Old Dogs VS Modern Dogs

[slinky]

were the old dogs from Early Days.... Better than Modern day dogs..
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Slinky

[lockjaw]

i think so ...everything..they dont makim like they used to..back then champs where champs...and today we have to many mixed breedings going on..150 lb.blue pits and all..

[TEXAS PIT DOGS]

I Would Say Dogs Of The Past Compared With Game Dogs Of Today And I Compare Them Only With Game Dogs Are Pretty Much On Par The Only Real Diffrence From Today And Yesteryear Was You Could Know If Your Dogs Were Game Or Not,by Using Them For What They Was Bred For.but Really Thats The Only Diffrence That I Find Today Between Well Bred Game Dogs.but Like I Said Earlier I Never Compare The Big Blue Dogs To Real Pitbulls.

[realonebulldog]

I Would Say Dogs Of The Past Compared With Game Dogs Of Today And I Compare Them Only With Game Dogs Are Pretty Much On Par The Only Real Diffrence From Today And Yesteryear Was You Could Know If Your Dogs Were Game Or Not,by Using Them For What They Was Bred For.but Really Thats The Only Diffrence That I Find Today Between Well Bred Game Dogs.but Like I Said Earlier I Never Compare The Big Blue Dogs To Real Pitbulls. There was a time wen only red, buckskin,yellow and brindle were the dominating colors.....all others were rare colors.

[TEXAS PIT DOGS]

thats news to me dogmen really never did put stock on color all we wanted was a good dog for the pit back in the old days before it was banned.

[Mercepitdog]

As generations pasts, the ones who are aimming to keep the breed true to its self, is better than the past.

[Rocky H. Balboa]

Well, years ago, dogmen fed so-call crappy food such as supermarket brands, the "juice" was weaker, etc.

[ShelterDog]

Why are the dogs not all scarred up in the pictures of old fighting dogs, but when we see pictures or tv shows (Animal Cops) with modern day fighting dogs, the dogs look like the've been through hell. Is it the photo quality or were the old fighting dogs better cared for?

[Rocky H. Balboa]

Get real. I know many here want to say that but the fact is that most yards of yesteryear and today were either Black, Red, Buckskin, and some brindle. If the little whelped other colors, they were said to be abnormal (not true to its strain and were the first to be sold/culled unless it was a "throw back"). This is not to say that they were breeding for color but color was in fact an element in the equation.

thats news to me dogmen really never did put stock on color all we wanted was a good dog for the pit back in the old days before it was banned.

[Rocky H. Balboa]

Those picture you see on tv are of dogs used by novices or street fighters that did not care for their athletes after they performed for them. These "novices" either never cared to learn or never new the proper sequence of events.

Why are the dogs not all scarred up in the pictures of old fighting dogs, but when we see pictures or tv shows (Animal Cops) with modern day fighting dogs, the dogs look like the've been through hell. Is it the photo quality or were the old fighting dogs better cared for?

[pennsooner]

were the old dogs from Early Days.... Better than Modern day dogs..
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Slinky




I'm sort of new to the board so I wanted to think awhile before I answered this question. My answer is yes they were as a whole. The main reasons? Fewer dogs being bred so poorly. And dogs (particuarly working dogs) being culled much harder. Also from old people I've talked to and from my memory of being a kid, less people were willing in the old days to make excuses for crappy temperment.


This might be out of bounds and if it is, please delete it and my apologies but. in the pitdog "game" from what I've read its even gotten worse. It seems like a lot more $$$$$ is involved now so that people are less willing to cull a manbiter that might also be a winner. I've read a fair amount of breed history and I really never have read of a man-biter being mentioned until suddenly Bullyson, Zebo, Honeybunch and others start being mentioned as manbiters. I recall even reading that Chinaman bit his owner once. Maybe this went on in the past but I can't find mention of it.
Heard about an Amstaff that was best in class in a recent big show and the dog was so people shy the judge could barely handle the dog. But it wasn't disqualifyed.


