Protection Training

[NcPrisonGuard]

So I am thinking about getting Boomer protection trained.. I was directed to a guy who does everything from basic obedience up to protection training/bite control... he's trained dogs with the durham police deptartment.. He's got the credentials..and I went and watched some of his dogs work at his yard.. and was particularly impressed with a Fila that was protection trained also watched a APBT he was currently training on the bite sleeve...

So my question i do any of you have or know anyone who has an APBT trained this way.. and how do they do?

[14rock]

Ask him what his percentages are for dogs that mature into great protection dogs, that work the sleeve. If he claims all the dogs he trains bite the sleeve, stay away. Most dogs have no business hitting a sleeve, only a select few are stable enough to take their training to this level. Anybody with a sleeve and a backyard can call themselves a protection trainer, that doesnt mean anything.

I dont believe in using APBT's in bite sports, but thats just my opinion, and we've debated this enough times I will stay out of it.

[Luke.UK]

Why would you train your dog to do somthing it should n`t be doing??Pits aren`t protetion(sp) or guard dogs.200yrs breeding and culling has give us a dog that shouldn`t BITE humans why try to undo that?there are lots of different breeds used this type of work,i dont mean any thing personal, but would anyone try to get a GSD to be game!it`s not in there nature.i think trying to change the breed into somthing it isn`t just adds to BSL,but then again what do i know?:)

[purplepig]

You said he has credentials, get names and call the people. ask questions, and if there is any hesitation in their voice, go somewhere else. There is no room for hesitation with this type of training(hesitation in their voices=doubt). Ask them if they'd use them again.
Also, have you considered the adverse effects of having a dog with this type of training?
I would suggest you reading a good book on the subject. There is a book called, "Man Biter", I think. It's a pretty good read and gives you several senerios of situations you may not have thought of.

Would a bulldog make a good protection dog? Yes and no. As always, it depends upon the dog. I have trained several, but I would in noway consider myself a professional, as I have never trained, not would I, a dog for this line of work that I did not have as a pup. I begin them, not in attack training, not obedience training at this age, but I do begin the bonding at this age and encourage the canine instincts that are there. Also, I would hate to use the dog upon a person, and...I have never had to. The pre-curser to the action comand has always ended any situation I have been in.

As always, please consider the breed before puttingone of them out there. If not properly trained, and properly handled, your in for a mess. Heck, even if the attacker had a gun, and you did everything by the book you would probably still be sued.

Just one question. Why do you feel that you would need a guardian dog?

[Riptora]

This is pretty much the most extreme thing you can do with your dog. I think this is a bad idea. This kind of training begins at 8 weeks ( bite work ). These dogs need to be tested to be sure they are the right material. These dogs are bred specifically for this purpose. There are some APBT's that are good in protection sports, but people who want a dog to train and work with, look for a breeder of these lines with proven heritage before hand. You are playing with fire. Most of the dogs who made headlines for fatally attacking humans were half a$$ protection trained by morons. There is absolutely NO room for error if this is something you really want to do.

I love ring sports, the training involved is amazing. If this is something you really want to do, you need to do your homework. It's great that you watched this trainer work with his dogs, but that doesn't matter if you don't know what to look for in a protection routine. There is a huge ammount of info involved, it's a lot more than just a dog biting a sleeve on command. It sounds great that he has trained police dogs, but that's still not enough to form your decision.

This is something you will spend at least 3 days a week working on. The equipment and personal training is expensive and because it is not the most common sport, you either have to travel often or it may take a while to earn titles. This is NOT what APBT's were made for, and there are many other breeds who were meant for this work. I would just buy a pup from proven lines and start training at 8 weeks ( like you're supposed to ). I am VERY skeptical of someone offerring to protection train a dog who was not originally intended for that purpose.

Here is a good site to find info ALL about this subject. Read, read, read...
www.leerburg.com (http://www.leerburg.com/)

I have been wanting to get into this kind of work for several years. I have been researching the training, equipment, breeds, clubs and breeders for years and I am no where near ready. Please, look into this long and deep before you train your dog to bite humans.

Maximusab-is hard core into this kind of training, PM him, he is very good at answering questions.

