Raw or Commercial

[XxKonnectionsxX]

How do you feed your dog? What type of diet do you prefer your dogs to be on? A raw diet or do you like to feed commercial dog feed?

[Bubba]

The raw diet all the way!!! Unfortunately, I can't feed it at this time, so we are feeding Diamond, I'll be going back to the raw diet this fall tho...
BB

[Crash97]

Raw is better, commercial is easier......So I too feed Diamond Green bag

[badnews_VA]

i just changed my dogs food to NUTRO ULTRA. does anyone know anything about this brand?

[Texasbulldogs]

I have been feeding Canidae for a little over 5 years now. And give them raw chicken ¼’s a couple of time a week. The chicken is mostly just a treat. The dogs do very well on the Canidae alone. They all feel like silk when petted even though their chain spots are on sand.


Before switching to Canidae I was feeding Maximum Nutrition. It was a decent food for the price. I tried Diamond Green back after Maximum Nutrition and the dogs coat went to sh!t in a hurry. It did not take 4 weeks to see a major decrease in over all health and vitality on the dogs from the Max to Diamond switch. Maybe it was just my dogs (Mayday bloodline) but I would never feed Diamond green bag again.


The Maximum Nutrition has better ingredients wise than Diamond if my memory is right. But nether of them can compare to the results I have had and continue to have with Canidae. It is a difference in night and day for the dogs and the price is not much different actually I’m paying about $1.00 more for Canidae than Max. Nutrition.

[Big River Kennels]

be careful when it comes to raw food, according to some sled owners in the yukon, you should only feed raw fish not chicken or beef or pork, it has bacteria on it that could harm on the long run a digestive system. some say they have feed raw meat for a time but, maybe they have just been fortunate not to have the bacteria......

[GrChPitBitch]

I feed SportMIX.. It has a high protein ratio in it, and is made with chicken as number 1 ingrediant... with alot of fish oil/fish meal as well... I will sumpliment in the winter with fish, (tuna is good) so they have the extra energy to get warm... Raw diet can be tricky.. you dont want to over do it, and you hafta supliment with fruits and vegis, and a carb, like rice... I like my SportMIX... they are beutiful on it... they build nice, hard muscle on it, and their coats are "smooth as silk".... It is "High Energy" so they don't get drug down when I am working them everyday... I have used it for quite a few years now, and wouldnt switch... I tried the other, more expensive stuff, but it turned into a hole in the pocket... The SportMIX is just as good, but rather cheep... $17/50#....
Take a look at my dogs pic!! They are gorgeous!!
:D ;)

[GrChPitBitch]

This is wut I feed...
http://www.sportmix.com/HIGH_E~1.HTM

[AC]

I use commercial feed. Never really tried the raw diet but I make sure they have some real meat in their diet since that's what dogs used to eat centuries ago. I've tried various foods and have had some really bad results with them. The one they are on now (Exceed) is a 30/20 ratio and less clean up.

[TERRIBLE TEXAS]

nutro maxx

[Texasbulldogs]

GrChPitBitch,



Thanks for the link to SportMix. I’m glad you like it and have done well with it. It doesn’t compare to Canidae or other premium dog foods (Chicken Soup, Martin’s K-9, etc..) though.



First ten ingredients of Canidae:



Chicken Meal, Turkey Meal, Brown Rice, White Rice, Lamb Meal, Chicken Fat, (preserved with mixed Tocopherols and Ascorbic Acid), Menhaden Fish Meal, Flax Seed, Sun Cured Alfalfa Meal, Sunflower Oil, ect.



You will notice 4 meat sources and 3 fat/oil sources in the first 10 ingredients. Canidae also provides the necessary probiotics, fermentation products, and added digestive enzymes to help your canine fully-utilize the ration. All human grade ingredients.



First ten ingredients of SportsMix High Energy:



Chicken By-Product Meal, Ground Yellow Corn, Meat Meal, Ground Wheat, Chicken Fat (preserved with mixed Tocopherols, a source of natural Vitamin E), Dried Beet Pulp, Chicken & Liver Digest, Fish Meal, Flaxseed, Salt, etc.



