Blood line producing small dogs.

[Mouser]

What bloodline consistantly throws small dogs? What are some of the smallest sizes that you have seen personally. Thanks in advance, Mouser

[houstonapbt]

Didn't you post this when you first joined? lol.

[shadyridgekennel]

Didn't you post this when you first joined? lol.
well my chinman/frisco/sorrel bitch is small she is 30lbs conditioned.

[powder925]

most banjo dogs are on the small side

[FearlessKnight]

well my chinman/frisco/sorrel bitch is small she is 30lbs conditioned.
so is ours...

[Mouser]

Didn't you post this when you first joined? lol.Well, I'm persistant if nothing else, LOL! Still looking for the answer. Thanks to those who posted. Mouser

[SApits]

i'd have to say look at the parents more specifically than looking at the bloodline

[Brothermarree]

Hey I know a guy who has some 22 lb Chinaman Dogs.

[bahamutt99]

I just got a chuckle out of this. Its a bit amusing to me that you don't see breeders specializing in producing the small-end dogs. You will see breeders that have some small dogs, but aren't really specializing in producing that size in particular. But you will see breeders specializing in producing the way-over-the-big-end heifers, and they make a special point to show you that their dogs are obese. (Oh, pardon me. I meant to say "emphasis on substance and bone.") :D

[Canis_Panther88]

I just got a chuckle out of this. Its a bit amusing to me that you don't see breeders specializing in producing the small-end dogs. You will see breeders that have some small dogs, but aren't really specializing in producing that size in particular. But you will see breeders specializing in producing the way-over-the-big-end heifers, and they make a special point to show you that their dogs are obese. (Oh, pardon me. I meant to say "emphasis on substance and bone.") :D

LOL!
So true, an APBT/Amstaff breeder admitting to breeding for certain unimportant traits is like a politician admitting that his policies are a scam. I think our responsibility as humans is to aspire to breeding animals that show signs of natural selection, because that automatically means superior health, not breeding something that would die if it were thrown into the wild. Nature wouldn't ever have selected a wolf to be 100 lbs, with a 26 inch head, a blue coat and a body that is a victim of gravity. And that way they admit it sickens me.

Jared

[Mouser]

Hey I know a guy who has some 22 lb Chinaman Dogs.It's not too hard to find examples of them that small in days gone by, but nowadays it is.

[SApits]

the bad thing is that people don't know anything about our breed will look at those fat dogs and think they are just bad @ss b/c of the way they look. and inside you wanna tell them what would really happen to one of those dogs.... they make me wanna throw up!

[Mouser]

It's not too hard to find examples of them that small in days gone by, but nowadays it is. I'm not talking about big dogs, I've asked this question before and it always gets high-jacked into talking about the giants, LOL! Just what does everyone think that a "Normal" weight of a pit bull should be? I have read it in the past but can't remember, what does the breed standard say, the original one, not one that has been updated to make current trends ok? Mouser

[sedaliapitbulls]

I am also looking for a 20-30 pounder full grown. In my area it is olmost impossable. So if you got a good looking good bloodline 20-30 apbt I am looking for one aswell. Fullgrown or a pup I dont care just not so older than 3 years old.

[B]

My heavy bred Chinaman dogs run 28-40 typically. The smallest female was around 29 lbs fat. The smallest male was 35 lbs fat. The largest dog in the litter topped the scales at 43 lbs. The sire was 55 unconditioned and the dame was 45 unconditioned. I have a heavy Little Gator ROM dog that is 40 lbs fat. Shaped I would say he's around 35-36 lbs.

Regards,

B

[Wayne]

I have mostly Boyles bred dogs.Most of my females average around 30-35lb chain weight,males 35-45lb chain.All of the ones I`ve had or bred have turnd out to be good bull dogs.

[bahamutt99]

I have read it in the past but can't remember, what does the breed standard say, the original one, not one that has been updated to make current trends ok? Mouser
I don't know about original, but the UKC standard states a preferred weight of 30-60 pounds, which sounds fine to me. However, they also say that dogs over or under those weights aren't going to be penalized if they are in proportion. That's all fine and good, but not enough people have a grasp of true porportion.

[14rock]

I said it in the other thread, and I'll say it again. Breeding for size will destroy the breed, whether its breeding for large dogs, or small dogs..its all the same. Dont get me wrong, I love the small dogs too..if we could magically make our dogs a certain size, I would run nothing but 35 lbers and even smaller if weights could be easily found. But since we cant, we can merely breed best to best, breed the best dogs we can and hope some of the good ones, also happen to be small statured ones. I seen a picture of I believe it was a 17 lb. dog (its been sometime ago,and I forget)....If that dog was producing gamedogs on par with all the larger dogs...you can bet your bottom dollar I'd be standing in line waiting for one. So much heart, in such a little package...its admirable, but foolish to breed for it or obtain below-average stock simply for looks, stature, and size.