[Marty]

This is pretty much the most extreme thing you can do with your dog. I think this is a bad idea. This kind of training begins at 8 weeks ( bite work ). These dogs need to be tested to be sure they are the right material. These dogs are bred specifically for this purpose. There are some APBT's that are good in protection sports, but people who want a dog to train and work with, look for a breeder of these lines with proven heritage before hand. You are playing with fire. Most of the dogs who made headlines for fatally attacking humans were half a$$ protection trained by morons. There is absolutely NO room for error if this is something you really want to do.
I love ring sports, the training involved is amazing. If this is something you really want to do, you need to do your homework. It's great that you watched this trainer work with his dogs, but that doesn't matter if you don't know what to look for in a protection routine. There is a huge ammount of info involved, it's a lot more than just a dog biting a sleeve on command. It sounds great that he has trained police dogs, but that's still not enough to form your decision.
This is something you will spend at least 3 days a week working on. The equipment and personal training is expensive and because it is not the most common sport, you either have to travel often or it may take a while to earn titles. This is NOT what APBT's were made for, and there are many other breeds who were meant for this work. I would just buy a pup from proven lines and start training at 8 weeks ( like you're supposed to ). I am VERY skeptical of someone offerring to protection train a dog who was not originally intended for that purpose.
Here is a good site to find info ALL about this subject. Read, read, read...
www.leerburg.com (http://www.leerburg.com/)
I have been wanting to get into this kind of work for several years. I have been researching the training, equipment, breeds, clubs and breeders for years and I am no where near ready. Please, look into this long and deep before you train your dog to bite humans.
Maximusab-is hard core into this kind of training, PM him, he is very good at answering questions.WOW! great minds think alike, great post, I couldn't have said it any better myself ;)

Reps points headed your way :D

[Hoyden]

I would check with Chris Fraize for a Reference of someone in your area who has the experience and knowledge to do personal protection work with a pitbull.

He does great work with his dogs and truly understands this breed.

This is his site: http://www.k9sts.com
I don't suggest that you call or email him until after next weekend. He is hosting the Working Pit Bull Terrier Club of America National Championships next weekend, so he's going to be wicked busy.


Here is another board, Working Pit Bull Terrier Club of America that you can post a question on to help you find a good trainer . http://members4.boardhost.com/workingpit/

I would suggest spending alot of time reading, watching and learning before taking this step forward. Working with a great trainer who knows what he/she is doing can be wonderful, a bad one can ruin your dog.

[ghost 1]

I have one trained simular to this,,,,,but I wouldn't if i didn't have to,,,,but training a apbt to do this is very risky,,, and why? they have too much drive to know when to quit,,, it's a dangerous situation to have if your not around all the time to supervise a dog,,,it's fairly easy done but it's a risky move,,,i personally won't own one if i didn't have to that is this way,,,because if anyone of them got loose it would really bother me if it was her,,,
cuz i know what she is capable of,,,now on top of that being able to make sure one like that won't get loose is another thing,,,alot of work,,,, You do what you think you need to,,,they can be great at it as long as it's always and i do mean always supervised,,,(supervised- always able to keep a good eye on the dog and know where the dog is) now out of 20+ years of owning alot of them,,,she is the only one that i've gotten bitten by,,,but i got in the middle of the two in a yard accident,,,but i can't hold her for that cuz she was biting after the other and my hand went right in the wrong place at the right time,,,,MY FAULT

[XxKonnectionsxX]

I say if you want to do that type of work, just go get a dog bred to do that. People LOVE to want to change things to what they want it to be, and not what it was initially created for. Then you have PROBLEMS...think about it.......

[PitBull_30]

It is a big responsibility for sure but if you want to do it you have to make sure you do it right. The dog should not be in the least bit shy or human aggressive. A protective dog is a good candidate but a human aggressive one is a liability. Also, make sure you REALLY check this guy out. Someone who trains police dogs isn't always a good person to go to. A LOT of police dogs are uncontrollable, human aggressive, fear biters who should have been culled at 8 weeks. It's important to see how he gets a dog off the sleeve too. He shouldn't have to touch the dog, the dog should release on command. The command should come once, not be repeated or yelled. He should also be able to tie the dog to a fence 20 to 30 feet from the handler and then have someone in a suit agitate him. The dog shouldn't show any aggression. The point of this is to see if he's HA or protective. A HA dog will go after anyone he can as long as he thinks he won't get in trouble. Several times when people walk up to the handler in a big winter coat in a friendly way the HA dog will go after them. A good protective dog will be fine with everybody unless he is a threat. If it's a threat the dog should go after it no matter who or what it is. Just be selective.