That right there says it all. You’re mistaken on the first ingredient (not chicken) but a by-product. I’ll break it all down for everybody that may or may not know what to look for in dog food using SportsMix:



Chicken By-Products (Made up of ground, slaughtered poultry, such as undeveloped eggs, necks, feet, and intestines)

Ground Yellow Corn (The nutrients in corn is far less available than those in rice)

Meat Meal (Finally a meat source)

Ground Wheat (The availability of nutrients for wheat, beans, and oats is poor)

Chicken Fat (finally a Fat/oil source)

Dried Belt Pulp (Stool hardener to make up for the crappy ingredients)

Chicken & Liver Digest (sh!t)

Fish Meal (good but to far down)

Salt (why?)



Just a little food for thought for everyone, maybe some will sit down and analyze the feed. If a premium dog food cost too much (down size your yard)! As the saying goes “you are what you eat” and so are your dogs.

[Bubba]

Dogs digestive tracks are better than you think, and they do fine on chicken and beef. The only meat we avoid is Pork. Fish is great as its high in the Omegas. When we feed the Barf diet, we feed Mon-Fri fresh meat, Sat a slop of veggies and fish, and fast on Sundays. The BARF diet puts them back to a natural diet that they would eat in the wild, and I've never seen my dogs looking as good as when they are on the BARF diet. The meat that we commonly use here is deer meat, which also is the highest in Natural Creatine, just make sure, like always, that your dogs have plenty of fresh water...
BB

[XxKonnectionsxX]

Hey BBK do you know where I could probably order some deer meat. I want some for myself too LOL!! I would love to feed some of that game meat to my dog. Very lean and it tastes good too.

[Bubba]

LOL out here in the woods at my place...

I get my deer meat from a butcher, get all his scraps everyday when I do the BARF diet...
BB

[XxKonnectionsxX]

I know that they are in the woods, but do you know any companies that maybe distribute the meat and sell it in bulk?

[Bubba]

Nope sure don't...
What we get, we get from here locally and fresh, no distributor that I know of...
BB

[TERRIBLE TEXAS]

why dont u go hunt, get all the deer u want?????



I know that they are in the woods, but do you know any companies that maybe distribute the meat and sell it in bulk?

[XxKonnectionsxX]

Dude if I had the time or lived in an area where I could hunt I would. But I don't, so therfore I'm looking for a distributor. Everybody on here doesn't live in the sticks.

[TERRIBLE TEXAS]

lol...................
Dude if I had the time or lived in an area where I could hunt I would. But I don't, so therfore I'm looking for a distributor. Everybody on here doesn't live in the sticks.

[CRG]

hunting season is right around the corner an i'll have my deep freezer stocked.

[GrChPitBitch]

I saw the ingrediant for the Canidae online last night... Its good stuff... but how much is it??!!
GrChPitBitch,



Thanks for the link to SportMix. I’m glad you like it and have done well with it. It doesn’t compare to Canidae or other premium dog foods (Chicken Soup, Martin’s K-9, etc..) though.



First ten ingredients of Canidae:



Chicken Meal, Turkey Meal, Brown Rice, White Rice, Lamb Meal, Chicken Fat, (preserved with mixed Tocopherols and Ascorbic Acid), Menhaden Fish Meal, Flax Seed, Sun Cured Alfalfa Meal, Sunflower Oil, ect.



You will notice 4 meat sources and 3 fat/oil sources in the first 10 ingredients. Canidae also provides the necessary probiotics, fermentation products, and added digestive enzymes to help your canine fully-utilize the ration. All human grade ingredients.



First ten ingredients of SportsMix High Energy:



Chicken By-Product Meal, Ground Yellow Corn, Meat Meal, Ground Wheat, Chicken Fat (preserved with mixed Tocopherols, a source of natural Vitamin E), Dried Beet Pulp, Chicken & Liver Digest, Fish Meal, Flaxseed, Salt, etc.