So, in short, more bad breeding (and therefore more iffy dogs in the hands of iffy owners) Less hard culling, more excuses made for crappy temperment. AND, more working dogs winding up living in situations they were never bred for, IE apartments in large citys.

[SFK]

I believe this is a rather subjective question. In the old days (early 1900's-1960's) Almost all APBT's where in the hands of Fanciers who used them for their intended purpose. So I believe the overall quality of the dogs was higher. But to compare a top-notch Gamedog from the past to a tried & true Gamedog of modern times, evolution, supplementation, diet, & modern conditioning techniques come into play. I believe that very few of the "Pitbulls" that are part of the scenery in this country today would be fed by any dogman of the past.

[bahamutt99]

A question on the torn-up dogs comment. Did the oldtime dogmen get vet care for their dogs after a match? (Before laws were passed requiring the vets to turn them in.) Or maybe care for them themselves? I'm just wondering. I wasn't around during that era, and most of the info I have on the sport is biased.

[Saiyagin]

If you talking about gameness I would say its about even unless your talking about percentages then the dogs of old would be higher. If you talking about performance modern day wins hands down. The reason yes evolution,science and technology do play a part but the main reason is there where only a limited amount of pits back then but now in modern times we have sooo many pits maybe too many lol.

[Saiyagin]

A question on the torn-up dogs comment. Did the oldtime dogmen get vet care for their dogs after a match? (Before laws were passed requiring the vets to turn them in.) Or maybe care for them themselves? I'm just wondering. I wasn't around during that era, and most of the info I have on the sport is biased.
Let me put it this way even way back then Veterinarians,Doctors,lawyers,law enforcers and yes even Judges of the court where somehow involved. Almost same like it is today.

[El Mexicano]

I believe this is a rather subjective question. In the old days (early 1900's-1960's) Almost all APBT's where in the hands of Fanciers who used them for their intended purpose. So I believe the overall quality of the dogs was higher. But to compare a top-notch Gamedog from the past to a tried & true Gamedog of modern times, evolution, supplementation, diet, & modern conditioning techniques come into play. I believe that very few of the "Pitbulls" that are part of the scenery in this country today would be fed by any dogman of the past.

thats what i was thinking

[SFK]

A question on the torn-up dogs comment. Did the oldtime dogmen get vet care for their dogs after a match? (Before laws were passed requiring the vets to turn them in.) Or maybe care for them themselves? I'm just wondering. I wasn't around during that era, and most of the info I have on the sport is biased.
This is from a historical perspective only. Dogmen LOVE their Dogs! They feed them better, exercise them better, & generally care for them better than most pet owners you will ever know! And Damn sure a lot better then some Shelter or puppy peddler! They took excellent care of their dogs. They still do take excellent care of their dogs. It's the Thugs & the Punks who think they look cool walking a beat up dog around. Most Dogmen are as knowledgable if not more knowledgable than many Vet Techs when it comes to caring for an injured animal.

[LONGHORNS]

Old School Dogs Will Always Bite Hard While Modern Dogs Screams Loud

[underdogg55]

I agree with u SFK supplements,better quality of food, and better conditioning play a big part in in this. I say if you put a Dead Game dog of today and one from early 1900's,I say the one of today walks out the pit a winner if it were still legal, but then again it is the pit so you never know what could happen, thats my opinion. that was a damn good question slinky.

[Riptora]

I could very well be wrong, but from what I gather game dogs of the present seem more fast and efficient than the dogs of the past.

In the past people didn't have the money to feed dogs for the hell of it either, so people didn't buy, breed and own dogs for the sake of a fad.

Unless it was a lady's poodle!

[Mouser]

When it was legal, more folks did it, but that doesn't necessarily mean they all knew what they were doing. I'd venture to guess it'd be about even. I want to put up a quote just for fun, because I see this term used alot. "I say if you put a Dead Game dog of today and one from early 1900's" well I'd say if you put two Dead Game dogs together, you wouldn't see much action, LOL! Folks telling you that they have dead game dogs, must have a defibulator machine to restart their hearts after death, cause dead dogs, don't walk. Mouser P.S. that was just in jest!