[Okye]

I would check with Chris Fraize for a Reference of someone in your area who has the experience and knowledge to do personal protection work with a pitbull.

He does great work with his dogs and truly understands this breed.

This is his site: http://www.k9sts.com (http://www.k9sts.com/)
I don't suggest that you call or email him until after next weekend. He is hosting the Working Pit Bull Terrier Club of America National Championships next weekend, so he's going to be wicked busy.


Here is another board, Working Pit Bull Terrier Club of America that you can post a question on to help you find a good trainer . http://members4.boardhost.com/workingpit/

I would suggest spending alot of time reading, watching and learning before taking this step forward. Working with a great trainer who knows what he/she is doing can be wonderful, a bad one can ruin your dog.


Where in NC are you located. You want to be careful when looking for trainers for our dogs. They do not train like GSDs or Mals. It takes a special person to maintain the balance from defense to prey. Now my question is do you want a dog trained in Personal Protection or do you want a dog to compete with in Schutzhund, Mondio, or French Ring? If on of the sports find a trainer who has TITLED A PITBULL IN THE SPORT. if you would like you can contact me and I will see who I can find in your area to help you.


lastero@saic.com

[pennsooner]

So I am thinking about getting Boomer protection trained.. I was directed to a guy who does everything from basic obedience up to protection training/bite control... he's trained dogs with the durham police deptartment.. He's got the credentials..and I went and watched some of his dogs work at his yard.. and was particularly impressed with a Fila that was protection trained also watched a APBT he was currently training on the bite sleeve...

So my question i do any of you have or know anyone who has an APBT trained this way.. and how do they do?














I'm all for bite SPORT with Pitbulls, provided its a legit organization doing the event. But REAL protection training, thats another story. I'm not sure I'd go for it under any circumstances with a Pitbull.

Get a real protection dog, a CO or something of the sort.

[NcPrisonGuard]

Like I said I am considering it, I haven't decide one way or the other. Its mainly for my wife more than myself, I work crazy hours and she's home alone alot.. I've got guns and she's terrifed of them. I'm not going to go out and buy a German Shepherd or any other dog.. I've got 3 dogs and I'm quite content to keep that as the limit of dogs in my house. The guy I went to see had a Fila Brasiliero or whatever its called.. some freaking huge mastiff like dog, that he trained as his own personal dog, it responded to all commands on the first call hand and voice signals.. he had an APBT that was working the sleeve.. with his partner (the bitee) holding a starter pistol.. the dog attacked bit..shook... the release comman was given, the dog returned to handler and sat. It was impressive. He'd put Boomer through whatever courage test thing it is he was talking about and see if his temperment and such were right. Again.. this isn't for sure its just a thought, and I'll keep ya'll posted

[purplepig]

Well, if it is for your wife, just have her spoil the dog. He'll take care of her.

[NcPrisonGuard]

Well, if it is for your wife, just have her spoil the dog. He'll take care of her.
He already is spoiled.. he's a 65lb lap dog.

[purplepig]

He already is spoiled.. he's a 65lb lap dog.
Back when I was very stupid and ignorant(yes, it used to be WAY worse!!) I tried many different ways to raise these dogs, looking back now, I was conducting experiments( you know I like experimentation) as to the method and result of training dogs, bulldogs in particular, as this was all that was on my place. I believe the most I had on the yar was 82 full grown(over 2yrs), but we'll call it 80. I tried all kinds of ways to raise and train them. And what I found was that if I wanted the dog to be a family companion, protect my property, protect me and mine(if necessary), I spoiled the heck out of the dog. Taught it obedience, but the dog was with me every time it was possible, even slept beside the bed. Was well socialized. Kids could beat the dog in the head, and it would maybe look at me like "please get this kid to stop", and the was the extreme of it. But, when someone would come over with the wrong thing on their mind, even if they'd been at my house several times, and been in the person's lap,...well, lets just say that they would not be there very long. Every dog I have raised like this had a special trust for me, and I had a special trust for it. I was always the boss, but it seems to me that the dog would believe that me and my family and the house belonged to it. I could bring in something the dog had not seen, and it would get between me ant the thing, sniff it down, look at me and snort while moving it's head as if to say, "okay, it's safe to play with".!LOL Of course while I am writing this I am thinking of one dog in particular, but the same type of results were repeatable. Key being that allowing of the dog to be a part of the family, a big part. The first key, of course, was the breeding. Always. Some dogs, I dont know how to say it, I just know it when it is happening, they just wont work for what I want out of a family dog. Someone replied to a post I made and said that instinct and feelings were poor things to go on, well, I have to think that a person who does not value this 6th sense so to speak, is a person who has not been around enough to have developed it. I have several dogs on my place, all of which I like, well.... one I am considering culling, anyway, there is 5 of them that I would consider being a family dog, which is really a high percentage. One of them is a little gamey male. My wife trips on how he'll jump on every dog around(he's just playing). She thinks he may jump on one of the kids. But the truth is, that dog is more intune with people and wanting to please and be a part of than ... almost any other dog here.