That right there says it all. You’re mistaken on the first ingredient (not chicken) but a by-product. I’ll break it all down for everybody that may or may not know what to look for in dog food using SportsMix:



Chicken By-Products (Made up of ground, slaughtered poultry, such as undeveloped eggs, necks, feet, and intestines)

Ground Yellow Corn (The nutrients in corn is far less available than those in rice)

Meat Meal (Finally a meat source)

Ground Wheat (The availability of nutrients for wheat, beans, and oats is poor)

Chicken Fat (finally a Fat/oil source)

Dried Belt Pulp (Stool hardener to make up for the crappy ingredients)

Chicken & Liver Digest (sh!t)

Fish Meal (good but to far down)

Salt (why?)



Just a little food for thought for everyone, maybe some will sit down and analyze the feed. If a premium dog food cost too much (down size your yard)! As the saying goes “you are what you eat” and so are your dogs.

[GrChPitBitch]

wuts the big deal with the chicken by-product stuff?? I know what it is... but... Look at fish sticks... LOL

[XxKonnectionsxX]

Yeh i know. Well I guess I'll just have to take a lil trip to my dad's house in the sticks and do a lil bow hunting so I can catch me some deer meat.

[Texasbulldogs]

I get Canidae locally (70 miles away) for $26.25 a bag and every 6th bag is free. So it actually cost me $21.88 a bag. Which is very reasonable for the quality.



wuts the big deal with the chicken by-product stuff??



As a general rule, you do NOT want to feed with any of the following




By-Product – BAD
Corn, Soy, or Wheat – BAD
Beet Pulp – BAD
Glutens in any form – BAD
Artificial Preservatives - BAD


What you are looking for in a feed is what your dog truly needs; Protein from quality sources (meat, fish, eggs) and fats and oils from quality sources (beef, chicken, flax). Meats and fats/oils should form bulk of any high-end feed. Carbohydrates are not needed (just a filler). Most all kibble feeds are going to have carbs, but they should be a minimum.




Meats and Eggs (Human grade) – GOOD
Fats and Oils – GOOD
NO Beet Pulp – GOOD
Added Fermentation Product and Digestive enzymes – GOOD


There is quite a few good quality feeds out there these days. If you look and ask around you may find some that will suite your canine athletes better.

[badnews_VA]

Nutra Ultra puppy food ingredients-


Chicken Meal
Brown Rice
Rice Bran
Lamb Meal
Poultry Fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols, natural source of Linoleic Acid)
Round Rice
Sunflower Oil (preserved with mixed tocopherols, natural source of Linoleic Acid)
Flaxseed (natural source of Alpha Linolenic Acid)
Natural Flavors
Beet Pulp
Alfalfa
Salmon Meal
Oatmeal
Tomato Pomace
Fish Oil
Cranberry
Dried Egg Product
Kelp

and so on............ just wanted to know what yall thought about this brand and if any of you ever heard on Innova? i read on this guys website that it was the best out there but very expensive, these are the ingredients- i prefer to get the advice from the ones that know before i waste my money.
Turkey (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='27'])Chicken (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='3'])Chicken Meal (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='1'])Ground Barley (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='35'])Ground Brown Rice (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='17'])Potatoes (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='194'])Natural Flavors (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='3108'])Ground White Rice (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='16'])Chicken Fat (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='22'])Herring (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='42'])Apples (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='3054'])Carrots (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='30'])Cottage Cheese (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='31'])Sunflower Oil (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='25'])Alfalfa Sprouts (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='32'])Egg (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='160'])Garlic (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='128'])Taurine (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='55'])Vitamins/Minerals (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='41'])Viable Naturally Occurring Microorganisms (http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=ingredient-facts&pxsl=//ingredient[@id='3160'])

[rocksteady]

be careful when it comes to raw food, according to some sled owners in the yukon, you should only feed raw fish not chicken or beef or pork, it has bacteria on it that could harm on the long run a digestive system. some say they have feed raw meat for a time but, maybe they have just been fortunate not to have the bacteria......

