Responsible breeders???

[semo]

I don't know if this is against the rules or out of line, but I am in the middle of my research and have no clue how I am gonna find responsible breeders in my state and the states bordering it for when I get a dog next year. I would like to talk to some breeders and potentially get on a waiting list or something for a breeding between a couple of good dogs.

Can anyone please give me some advise how to find good breeders , because all I have found so far searching the net seems to be backyard breeders and a stigma or something on the forums where people are not supposed to advertise or sell dogs on forums etc.

I am in missouri

[pepper_mommy]

semo, please dont forget local rescues too when searching for the right puppy, especially if you can get a slightly older one for when the bitter winter comes! :)

[semo]

i have been bombarded w/ reiterations on the other forums to adopt and I am not gonna adopt. I have explained myself in the past and have rescued many animals / dogs. I choose not to this time , I want a pup and want to know exactly where it has come from + good bloodline etc.

I probably need to edit a signature to prevent this same reiteration about adopting dogs, it is getting quite annoying.

[pepper_mommy]

easy fella, not all of us have read every post from you!

[semo]

i know, it just drives me nuts that people gotta continually put it on every thread on every forum i got to multiple times.

And I get treated as a bad person for not rescuing a dog.

[pepper_mommy]

not that i care, but your sig may come off a little rude....just mho! its your dog and your life, i dont personally care what you buy, i just know a lot of people feel the need to buy certain dogs and never think of rescues....apparently thats not your situation, but i am not a mind reader. good luck on your search, sorry i couldnt have been more useful and was just annoying!

[semo]

i will remove it, but for now on i will just ignore all comments reguarding rescue.

[Attila]

lol. Ok Semo. I don't live far from you and I know several folks around your state that are reputable. However I would like to know what you intend to do with this dog? What sort of training? Conformation? etc. People suggest adoption because there are so many out there in shelters now. Not to annoy you to no end. your relatively new to this so lets start out on a good foot. We talked about dog houses and that the dog would be in the yard when you were not with it. You'll need to know how to place that doghouse, how to contain the dog in the yard and how to train this dog. We place concern because we have many up hill battles to fight for our breed. It by no means is to be offensive for you. Although it may seem people are mother hen pecking you. You would have to check out the Bad Pet Bull thread to understand just one inccedent of why. There are thousands of examples like that one. And know this a reputable and responsible breeder is going to drill you and check you out. Call your vet and references. Probably have a puppy contract too. I do that is for sure. I will even do a back ground check. And I will check in on the pup as it grows. And Lord help the person who violates my contracts. So you will have to learn and bare with us when we ask of you things. It isn't to drive you nuts or steer you down some predetermined path that we generate for you. So far your doing good. I commend you for doing the research. Be thorough with it. That is what i ask of you. And you will be justly rewarded for it.

Wilhiem

[semo]

lol. Ok Semo. I don't live far from you and I know several folks around your state that are reputable. However I would like to know what you intend to do with this dog? What sort of training? Conformation? etc. People suggest adoption because there are so many out there in shelters now. Not to annoy you to no end. your relatively new to this so lets start out on a good foot. We talked about dog houses and that the dog would be in the yard when you were not with it. You'll need to know how to place that doghouse, how to contain the dog in the yard and how to train this dog. We place concern because we have many up hill battles to fight for our breed. It by no means is to be offensive for you. Although it may seem people are mother hen pecking you. You would have to check out the Bad Pet Bull thread to understand just one inccedent of why. There are thousands of examples like that one. And know this a reputable and responsible breeder is going to drill you and check you out. Call your vet and references. Probably have a puppy contract too. I do that is for sure. I will even do a back ground check. And I will check in on the pup as it grows. And Lord help the person who violates my contracts. So you will have to learn and bare with us when we ask of you things. It isn't to drive you nuts or steer you down some predetermined path that we generate for you. So far your doing good. I commend you for doing the research. Be thorough with it. That is what i ask of you. And you will be justly rewarded for it.