[underdogg55]

Dead-game,Deep-game,No Quit in Em', hell even game lol, but not a dog without a pulse, thats not what i meant by DeadGame.

[mntman2003]

most didnt feed store bought dog food in the old days....purina started sellin it in 1926 not in the grocery stores till 57.

[underdogg55]

I didnt know that mntman so they probably werent as well conditioned or healthy as modern dogs

[Rockstar]

A question on the torn-up dogs comment. Did the oldtime dogmen get vet care for their dogs after a match? (Before laws were passed requiring the vets to turn them in.) Or maybe care for them themselves? I'm just wondering. I wasn't around during that era, and most of the info I have on the sport is biased.
Any respectable dogman knows how to provide quality aftercare for a dog before they ever set one down. A scarred up dog serves as an example of its owner's lack of veterinary knowledge and skill. Some scars just won't go away, no matter what methods you may use to try to heal them, but to see a dog covered in scars from head to toe makes me shake my head. I've seen dogs "go through hell" and you'd never know it 5 or 6 months later because they were given proper medical care afterward; care that was followed up for months to minimize scarring and assure the dog makes a full recovery. I've known people to roll dogs on the microbe-infested dirty ground, without a carpet or tarp, provide some brief aftercare (or none at all), and put them right back out on the chain. Often it's simply because they don't know any better, but other times it's because they just don't care. It's probably the biggest mistake I see doggers make these days, rolling dogs in the dirt instead of on a clean carpet or such. The cleaner a wound is, the better it will heal.

...less people were willing in the old days to make excuses for crappy temperment.

This might be out of bounds and if it is, please delete it and my apologies but. in the pitdog "game" from what I've read its even gotten worse. It seems like a lot more $$$$$ is involved now so that people are less willing to cull a manbiter that might also be a winner. I've read a fair amount of breed history and I really never have read of a man-biter being mentioned until suddenly Bullyson, Zebo, Honeybunch and others start being mentioned as manbiters. I recall even reading that Chinaman bit his owner once. Maybe this went on in the past but I can't find mention of it.
The misconception of the century -"Less people were willing in the old days to make excuses for crappy temperment."
There has always been plenty of money involved in the investment of a dog, including sport wagers. Historically, temperament almost always took a back seat to gameness and ability. Tant fed some mean dogs, as did Tudor, Carver, and several other well-known dogmen/women. Probably anyone you can think of kept a manbiter or two (or more than a few.) It didn't make economical sense to cull a good pitdog just because it wasn't friendly with everyone. The idea that dogs were disqualified if they bit someone in a match is bogus. Most usually the show went on. People weren't real open about it if they happened to have a manbiter because nobody wanted to step into the box with one. Generally speaking though, manbiters weren't that big of a deal. I guarantee that far more dogs are culled for "crappy temperament" today than they were 30 years ago.

[mntman2003]

they fed scraps so in my opinion they were healthier then.Dog allergies and diabetes etc didnt start till commercial dog food but thats another story..sorry!

[realonebulldog]

were the old dogs from Early Days.... Better than Modern day dogs..
?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ????????????????????
Slinky I think the true question should be: Is the blood as clean as in the old days? And we have to notice that many matches in old times went over 2 hours...or 3hours or over 3 houers...near 5 houers..and today? I heard an oldtimer say that the rolls in old times were harder then matches today....maybe there is some trues in it.

[realonebulldog]

Dead-game,Deep-game,No Quit in Em', hell even game lol, but not a dog without a pulse, thats not what i meant by DeadGame. How dead game was he? OH very dead...very very dead!UH great....! :)

[Rockstar]

I think the true question should be: Is the blood as clean as in the old days? And we have to notice that many matches in old times went over 2 hours...or 3hours or over 3 houers...near 5 houers..and today? I heard an oldtimer say that the rolls in old times were harder then matches today....maybe there is some trues in it.
Most matches are over in less than an hour. The same was true 20, 30, 60 years ago.