[Mouser]

I said it in the other thread, and I'll say it again. Breeding for size will destroy the breed, whether its breeding for large dogs, or small dogs..its all the same. Dont get me wrong, I love the small dogs too..if we could magically make our dogs a certain size, I would run nothing but 35 lbers and even smaller if weights could be easily found. But since we cant,.........Why do you say that we can't possibly do that.............we can merely breed best to best, breed the best dogs we can and hope some of the good ones, also happen to be small statured ones. I seen a picture of I believe it was a 17 lb. dog (its been sometime ago,and I forget)......................I know Cadillac Jack has a small bitch named Minnie Mouse that's around that size, but I'd rather deal with others, I also remember a black guy with a kennel name with the word "Crazy" in it, but can't seem to find it again, he had a game bred tiny little gyp about that size....................If that dog was producing gamedogs on par with all the larger dogs...you can bet your bottom dollar I'd be standing in line waiting for one. So much heart, in such a little package...its admirable, but foolish to breed for it or obtain below-average stock simply for looks, stature, and size..................... I don't guess I understand your statement, "it would be foolish to breed for it or obtain below-average stock" How do you know it would be below average if you never tried it? A sound body, and the right attitude is what we are in search of, and if you want to get technical no dogs can be legally tested these days anyway. Mouser

[NCPatchwork]

I'm not talking about big dogs, I've asked this question before and it always gets high-jacked into talking about the giants, LOL! Just what does everyone think that a "Normal" weight of a pit bull should be? I have read it in the past but can't remember, what does the breed standard say, the original one, not one that has been updated to make current trends ok? Mouser
I believe the standard is 37-50 pounds...I've seen someone who breeds a smaller male...idk the bloodline.

[pennsooner]

.................... I don't guess I understand your statement, "it would be foolish to breed for it or obtain below-average stock" How do you know it would be below average if you never tried it? A sound body, and the right attitude is what we are in search of, and if you want to get technical no dogs can be legally tested these days anyway. Mouser







Its simple. Once you start breeding for ANYTHING other than gameness and ability, then your breeding for something else. IF you are breeding for small size, then gameness and ability have to move on down the list of your priorities.

[Wayne]

You have to remember also most of your small APBT weren`t bred to be that small.It`s through selective breeding for gamenes why the old APBTs were so small.Breeding so close or line breeding only the gamest Apbt.The closer the genetics get the smaller they start getting.In the old days of breeding it wasn`t as easy to find other game APBTs to out cross for the monsters we have today.The farther you get away from the original bloodlines the biger and dumber the dog will become.

[Pipbull]

Just a little off topic, but about the person with sorrel/chinaman/frisco...I thought sorrel's dogs were a little bit bigger. Not huge, but in the 40-55 range. What are some small ones off of his line?

[Mouser]

Its simple. Once you start breeding for ANYTHING other than gameness and ability, then your breeding for something else. IF you are breeding for small size, then gameness and ability have to move on down the list of your priorities.I disagree, people breed for alot of traits, gameness should be first, but with the ways things are today you can't test, so how do you know, weight pulling LOL! Hard bite, smarts, and different styles are all things that can be bred for, size seems like just another thing on your wish list. I'm not saying it would be a piece of cake to do, but with all of the dogs that are available through the internet, and more importantly through your web of friends, it shouldn't be impossible to do it, and still have game dogs in the end. I'm always amused by internet dogmen saying to do this or don't do that, when most don't know themselves. I might be all wrong in my thinking, but I'm going to try and find out. Thanks for your imput anyway, Mouser

[brolick]

I feel you

[realonebulldog]

Well, I'm persistant if nothing else, LOL! Still looking for the answer. Thanks to those who posted. MouserThink you are on the right trail....

[Attila]

I just got a chuckle out of this. Its a bit amusing to me that you don't see breeders specializing in producing the small-end dogs. You will see breeders that have some small dogs, but aren't really specializing in producing that size in particular. But you will see breeders specializing in producing the way-over-the-big-end heifers, and they make a special point to show you that their dogs are obese. (Oh, pardon me. I meant to say "emphasis on substance and bone.") :D
I wouldn't say I specialize in small end dogs but I prefer them and I breed to be at the low end of the standard and not the top or over. Nor under. I have a 30 pound bitch. Gretchen is 38 Baby is 36 I have not weighed count but I he isn't out of my stock. I hope he stays under 60 pounds but I wont force him to be. I take him to be about 40 now. Baby's mother was actually under the standard by 3 pounds. Her dad was 45 pounds. I am will keep count ADBA and dual him into Delta. and Dual my delta's into ADBA. Maybe UKC as well More play for me and more glory for them. Gretchen loves the Show ring and I am thinking count will too. Baby is a ham and likes to do flips in the air to draw attention from spectators. Gotta love them. Now my pups I am telling you are the finest looking dogs I have seen born. but then again I have said that of all my pups over the years. And I believe I have been very correct most times. Speaking of small dogs some one wants me to train their Boston Terrier for assisting an elderly man around the house. Looking on my list this will be my 30th dog trained for that purpose. This is also the 30th year of the establisment of my kennel. I am going to do the training at his house five days a week for however long it takes. And Now that it is a double 30 I am not going to discuss the fee and do it for free. The dog was provided him by a brother of mine from lodge. And this is for another brother in need. It will be fun as usual. And I will get to learn some history of my dear brothers life in the process. I can't believe that it has been that long. Both my Grandfathers helped set me up. When my mothers dad died his dogs were incorporated into my kennel And the C.N. Davis line of hounds became mine. When my Dads father died I carried on his line till it reached the goal he wanted for many years a grand night Champion. And I retired the name.I am a sentimental one. Any way I love the smaller dogs.