I'll shut up for now. Sorry so long and if I drifted. In conclusion, formal protection, man stopping training is a very big step, as many have said, and I just dont see you have presented any reason for having one. Having a dog as I described above, yes, I think we all should have one, but that is a different animal than a trained guard dog. And even though I have very high confidence in a bulldog as a protection dog, I honestly would rather get another breed for it, so that if something went wrong, or something went right for that matter, the breed would not have another strike against it.

I had a bulldog once in the front yard, chained, when I lived in AR, and a stray, scraggly dog wondered into the chain area. You know what my dog did, and one of the neighbors came out and shot my dog. The stray wasnt his, and as a matter of fact he wanted that dog gone as it got into his trash on a regular basis, nevertheless, he shot my dog, intentionally, and killed him. I took him to court and he testified that he meant to kill my dog as it was killing the other dog, testified that the other dog was a stray, but just as soon as the judge heard "Pitbull", it was over with. Now, my question, what would happen if a mugger dame up, garnished a gun, your dog did perfectly, released when you told it to, and the would be mugger took off running, shed the gun a couple blocks down the road, and ran into a cop with the bloody arm, he tells the cop your dog bit him, cop finds you, and has to investigate. You go to court and the man has a lawyer, a new haircut, and a nice suit on. What would happen? As soon as the judge heard "Pitbull"? What would the reporters say? Even if the man had a record?

[PitBull_30]

Purplepig makes a good point. If you just want him to protect your wife if there is a problem just spoil him, love him, socialize him, and if she really is in danger he'll step up. Protection training is a LOT of work and it doesn't stop once he's trained. You have to work him with different people in different situations for the rest of his life.

[Diesel]

You;d be surprised how many dogs wont "step up" when the situation calls for it. The training is meant to put the dog in a relaxed state and to make them comfortable with the hormones, the situations, and the feelings that come with a bite situation. Fight or flight kicks in and training will teach your dog not only that it is okay to fight, but how to do it. I would say most pit bulls would not step up... most would put on a good show of bluffing but generally back down from an actual bite. Most times bluffing is all that is needed though. But when the intruder isnt buying what the dog is selling it may be neccesary to put up or shut up. I disagree with the assumption that bite work should start at 8 weeks old. I have studied with some groups that have titled dogs in schutzhund, work in ring sport, and PP work, and none of them go near sleeves until the dogs are reliable in OB and very well socialized.

You want your dog to be great in OB because a dog that cant be controlled in regular situations will really be out of control when that adrenaline is pumping and the emotions are high, like in a bite situation. 6-8 months is where I see most sleeve work starting, before that just tugs and light agitation. It is VERY hard work and you must be very dedicated to it... but it is also VERY rewarding. I worked my dobie in shuzhund when I was younger and there is nothing like having complete trust in your dogs ability to judge a situation and react properly. Its very fulfilling.
Here are some pics of my dobie Brianna and my rottie Odyssius-
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g135/oboykennels/BDP022.jpg
always working, here she is guarding my bed.
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g135/oboykennels/BDP009.jpg
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g135/oboykennels/BDP008.jpg
Sancho my little chi-
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g135/oboykennels/BDP030.jpg

[Riptora]