YES!!! Not to mention that some dogs have DIED from the bones!!! (perforated intestines, stomachs, etc) In the wild, wolves also eat the hide of the animal and the hide acts as a buffer for the smaller bones they cruch and swallow . Without the buffer those small bones can get stuck or puncture sensitive organs. Not to mention if the dog tries to throw it up..

While fresh food is the best way to go, many of human meat products are not as healthy as one thinks. Cows, chickens, pigs are fed all types of steroids, hormones, etc and the stuff isnt even that great for us! The way to go would be organic, all nautral free range.

Also..raw eggs can cause some serious problems ( cooked egg whites are an awsome source of protein) Raw veggies are excellent, too

I have always feed the Diamond Lamb and Rice..a bit more money than the green bag but even without alot of brushing my dogs coats are soft and shinny and shed alot less than when on the green bag ( the green diamond contians CORN which is nothing more than a filler) Lamb and Rice contains no by products, corn and wheat free ..runs about 20.00 for a 40 pound bag..but I have excellent results (I also add some cooked chicken, fresh veggies) I've tried Canidae, Nautrals, Solid gold and all had the same results as the Diamond Lamb and Rice except cost wise.

[azdog]

Is Canidae A Common Dog Food,can It Be Easly Found?

[XxKonnectionsxX]

YES!!! Not to mention that some dogs have DIED from the bones!!! (perforated intestines, stomachs, etc) In the wild, wolves also eat the hide of the animal and the hide acts as a buffer for the smaller bones they cruch and swallow . Without the buffer those small bones can get stuck or puncture sensitive organs. Not to mention if the dog tries to throw it up..

While fresh food is the best way to go, many of human meat products are not as healthy as one thinks. Cows, chickens, pigs are fed all types of steroids, hormones, etc and the stuff isnt even that great for us! The way to go would be organic, all nautral free range.

Also..raw eggs can cause some serious problems ( cooked egg whites are an awsome source of protein) Raw veggies are excellent, too

I have always feed the Diamond Lamb and Rice..a bit more money than the green bag but even without alot of brushing my dogs coats are soft and shinny and shed alot less than when on the green bag ( the green diamond contians CORN which is nothing more than a filler) Lamb and Rice contains no by products, corn and wheat free ..runs about 20.00 for a 40 pound bag..but I have excellent results (I also add some cooked chicken, fresh veggies) I've tried Canidae, Nautrals, Solid gold and all had the same results as the Diamond Lamb and Rice except cost wise.


How would raw eggs cause serious health problems? And how can COOKED egg whites be a good source of protein? I'm sure it will have some in it, but once its cooked you kill out all the good nutrients.

[Bubba]

Dogs stomachs can take more than you think, dogs don't normally get salomenella (I know I spelt that wrong) the way humans do. Eggs also are a good source of protein. I had fed the BARF diet for about 1.5yrs and never had a single problem, like I said, the only meat we refrained from was Pork.

BB

[XxKonnectionsxX]

I know that BBK. But that guy said that raw eggs were a bad idea. To me if a person posts something saying why something is bad, (and this is an informational forum) then that person should state WHY something is bad and not just say this and that is bad and then leave it without explanation as to why it is. I'm not trying to come off with an attitude. I just like to know people's reasons as to why they don't like or agree with something.


As to pork, I heard pork was real bad too because of all that salt and the fat content is waaay too high.


Hey BBK you have some nice looking dogs on your yard. Do you feed your pups raw as well? Or do you wait until they get to a certain age and then start them out on a raw diet?

[MTNDOG]

www.canidae.com (http://www.canidae.com)

[Texasbulldogs]

The albumen in eggs is the most biologically available natural protein there is, and the yolk is loaded with vitamins. It is my understanding that the albumen is best utilized lightly cooked (soft-boiled).