[Chato99]

The dogs I'm currently dealing with are all in the 30 pound range. My dog that I just picked up last night will probably not be much bigger than 35. Her father Tobe and mother Freckles are right in that range. These are all dogs from the Hendrick's Gonner white blood and pretty much all of them are small.

Conversely when I am around pulling you see lots of the big dogs and I honestly like them too. It impresses people who are breeding for strength to have a monster that pulls 7,000 pounds and once pulling came into vogue it was going to happen. So while I certainly understand how it frustrates people breeding for gameness that there is such a trend towards size, and would agree breeding for size alone is bad, it does make sense for the pulling community to want big strong dogs, even if they may not be pound for pound any stronger than the 40 pounders.

The only thing that I don't particularily like is the breeding of mixed dogs and claiming that they are something they're not. But from what I understand that was done in the old days with bulldogs breeding for gameness.

[BoiBoi]

Im just guessing here but i was thinking that maybe the smaller dogs back in the day had more terrier in the blood than usual so that made them a little smaller than the dogs that had more bulldog blood mixed in. Of course im just referring to when the breed was originally created but could that be something that is true nowadays too that maybe somewhere in the bloodline of a certain dog it had a dog with smaller terrier blood that caused the smaller size?

[newbieturtlepits]

im not breeding thanks to group opinions but my females are now 22fat lbs and 16 in condition lbs the males we would have bred to produce are now 14 lbs and 17 lbs.. wont be breeding anything , but , these dogs are from the turtlebuster line , we got very wirey female and super muscular male and went from there , got a long waiting list for any dogs , but again , not breeding.. guess they will have to shop elsewhere..i will let the ladies out of the kennel later and take pics of the lil darlins.. no body laugh at my fatty ok.. she is what is she is and i dont mind shes only for me.. the rednose .. is trim and stays that way.. shes all about the fight and lets everybody on the block know it.. only at 16 lbs .. she dont look like shes dangerous.. one thing about my dogs , they hunt the back yard.. always catching stuff back there , dead bodies abound.. its play to them but the wildlife i respect is dwindling.. now the big question .. how to stop that?

[newbieturtlepits]

Hey I know a guy who has some 22 lb Chinaman Dogs.these i would like to see as chinaman is around here.. maybe would like one , since, im about to lose my seventeen year old dobie and only want smaller doggs in my yard , i love the activity these guys have , nonstop movement at my house .. im in norfolk va , and would like to know if chinaman dogs are in my area that are small and tight.. would love another female to add to mine ty

[newbieturtlepits]

ops forgot .. are they game dogs .. i really like game lines best

[realonebulldog]

The dogs I'm currently dealing with are all in the 30 pound range. My dog that I just picked up last night will probably not be much bigger than 35. Her father Tobe and mother Freckles are right in that range. These are all dogs from the Hendrick's Gonner white blood and pretty much all of them are small.

Conversely when I am around pulling you see lots of the big dogs and I honestly like them too. It impresses people who are breeding for strength to have a monster that pulls 7,000 pounds and once pulling came into vogue it was going to happen. So while I certainly understand how it frustrates people breeding for gameness that there is such a trend towards size, and would agree breeding for size alone is bad, it does make sense for the pulling community to want big strong dogs, even if they may not be pound for pound any stronger than the 40 pounders.

The only thing that I don't particularily like is the breeding of mixed dogs and claiming that they are something they're not. But from what I understand that was done in the old days with bulldogs breeding for gameness. Pulling and fighting are absolute different things,thats the reason why they produce absolute different dogs.The fight produces Bulldogs, Pulling produces Pulldogs.

[newbieturtlepits]

pit bulls , pet bulls, bulldogs, pulldoggs. . i need a new dictionary now , all kidding aside, when youve attended a few meets and seen the dogs and have asked the line you here most.... what blood you carry in your dog and know in the minds of the person asking.. they are looking for gameness or they are looking for pulldogs... you can see it ... doesnt take much to know what each person is looking for... catch up on the competitions and try and make a few ,, you will gain some new respect for true dogmen and learn alot , you will also see the other side of it.. people looking for pups to make the newest statis quo dog... shorter . wider. bullier.. the IN thing... and you will see doggs that have been pitted...altho , they only whisper it on the side... spend all day there.. get the feel ,, it will be well worth the trip good luck