breed before we argue about sporting them again.

[Grizzly]

You'll be back to read this post and when you do just know that for you to say it's for "our enjoyment" is where your lack of knowledge proves fatal. It's for the better of the breed. Back then it was amongst men who had great working dogs and wanted to create more and better working dogs. So people continued to try and preserve that. Judging by the date you joined this site, how many post you made and how many bad rep points you got. You haven't learned anything. Simply owning this breed doesn't make you educated about it. Reading something doesn't make you educated about it. Study the plays. Get your head in the game or sit on the bench.
Now may you rest in peace!
I don't boast of any great knowledge concerning this, whether it be from "reading" or raising the dogs. The date I joined has nothing to do with my experience and if I have to be in agreement with the mindset of some on this board to avoid bad rep points, load me down with them. I merely did as many of you do and expressed my feelings however it seems that there are alot of sensitive thin skinned members who do not handle opposing views very well. May you also rest in peace!

[Red Cocaine]

respect them as what they are. this breed should be bred to the standard and that standard was for fighting.

[Scratchy]

I didn't intend for this thread to be a question of whether or not dog matching was cruel or not, but rather just a thought about what would happen if the ban were lifted somewhere in the country.

There are plenty points to argue on the subject of dog fighting, but it's a pointless argument in today's society like abortion or citizen rights.

True, that APBTs were designed to match against eachother, but through the years some Americans have changed the breed's attitude, some haven't. Some have ruined the game by no rules boxing or backalley fighting and have given a bad name for APBTs by malicious use. So there's always going to be those that can use those percentages of irresponsible owners to argue the morale of dog matching.

More or less, we should focus more on the distinction of the breed before we argue about sporting them again.
You make a good point. The distinction is because people either don't dig into the breed and end up just listening to the media or they just simply hate what they can't understand.

[bahamutt99]

Please enlighten me on what else a wagging tail can mean. Excitement? Eagerness? Willingness? Anxiety?Agitation. Aggression. Posturing for the benefit of the other dog. It depends on the arc, height, speed, etc.

[Scratchy]

Agitation. Aggression. Posturing for the benefit of the other dog. It depends on the arc, height, speed, etc.
Point is, you can tell alot about a dogs mood from it's tail and when it's wagging or up and when in the [] it's a good thing.