AZDog;

You can go to their website (Canidae’s) a look for a store locator. They also will deliver it to your door.



BadnewsVA;

If you look at the first ten ingredients of the Nutra Ultra puppy you will notice 2 meat sources 3 fats/oils. But if you would add up all the weight of the rice it would be the #1 ingredient of the feed not a meat source. So I personally don’t like that or the fact they have to add natural flavors (what are they camouflaging?) and beet pulp. Yes the Innova is a high-quality feed.

[Bubba]

When we fed the BARF diet, yes we fed pups on it as well, but we also gave them kibble to insure they got all the nutrients they needed. Usually with pups we would start with chicken backs and wings.

BB

[badnews_VA]

thanks Texasbulldogs for the help

[Texasbulldogs]

Your welcome

[rocksteady]

Dogs can get batacteria from raw eggs..salmonella and that was told to me by Mr Norrod himself. If anyone one knows these dogs, he does. ) They can also get sick from chewing on too much raw wild game meat like deer if lest out too long.. Alot of blood borne parisites can be found in raw meat/ bones if unproperlly handled.


Actually..dogs have very sensitive digestive systems..think about it when you switch between different bags of dog food how they get runny stool and why they say to gradually adjust when switching to a new food ... Dogs can pick up viruses and baterial from puddles of water, etc. Granted..I would say the game bred APBt is more hardy than most as they are not know to suffer from allergies, ect like many "show bred" dogs due to the breeding pratices of dogmen.


I'm not debating that "raw" or "natural" is not good..just that it isnt 100% safe and there are drawbacks to it. I personally know someone who started her dogs on the BARF diet and thats exactly what her dogs did (she researched well, followed it right) and then ended up with a dead dog and one with high vet bills) ..the bones had pierced the dogs stomachs and the other dog barfed the bones back up and gaged/ choked to death.


Have I fed my dogs raw meat? Yes. they do get it occasionally ,as with cooked, veggies, cooked eggs.. on occasion I have given them raw meaty bones to chew on..only I had a dog that could actually break those, too and had nothing but the runs afterwards

[XxKonnectionsxX]

Dogs can get batacteria from raw eggs..salmonella and that was told to me by Mr Norrod himself. If anyone one knows these dogs, he does. ) They can also get sick from chewing on too much raw wild game meat like deer if lest out too long.. Alot of blood borne parisites can be found in raw meat/ bones if unproperlly handled.


Actually..dogs have very sensitive digestive systems..think about it when you switch between different bags of dog food how they get runny stool and why they say to gradually adjust when switching to a new food ... Dogs can pick up viruses and baterial from puddles of water, etc. Granted..I would say the game bred APBt is more hardy than most as they are not know to suffer from allergies, ect like many "show bred" dogs due to the breeding pratices of dogmen.


I'm not debating that "raw" or "natural" is not good..just that it isnt 100% safe and there are drawbacks to it. I personally know someone who started her dogs on the BARF diet and thats exactly what her dogs did (she researched well, followed it right) and then ended up with a dead dog and one with high vet bills) ..the bones had pierced the dogs stomachs and the other dog barfed the bones back up and gaged/ choked to death.


Have I fed my dogs raw meat? Yes. they do get it occasionally ,as with cooked, veggies, cooked eggs.. on occasion I have given them raw meaty bones to chew on..only I had a dog that could actually break those, too and had nothing but the runs afterwards


You're right dogs can catch bacteria or salmonella from eggs. BUT think about it. How often do you think a wild dog would actually catch this type of deadly bacteria? If the dog is in good health then there is no reason for them to contract this disease. Plus salmonella is everywhere. Its not just in eggs. Its on in your car, your grass, the dirt you walk on, It could be in your couch. Who knows. But the point is, its everywhere and if you or your dog were going to catch it, it would have been caught.