Wilhiemyes, i will send you a PM I would like to talk and can answer whatever questions, dont worry about that. I personally think I can offer all POSITIVES to a dog MINUS THE FACT THAT HE WONT BE A HOUSE DOG. We can go into details, on MSN or TEAMSPEAK OR SOMETHING MORE REALTIME AS I WANT TO AVOID POSTING RL DETAILS HERE.

PM coming

[Attila]

Ok But I have no idea what msn or teamspeak is. I am afraid I didn't get trained on that in the Army. lol

[semo]

msn = msn messenger text chat program
teamspeak is a program to talk on the internet with microphones
or i could download yahoo messenger


basically how do u chat with friends ont he internet besides PMs and forums ?

[Attila]

I don't I use a cell phone. or meet them for coffee some place. I don't chat very much. I usually just email.

[semo]

I have an idea, try to get the Chatroom working on the main page of the forums and we can chat there. I am tryign to get it working there and will try to idle there waiting for u . let me know if you need help or anything


If that doesnt work i guess we could talk on phone sometime if u like to start out unless u want to just send a ton of PMs back and forth , PM me and let me know what u want to do . Unless u want

[semo]

http://www.game-dog.com/forums/chat.php

[semo]

attila ???

[semo]

didnt realize u emailed me till just now i sent a reply

[Suki]

I have this saved. It always seems to come in handy:

<TABLE class=MsoNormalTable style="WIDTH: 412.5pt; mso-cellspacing: 2.2pt; mso-padding-alt: 2.25pt 2.25pt 2.25pt 2.25pt" cellSpacing=3 cellPadding=0 width=550 border=1><TBODY><TR style="HEIGHT: 0.25in"><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt; HEIGHT: 0.25in" colSpan=2>A COMPARISON OF:






</TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 21pt"><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt; HEIGHT: 21pt">Traits of Responsible Breeders






</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt; HEIGHT: 21pt">Traits of Backyard Breeders






</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">"Into" Dogs (shows, training, clubs, etc.)



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Not "into" dogs (has "pets" around the house)



</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Belongs to dog clubs and organizations



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Is not involved in the "dog world"



</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Proves quality of dogs and suitability for breeding by competing for titles and certificates in conformation, obedience, agility, field trialing, Schutzhund, herding, tracking, earthdog trials, etc.



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Quality of dogs is almost always substandard, however, he does not test his dogs in shows or trials (Dogs are just pets or "breeding machines")



</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Pups' pedigrees are filled with dogs who have obtained show titles/working certificates; never breeds dogs without "papers"



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Pedigrees mostly a list of pets bred by backyard breeders; pups may not even have "papers"; may be mongrels (Cockapoos, etc.)



</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Supports rescue groups; knows his actions inevitably play some part in pet overpopulation and euthanasia (one of every four dogs in shelters is purebred). Even with all his efforts to stem over- population, he knows "cracks" will lead to canine deaths



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Honestly believes that because he places/sells all his pups, he does not contribute in any way to the needless slaughter of millions of dogs per year in shelters (Does not see his role in his pups making pups and them making more pups and so on)



</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Knowledgeable in every facet of breed, including that of health issues/defects; researches genetics when choosing mates



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Not particularly educated about breed, often not aware of his own breed's genetic defects; does not consider mate's genetics



</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Knowledgeable about house breaking, training, socializing, breeding, health; constantly reads dog-related materials



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Has own ideas which may not coincide with professionals' opinions; won't bother to read any of the hundreds of dog books available



</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Can and will help and educate puppy buyers re these issues



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Says "Goodbye" and "Good luck"



</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Willing to give you his references



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Has no references



</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Knows his puppies' ancestry



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Knows nothing about the other dogs on puppies' pedigrees



</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Follows up on puppies' well-being; collects health information affecting his dogs



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Does not concern himself with the puppies' well-being or how puppies' health affects his breeding "plan"



</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Breeds to improve his own dogs, his bloodlines and the breed



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Breeds just to breed or make money or see his "great dog" procreate



</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Rarely breeds as he does not use dog breeding as a business and strives for quality, not quantity



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Breeds regularly if for money or if puppy mill; if for ego, breeds once in awhile, or "just once" before neutering or spaying



</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Rarely repeats a breeding



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Often repeats breedings, mainly those that are cheap and convenient.