Like I said I am considering it, I haven't decide one way or the other. Its mainly for my wife more than myself, I work crazy hours and she's home alone alot.. I've got guns and she's terrifed of them. I'm not going to go out and buy a German Shepherd or any other dog.. I've got 3 dogs and I'm quite content to keep that as the limit of dogs in my house. The guy I went to see had a Fila Brasiliero or whatever its called.. some freaking huge mastiff like dog, that he trained as his own personal dog, it responded to all commands on the first call hand and voice signals.. he had an APBT that was working the sleeve.. with his partner (the bitee) holding a starter pistol.. the dog attacked bit..shook... the release comman was given, the dog returned to handler and sat. It was impressive. He'd put Boomer through whatever courage test thing it is he was talking about and see if his temperment and such were right. Again.. this isn't for sure its just a thought, and I'll keep ya'll posted
If you wanted a dog to help protect your family, you should have got one. APBT's are NOT naturally human aggressive and if they are, then they do not fit the standard and should be culled. If you try to turn your dog into something it is not ( a suspicious, guard animal ) than you can rest assured, it's only a matter of time before you have a serious accident on your hands. If you don't want to get another dog for this purpose and you are worried about your wife's safety, get some security systems and have your wife take some self defense classes. Your wife should learn martial arts, gain confidence to defend herself, something she can take with her everywhere and have full control over.

I would never buy a doberman ( my breed of choice ) and try to make it a hog dog just because it's my favorite breed. If I want a hog dog or a weight pull dog, I'm going with an APBT. The reason I fancy these breeds are for their breed traits and I don't believe in messing around with them, if there's something I want from them that they are lacking, then they are not the breed for me. You don't by a Corvette to go camping just because you like the way it looks. You know what you want out of something and you seek it out to fit your needs.

IMO a human aggressive APBT should be euthed ASAP. It is not their temperment and dogs with unstable temperments are a hazard. Drive has nothing to do with a dog not quiting in protection. Dogs who attack humans and don't quit, KILL people. A dog needs to let go when told to.

The ammount of time and money you are considering spending on training this dog could be spent on a 4th dog that was inteded for this purpose.

[Riptora]

You;d be surprised how many dogs wont "step up" when the situation calls for it. The training is meant to put the dog in a relaxed state and to make them comfortable with the hormones, the situations, and the feelings that come with a bite situation. Fight or flight kicks in and training will teach your dog not only that it is okay to fight, but how to do it. I would say most pit bulls would not step up... most would put on a good show of bluffing but generally back down from an actual bite. Most times bluffing is all that is needed though. But when the intruder isnt buying what the dog is selling it may be neccesary to put up or shut up. I disagree with the assumption that bite work should start at 8 weeks old. I have studied with some groups that have titled dogs in schutzhund, work in ring sport, and PP work, and none of them go near sleeves until the dogs are reliable in OB and very well socialized.

You want your dog to be great in OB because a dog that cant be controlled in regular situations will really be out of control when that adrenaline is pumping and the emotions are high, like in a bite situation. 6-8 months is where I see most sleeve work starting, before that just tugs and light agitation. It is VERY hard work and you must be very dedicated to it... but it is also VERY rewarding. I worked my dobie in shuzhund when I was younger and there is nothing like having complete trust in your dogs ability to judge a situation and react properly. Its very fulfilling.
Here are some pics of my dobie Brianna and my rottie Odyssius-
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g135/oboykennels/BDP022.jpg
always working, here she is guarding my bed.
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g135/oboykennels/BDP009.jpg
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g135/oboykennels/BDP008.jpg
Sancho my little chi-
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g135/oboykennels/BDP030.jpgNice dogs! YES, bite work starts immediately, but lets not confuse that with the sleeve. A dog is not ready to confront a human until it is 110% mentally mature. The puppy bite work is done with tugs and teaches the pup how to get a full mouth and hold. The sleeve work is stressful and that is where the real training begins.

This is important to clear up!

[Riptora]

Well, if it is for your wife, just have her spoil the dog. He'll take care of her.I agree, if your dog is a true part of your family, he/she more than likely will step up if something real bad were to present itself. Even chihuahuas are fierce. Bluffing is almost always all it takes. Only the boldest, most doped-out idiots would continue to push a dog ( the decoys' job in training ). Hell, a " Beware of Dog " sign freaks people out. How many people on this forum complain how others react to their dogs out of fear just because of the appearence?