A dog's digestive system is really not sensitive at all. The only reason they have upset stomachs when you switch over their food is because of the different chemicals that are in their food. WHen the food is switched, their system is not used to the new food chemicals that are being put in their system. Like you were saying, they can get sick from eating meat that has been sitting out too long. Anyone would. But when you feed them, its not like they are going to just let their meat sit there either. its gonna get eaten righ away. I don't know any dog that would just let their meat sit in their bowls while they wait to eat it.

Also there are dangers with the raw diet just like there is with dog food. There have been dogs who have choked on their dry commercial food just as well as some who have choked on bones as well. The point is to monitor your dogs and go from there. If you know your dog likes to just bolt its food down its throat then maybe bones aren't the best idea. As far as bones piercing the stomach, there must have been some cooked bones in there, because its rare that a dog will get stabbed by a raw uncooked bone. They just don't splinter and break like that. I'm not saying that it couldn't happen, but something else must have happened that she didn't tell you.



Anywhoo keep up the good debates. The posts on this subject are always good.

[Texasbulldogs]

The reason you need to slowly switch dog food is because most are feeding a poor quality fed. A high quality food will not give your dog an upset stomach or diarrhea from a sudden switch.

With a RAW diet most people make the mistake of feeding chicken pieces that are too small.

[XxKonnectionsxX]

I thought so. I think thats why a dog would choke on a bone or get their stomach's stabbed by a small bone instead of a bigger weight bearing bone.

[PitBulls4Life98]

I feed Buckeye Superbits and I mix in raw chicken or raw beef with their dry kibble.. And have had very good results....Buckeye Superbits is a high protien high fat food..... 30% protien to 20% fat.. It is formulated for both adult dogs and puppies.... The price ranges from $18.00 - $24.00 for a 40 pound bag......

[olympianbulldogs]

I feed my dogs Iams Large Breed Puppy & when I have the Money I prefer to get the new Eukanuba Natural Lamb & rice Adult Maintenance & I also buy a 10lb bag of Chicken Quarters , Brown Rice , Yams . boil the chicken rice and yams alltogether for about 1/2 hour dont matter if its cooked thru then i grind that all up in the blender & pour over the kibble. I like this best because you dont have to worry about providing all the nutrients like in the raw diet because they get that in the kibble. Overall excellent feed small firm stools & really gives thedogs the extra energy they need for WORKING. Im also onna start adding fish oilto this Ill let yallknow the results of that.

[GrChPitBitch]

When I asked what the big deal with chicken bi-product was, all I got, was it was BAD... Is this just what you had been fed by the media, or do you know from actual experiance..?? In my experiance, the dog food that is loaded with corn for #1 ingrediant is BAD... I saw coats, muscle tone, activity level, all deminish in quality.... My dogs look great on what they get... for the price, I cant beet it... Were I live, I would have to get the fancy shmancy stuff delivered.... and the cost are outragious if you want to be able to spend money on your dogs in other aspects, and suport yourself and your family at the same time... If you think about what they would be eating in the wild, chicken biproduct might not be all that bad...

[Crash97]

IMO while by-products aren't the best cuts of meat, they are parts consumed in nature. I've yet to see a dog or wolf only eat the muscle tissue of its kill, in fact the first thing they go after is the internal organs. And by-products are largely composed of organs along with the beaks and feet, etc. Short of implementing the $$BARF$$ diet, which I most certainly would if financially able, I believe a quality commercial food such as Diamond (green bag) is the next best thing. And by the way even Ol' Roy is prob. better than what a lot of past champions were kept with. ;) I'm not endorsing it just stating a fact.

[Texasbulldogs]

When I asked what the big deal with chicken bi-product was, all I got, was it was BAD... Is this just what you had been fed by the media, or do you know from actual experience

Canines are not meant to primarily eat corn, wheat, by-products, ect... As Crash97 stated: carnivores do consume the whole prey including the organs, but these foods are not acceptable as a steady diet! The protein source and quality is very important and that’s were many people get confused. The protein food should be of HIGH QUALITY. Most commercial dogs food companies use the cheaper less quality ingredients because it is CHEAP and means more profit for them.