</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Breeds only dogs which meet breed standard



</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Dogs used for breeding rarely meet breed standard



</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

[Suki]

<TABLE class=MsoNormalTable style="WIDTH: 412.5pt; mso-cellspacing: 2.2pt; mso-padding-alt: 2.25pt 2.25pt 2.25pt 2.25pt" cellSpacing=3 cellPadding=0 width=550 border=1><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt"></TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Breeds only dogs with stable temperaments

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Breeds shy/aggressive dogs with poor temperaments

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Breeds only dogs over 2 years old, and a limited number of times

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Breeds dogs at almost any age, and any number of times

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Mate choice could be anywhere in the country (almost never breeds his own males to his own females)

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Mate choice is that which is convenient, cheap, local (very often owns both sire and dam)

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Does all genetic testing and will provide proof; does not breed animals with genetic defects or which are carriers of defects

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Does no genetic testing; ignorantly breeds defective animals or those which are carriers, thus, perpetuating disease in breed

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Puppies are sold from waiting list created before breeding even takes place

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Puppies are sold after birth in the local newspaper, first-come, first-served

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Pet-quality pups generally cost $500-600+ (show-quality costs more)

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">All pups are pet-quality and are relatively cheap, usually $200-$400

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Puppies are sold with health guarantees

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Puppies are sold with no guarantee

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Puppies are sold with contracts

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">No contracts; does not care what you do with puppies

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Requires pups back if new homes don't work out

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Says "Find them good homes"

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Dogs on property are friendly, socialized, trained

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Dogs on property may be aggressive or shy, and untrained

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Does not own more dogs than he has room, time or money for; Dogs are groomed, exercised, healthy, happy

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Puppy mills are overloaded, "warehoused" dogs are not groomed or exercised, don't look healthy or happy

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

[Suki]

<TABLE class=MsoNormalTable style="WIDTH: 412.5pt; mso-cellspacing: 2.2pt; mso-padding-alt: 2.25pt 2.25pt 2.25pt 2.25pt" cellSpacing=3 cellPadding=0 width=550 border=1><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Will show you pups' parents if available, or if not, will have pictures

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Might have to "lock up" pups' aggressive or shy parents (dogs that should never have been bred)

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Raises puppies indoors

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Raises puppies outdoors

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Stays home to care for puppies

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Dam and pups are alone for long hours

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Feeds only premium dog food

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Feeds cheap, grocery store dog food (containing 4D meat/chemicals)

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Visitors remove shoes and wash hands to prevent spread of parvovirus

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Has no understanding and takes no precautions to prevent puppy-killer disease

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Keeps pups with mom and litter a minimum of 49 days to ensure sibling socialization and important lessons from pups' mother

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Doesn't know leaving litter earlier can cause lifelong temperament problems or staying too long can hurt bonding with humans

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Socializes pups by systematically handling them and exposing them to various noises, children and other animals before sending them to new homes

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Does not understand or want to be troubled with any kind of training; just tries to keep puppies quiet and contained until sold

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Tests pups to match their temperaments and drives with buyers' personalities and lifestyles

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Knows nothing about puppy-testing or matching puppies with buyers; allows buyers to pick the "cutest" one

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Can honestly evaluate pups' quality

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Says all pups are high quality

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Never sells to "impulse" buyers

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Is not concerned about buyers being prepared for pups

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Never sells two pups at the same time to a novice

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Would consider this killing two birds with one sale

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Interviews prospective buyers, checks home and references, refuses to sell to substandard homes

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Sells first-come, first-served to whomever has the cash; does not find out which homes are substandard

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Wants to meet whole family; won't sell if children are abusive

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Does not consider anything past obtaining the funds