[realonebulldog]

Most matches are over in less than an hour. The same was true 20, 30, 60 years ago. Thats it...but I think that back in the old days were more real marathon matches than today.....and I know that some were lie -around affairs but ... however I think it shows that the old stuff is worthy to talk about.....and you see that the dogmen who believed in the old blood are the most sucesful from today(like norrod,sorrels or boudreux....and their dogs are in most cases red, brindle,buckskin or yellow ones...and they dont bred for color..:) ) I believe in the oldtime dogs....and in all dogmen who try to keep it pure,game and the old way...and to the colors....I think that red,brindle,yellow and buckskin are the oldest colors ...they are the rootcolors.

[pennsooner]

Any respectable dogman knows how to provide quality aftercare for a dog before they ever set one down. A scarred up dog serves as an example of its owner's lack of veterinary knowledge and skill. Some scars just won't go away, no matter what methods you may use to try to heal them, but to see a dog covered in scars from head to toe makes me shake my head. I've seen dogs "go through hell" and you'd never know it 5 or 6 months later because they were given proper medical care afterward; care that was followed up for months to minimize scarring and assure the dog makes a full recovery. I've known people to roll dogs on the microbe-infested dirty ground, without a carpet or tarp, provide some brief aftercare (or none at all), and put them right back out on the chain. Often it's simply because they don't know any better, but other times it's because they just don't care. It's probably the biggest mistake I see doggers make these days, rolling dogs in the dirt instead of on a clean carpet or such. The cleaner a wound is, the better it will heal.


The misconception of the century -"Less people were willing in the old days to make excuses for crappy temperment."
There has always been plenty of money involved in the investment of a dog, including sport wagers. Historically, temperament almost always took a back seat to gameness and ability. Tant fed some mean dogs, as did Tudor, Carver, and several other well-known dogmen/women. Probably anyone you can think of kept a manbiter or two (or more than a few.) It didn't make economical sense to cull a good pitdog just because it wasn't friendly with everyone. The idea that dogs were disqualified if they bit someone in a match is bogus. Most usually the show went on. People weren't real open about it if they happened to have a manbiter because nobody wanted to step into the box with one. Generally speaking though, manbiters weren't that big of a deal. I guarantee that far more dogs are culled for "crappy temperament" today than they were 30 years ago.










Thanks for the clarification.

[JCleve86]

they fed scraps so in my opinion they were healthier then.Dog allergies and diabetes etc didnt start till commercial dog food but thats another story..sorry!
The modern day health problems so many dogs face DOES have a lot to do with diet, but SO MUCH MORE to do with puppy peddling. WAY more homes own dogs than in the past, and there are WAY more folks out there breeding dogs to make a buck, with NO other purpose in mind. This is by nature going to create dogs with poor health. As we work farther and farther from breeding dogs for purpose (hell, even getting from breeding dogs for show to just breeding dogs because they have reproductive organs) our dogs will become less and less healthy.

That being said, yes...most readily available (grocery store) foods are CRAP...but there are plenty of GOOD quality kibbles out there. You just have to know where to look and what to look for, and if you ask me, any "dogman" who gives half a shit about his dogs would know this, so food doesn't play as much into the equation.

[mntman2003]

you know what they say about opinions and what they are like.And i was just commenting on ones statement about feed.

[JCleve86]

As was I...isn't that the whole point of a discussion? Hmmmmmm...

Well now I'm going to eat my microwaved spring rolls. My dogs eat better than I do. lol

[Saiyagin]

Boys Boys settle down now lol we cant change the past we can only change the future lol.

[JCleve86]

Hey I wasn't upset? I don't think our friend mntman was either? I'm quite capable of exchanging smart assed remarks without getting upset, thank you very much.

Oh, and who you calling boy? Huh? Huh? I was lucky enough to be born of the SUPERIOR sex.

Juuuuuust kidding.

Holy derailed thread batman...someone fix it quick!

[mntman2003]

shit i wasnt upset either we are entitled to our opinions i hate people that agree all the time.