My dogs look great on what they get... for the price

Key words “FOR THE PRICE”. Enough said right there that is the problem with most people involved with these dogs (half ass care). But yet when the dogs don’t work out for whatever reason it’s never the owner’s fault. Even though they received sub-standard care their entire life and never afforded the opportunity to develop to their true potential.

Were I live, I would have to get the fancy shmancy stuff delivered.... and the cost are outragious if you want to be able to spend money on your dogs in other aspects, and suport yourself and your family at the same time...

Then you should cut back on the amount of dogs you keep. If the amount of dogs you have don’t allow you to feed them optimally and provide the best of care.

On a side note GrChPitBitch; you asked me why it was bad (by-products)? Hopefully I’ve answered your question. But tell me why it is not bad. And no I didn’t receive my information from the “media”; I’ve taken the time to research it for my dogs.

[carson3535]

Hey, I feed my pitbull Nutro and Bil Jak, but I'm going for a bulk look. I've feed pitbulls, Akitas, and labs Bil Jak and it has been great. Also I give them raw and cooked deer meat that I would even eat.

[Yung-One]

These are the ingredients to Black Gold. It's what I feed my boy and he seems to be doing well off it. If I can get better then someone please tell me in dummy terms why this stuff is bad for him when he seems to be very healthy.....!!!

Meat Meal, Corn Meal, Corn Gluten Meal, Ground Wheat, Poultry Fat (Preserved with BHA, Citric Acid and Mixed Tocopherols-Source of Vitamin E), Chicken By Product Meal, Dried Beet Pulp, Natural Poultry Flavoring, Salt, Potassium Chloride, Brewer’s Dried Yeast, Sodium Propionate, Choline Chloride, Zinc Sulfate, Ferrous Sulfate, Vitamin E Supplement, Zinc Oxide, Manganous Oxide, Copper Sulfate, Vitamin 812 Supplement, Niacin, Biotin, Vitamin A Acetate, Calcium Pantothenate, Thiamine Mononitrate (Vitamin B1), Calcium lodate, Sodium Selenite, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Menadione Sodium Bisulfate Complex (Vitamin K), Riboflavin (Vitamin B2), Vitamin D3 Supplement, Cobalt Carbonate and Folic Acid

[carson3535]

was wondering wht people thought about Bil Jac and if its good to feed for bulk and strength. Thanks

[XxKonnectionsxX]

I think the best thing for a person to do before he decides what food to feed or switch his dog to, is to pick up a book or log on to a website and do some reading. Before you can understand what dog food will do what or what will be the best for your dog, you should understand how a dog's system works. How nutrients are processed and how their body utilizes them. I know that when I got that understanding down, it was a lot easier for me to choose what to feed my dog. That way I wouldn't just be constantly switching and asking eveyone's opinion on what dog food is best. Check out some of the links we have in our links section. You'll find the information very useful.

[Texasbulldogs]

“tell me in dummy terms why this stuff is bad for him

Meat Meal, Corn Meal, Corn Gluten Meal, Ground Wheat, Poultry Fat (Preserved with BHA, Citric Acid and Mixed Tocopherols-Source of Vitamin E), Chicken By Product Meal, Dried Beet Pulp, Natural Poultry Flavoring, Salt, Potassium Chloride”

Minimal quality meat sources, corn, by-products, beet pulp, BHA (potential cancer causing), flavoring, slat and potassium (too much salt can irritate the digestive tract, and upset the calcium/potassium balance in your dog) these are just some of the reasons this is a poor quality feed for a carnivore.

[Whiskey Bay]

I feed a commercial feed daily and every other day my dogs get raw chicken necks.There is nothing wrong with feeding the chicken or beef,as long as you don't overdo it.Make sure the meat is fresh and hasn't been handled too much.Your dog has natural bacteria in their intestines ,so as long as your dog is healthy and you don't overdo the meat it is good for them.
I will be posting on this subject soon so check out the articles.