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Sells only to buyers with disposable income (AKC reports it costs $1327 per year to properly care for a dog)

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Is not concerned whether or not buyers can afford to properly care for pups

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Waits for buyers who offer lifelong homes (Knows that only 30 percent of all dogs stay in one home throughout their lives)

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Does not reject high-risk buyers: (renters, young people, those with poor track records, low income, other pets, dogs kept outdoors)

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Understands dogs are "pack" animals; sells pets only to buyers wanting to make pup an indoor dog and part of the family

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Doesn't care if pups live as outdoor dogs or chained dogs, being unhappy or anxious being isolated and separated from "packs"

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Sells only to buyers who make pup's safety a priority

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Does not consider pups' best interests

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Encourages or requires buyers to spay/neuter pet-quality pups

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Encourages buyers to breed, regardless of quality

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Encourages buyers to train pups; refers to good trainer

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Shows no concern for pups after sale; knows no trainers

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Makes sure buyers understand pup's considerable need for time, attention, exercise and training

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Does not provide even his own dogs with enough time, attention, exercise or training

</TD></TR><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">

</TD></TR><TR style="mso-yfti-lastrow: yes"><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Responsible Breeders
Improve the Breed<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>

</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 2.25pt; PADDING-LEFT: 2.25pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2.25pt; PADDING-TOP: 2.25pt">Backyard Breeders
Damage the Breed<o:p></o:p>

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

[Suki]

USE THIS GUIDE TO OBTAIN A QUALITY PUPPY
FROM A RESPONSIBLE BREEDER

And be aware that dogs are not "things." They are living creatures who, by no choice of their own, are totally dependent upon us - and are at our mercy - for their very survival, not to mention quality of life. As pack animals, their mental health is dependent upon being with their pack. That may be other animals, or it may be us. It is very cruel to leave a dog alone all day. Dogs need a lot of attention. They need regular, systematic aerobic exercise for at least 20-30 minutes, at least 3-4 times a week, just to be healthy. Few dogs get the exercise they need for good physical and mental health. Lack of exercise is the number one reason, (then lack of training), that dogs become mischievous and burdensome, and are then blamed, then dumped, and too often, killed. ("A tired dog is a good dog.") Having a yard is not sufficient. Dogs do not exercise themselves unless chasing something along the fence line, and that, in and of itself, is a problem. To make good pets, they need training. And most importantly, to be safe pets, they need early socialization. Lack of socialization the first 4-6 months of a dog's life creates shy dogs, which too-often become fear-biters, which, along with those who were simply born with poor temperaments, are responsible for the majority of the 4.7 million dog bites annually. (Sixty percent of victims are children; Half of all kids 12 and under have been bitten by a dog; Every day more than 900 people are hospitalized with dog bites; Every year 25 people are killed by dogs.)

If you can not be a responsible dog owner, please wait until you can be.

And please don't breed out of greed or ego or for any reason other than to improve the breed (i.e., to make the puppies better than their parents). Most purebred dogs, and of course, all mixed-breed dogs, should not be bred. The majority of dogs have some defect (in structure, temperament, health) that should not be perpetuated. Dogs used for breeding should be free of all defects - that's the definition of quality. ("Papers" mean nothing; They are simply, and nothing more than, birth certificates. Plenty of dogs have "papers," but are so poorly bred they actually look like mutts.) And no human should ever breed any dog without veterinary/laboratory testing and pedigree research to be sure that dog is free of (and not a carrier of) genetic defects. FAILURE TO TEST/SEARCH FOR INHERITABLE HEALTH PROBLEMS IS THE NUMBER ONE MARK OF A BACKYARD BREEDER. IT IS ALSO THE MOST DAMAGING TO CANINES, AND THE MOST HEARTBREAKING TO PUPPY-BUYERS, WHO END UP WITH YET ANOTHER GENERATION OF POOR-QUALITY DOGS WHO TOO OFTEN DEVELOP EXPENSIVE, EARLY HEALTH PROBLEMS AND OFTEN DIE PREMATURELY.