[mydawgs]

I am so for APBT being participants in the ring sports, intensive OB is the start. I used to be opposed to any bite work for an APBT until I met Chris Fraize and saw two of his dogs at work...Rumble and Bronx. All I can tell you is these dogs are as well rounded as a dog can be both for companionship and tactical protection work. As I have stated before I believe the way Chris Fraize trains his dogs he uses OB as the foundation for any task. So when you see his dog in bite work I truely believe it is just another thing my Master told me to do and I happily did it. Chris had Rumble come off the bite and a couple seconds later I called him onto my lap and he was all pit bull hugs and kisses....it was amazing, truely amazing. And these dogs understand French LOL LOL LOL. Would I attempt that with a GSD or a Mal....NO WAY, but then I think those dogs are driven to perform in these areas instinctually....Pit Bulls do it cuz that big guy that trained me said so and that makes him happy with me....


When it comes to this kind of training and Pit Bulls no body does it better than Chris Fraize, check it out:

http://www.k9sts.com/staff/

Chris was the one who initially connected with my Am Staff and got me on the path to get her DA under control....not illiminated, she is what she is....but now I call the shots, and I have Mr. Fraize to thank for setting me down the right path!!!!!!!

[Hoyden]

Where in NC are you located. You want to be careful when looking for trainers for our dogs. They do not train like GSDs or Mals. It takes a special person to maintain the balance from defense to prey. Now my question is do you want a dog trained in Personal Protection or do you want a dog to compete with in Schutzhund, Mondio, or French Ring? If on of the sports find a trainer who has TITLED A PITBULL IN THE SPORT. if you would like you can contact me and I will see who I can find in your area to help you.


lastero@saic.com
I recognize your name! I believe that I will be seeing you this weekend at the Nationals.

Look for either little girl with head full of spring curls that looks like Shirley Temple wearing a pit bull T-shirt or a woman with a really bad limp and you'll find me.

Oh - I'll be selling some dog collars too. ;)

[gil230]

Well, we take obedience classes in a place that specializes in The Belgian Ring. Mostly all that dogs involved are Belgian Malinois. I will not part take in the protection training with Azul because I don't feel that I need to train him to protect me or my family and because I don't feel he would excell at the sport. He is very well trained at 10 months and I will only do obedience training. But the Belgian Ring is sooooooooooooooooo exciting and cool that if I ever get the itch to get involved in the Sport, I will then get a Belgian Malinois. I guess since I currently live in Belgium, if I do decide to try the sport, I will get a Malinois from Belgian working lines.

[Diesel]

Nice dogs! YES, bite work starts immediately, but lets not confuse that with the sleeve. A dog is not ready to confront a human until it is 110% mentally mature. The puppy bite work is done with tugs and teaches the pup how to get a full mouth and hold. The sleeve work is stressful and that is where the real training begins.

This is important to clear up!
I see waht you mean, when I hear the term bitework I immediately mean the sleeve or suit. My fault.


Only people who dont truely understand the psychology behind the training will think it instills aggression.
The dogs are not taught to hate people or that its okay to bite people. They are taught that its thier job to control "aggressive threats". Anybody on the street should be able to approach your dog with no problem, if they are trained right. There should be no aggression to any non-threateneing individuals, thats why socilization is the first thing you do. You want the dog to understand that people of all ages, size, colors, and personalities can be good.... but at the same times if that person began to behave in a suspicious or aggressive manner it should call the dogs attention and make them watch them closely. A lot of dogs of any breed are completley oblivious to threat detection, they dont know how to watch and properly react. That what the training does. any by allowing them the bite you are getting them used to the sensation and making them more controllable if the threat ever escalates that high. It teaches them the proper way to react and makes sure that your commands dont fall on "deaf" ears, when the situation does occur.
+
If anyone has ever tried to get their dog to do something it has never done before: walk on a treadmill, jump in a trailer, walk on a leash... the dog is nervous and scared and often times freaks and reacts in the wrong way. By allowing them to do these things repeatedly with direction and praise you teach them to control thier emotions in the situations. When that bite takes place a whole new level of adrenaline and enorphins kick in and your dog will not want to stop... you got to be able to control the dog, hence the OB work being so important. Your dog has got to respect your command as law, the first time you give it. you dont want to be standing by whil.e your dog mauls some guy for 10 minutes, even if he was the aggressor, your dog will problaby get put fdown as a vicious animal that you have no control over. sucks but I have seen it happen.

I personally dont see any problem with any breed working in ring sport, shutzhund, PP or whatever but I definately think that some breeds need stronger training, more dedicated techniques, and more attention to detail.
just my .2 cents