We have a severe pet-overpopulation crisis in the <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" /><st1:country-region><st1:place>US</st1:place></st1:country-region>; We slaughter thousands of beautiful, vital, healthy dogs every single day. (Twenty-five percent of shelter dogs are purebred.) Every puppy produced by a backyard breeder and placed in a home takes the place of one killed in a shelter because no one adopted it. And every puppy produced by a backyard breeder can make more puppies, and those puppies can make more puppies and so on. (And of course, backyard breeders, through their encouragement and the dispersal of misinformation, have a knack for turning uneducated buyers into yet more backyard breeders.) There just are not enough homes (not to mention "good" homes) available for all these puppies. No matter how hard one tries, only 30 percent of all dogs (and their pups and their pups and so on) live their entire lives in the home to which they went after weaning. Seventy percent will be given away or abandoned or dumped along the way for one reason or another. (Common excuses are, "We didn't have time for him," "He was too much trouble," "He kept jumping on us," "He bit my child," "We couldn't afford him," "We had to move." None of these were good homes to begin with. The buyers failed to socialize or train, or they lacked time, money or commitment. Again, there just are not enough "good" homes for all the puppies born.) Why not leave breeding dogs to those with the ability and desire and quality animals to do so at a "professional" level?

If everyone bred only dogs with excellent conformation, and stable, correct temperaments, working titles and clean health, we would have top-quality dogs in this country. Get your dog evaluated by judges and trainers. If he meets breed standard, and is healthy, and has the correct temperament and drives, show him, work him, and get him titled. If you feel you have what it takes to be a "professional" breeder, educate yourself, and with enough experience in dogs, maybe you, too, could make a positive contribution to your breed. But if your dog's only credentials are that it is a great pet, then love it, socialize it, train it, exercise it, give it the best in feed, comfort and veterinary care, but for it's own good (including better health - ask your vet!), and for the sake of puppy-buyers, society, and all canines, get it spayed or neutered.

Resist the Greed; Don't Support Backyard Breeders,
and Certainly Don't Become One.

[Red_Chrome]

And start LOOKING now. I am getting a new working dog this time next year and have started looking for breeders. I believe I have found one IF she approves my puppy app. I am a full-time college student so that puts a lot of people off. I am getting a Belgian Malinois puppy and I have a list of questions I ask them before they can even get their questions out , then if I'm satisfied with their responses I answer them IF not then I tell them I don't think they have what I'm looking for and sorry for taking their time.

[miakoda]

My advice is to start going to some ADBA & AADR shows & meeting people there.....even if you have to drive 4 hours or so away (I've driven much farther!).

Just a piece of advice: all this internet research for breeders isn't going to land you anywhere except some byb's or peddler's backyard. Very, very, very, very, very, very few responsible, respectible & honest owner/breeders sell dogs over the internet (& the 3 that I know of require that you DRIVE to them & meet with them beforehand along with proving your are responsible & knowledgable enough yourself)

[semo]

i dont ming going to shows and i dont mind driving to meet a responsible breeder.

This is all helpful, the only thing that BOTHERS me about all of that is the comment about dogs being pack dogs and they should be kept in the house.

The way I would have to do things is make a nice sized kennel and the dog wouldnt be able to stay in our house unless it is absolutely freezing then maybe the basement a little bit . Anyway I am worried and dont want my dog to be neglected . Will I be a bad owner if it doesnt live in the house , but the kennel and I take it out at least a couple / few hours a day during the week and then a whole lot more on the weekends ? I live on a non working farm and have lots of land and a 7 acre lake out in the middle of the country for the most part, so when the dog is out of his pen there is a lot of ground we can cover. I intend on working with my dog regularly every evening after work and am almost certain that I can keep the dog excercised very well.

A quick outline of my plan is M-F wake up before work and check water and make sure it has a little bit of food, spend a little bit of time with the dog in the morning, perhaps start getting up much earlier to work it for an hour or so . GO TO WORK, then come home from work and spend at least a couple of hours with it and stuff. Then on the weekends the dog would be out a bunch more throughout the day .

I can see how leaving a dog in a kennel and neglecting it could cause problems, but if i make an honest effort to spend time working with this dog is he gonna turn out a lot worse than a dog that lives in the house ?

Thanks I am concerned.

[BamaBoy]

I don't know many folks who have more than 1 or 2 dogs that keep them in the house. It doesn't make you a bad owner to keep the dog outside!

[ChAnimal]

"Rarely repeats a breeding"?? Im not sure why that is there. If you do a breeding that works, why not repeat the breeding?

[underdogg55]

it in no way makes you a bad owner if you leave your dog outside as long as it has adeqaute shelter form weather, too hot provide some shade, too cold provide a well insulated dog house,your schedule sounds pretty similar to mine i wrk all day. i go out and mess with the dogs in the morning before wrk and when i get off i do the same, the kids got out there too they love the dogs. sounds like you got a good plan and shit 7 acres thats a lot of land just be sure you're ready for our breed and ready to be a responsible owner.

[PIt4life]

wow....well i will, as a always do, recomend rescue first. Because i get to see first hand the pits that die there, sad. But anyways hope u find teh right puppy....

[GSDbulldog]

Start hitting up ADBA shows. Internet searches get you little. What are you looking for in this dog? Are you interested in a gamebred dog, or a staff? Do you have prior APBT ownership-knowledge? What bloodlines are you interested in at this point? Feel free to drop me a PM/E-mail for more discussion.

Keeping a dog outdoors is probably the best, IMO- and far from cruel. A proper, well-maintained chain set-up is the safest, most effective way to contain a pit bull-type dog. Ignore the humaniacs who claim that dogs must be part of a "pack" to feel secure. APBTs are certainly not "pack" animals. They are people dogs. As long as they know you are the owner & you treat them like a dog, you will be fine.

[14rock]

APBT's are not "pack animals", they have been bred for canine combat, it would make no sense to put two of them in a room together and not expect a fight. With some of these so-called "pitbulls" that are obviously mixed mutts, its possible you might get lucky. Bulldogs have been kept tethered for hundreds of years, it is probably more natural for them to be on a chain than in a 1 foot by 1 foot crate in the house!

[Evil_Elvis]

so if i have as you call a suitable male and female on my yard i wont breed them if im reponsible and if i do breed i shouldnt wean the pups till their 7 weeks old and if i did breed and had a good litter i wouldnt repeat it lol i have bred one litter but am keeping them but in my opinon those are bs things to look for

[semo]

i intend on going for the apbt, not the staffordshire type body style. I want a game type dog that is athletic. I intend on keeping this dog very active and think the apbt is a better looking dog than the staff... dont get me wrong though , staff's can be nice "looking" in their own right.

AGAIN I WANT TO REITERATE I have a 7 ACRE LAKE, and over 100 acres of land, I dont know why people keep thinking that I have 7 acres total lol.


thanks for the responses thus far, it has helped as i was worried

[semo]

Ok, I found a few images of pit bull styles i like ignoring the colors. This is mostly for body styles, although I will not cut the ears or tail.

I have borrowed these images from members of the forum and other areas, if I offend anyone or am using their dogs image and they do not like it please tell me and I will remove it from this thread.

http://files.photojerk.com/blood/A.jpghttp://files.photojerk.com/blood/B.jpghttp://files.photojerk.com/blood/C.jpghttp://files.photojerk.com/blood/d.jpghttp://files.photojerk.com/blood/e.JPGhttp://files.photojerk.com/blood/f.JPGall of the above dogs I think look great and are the style that I want

[Attila]

Those are some fine exampls to look for. I don't know but to avoid conflict you may want to ask these folks before you use their photo's. One can't get upset with you ask and they give permission.

Wilhiem

[semo]

these are random pix i threw in a folder and didnt store the owners name , but have it on seperate hosting. If somoene truelly gets upset about me using their dog as an example of what I think is a REALLY NICE DOG then i will remove it ;)

most should be flattered ;)