Impressive Obedience Vid

[tomoe]

http://www.k9sts.com/bronxmovie/

[SouthernDixie]

That's a neat video. The dog has some impressive titles.

[catcher T]

this type of training creates a very level headed dog,,he can fire em up and call him back,,I loved when he was running across the car,,LOL

[mikelia]

Thats was a beautiful representation of a well trained dog. The dog loved working with his handler. I loved when he was going over the car too :)

[miakoda]

Funny,
1. I still don't think "pit bulls" need to be doing Schutzhund training or the like
2. It seems b/c his dog is well trained, he is above the law concerning leashes. The part in the parking lot was not a designated demonstration, but rather one in which he was showing off. But what I saw was a guy parading his dog around off leash in front of people who had absolutely no clue as to what he was doing.

I may not be liked for this, but regardless of titles, the video leaves a lot to be desired.

[420puffer]

i can get my pit to follow me around, but if something else is more interesting to him like another dog, i know he would leave to meet the other dog if he wasnt on a lead. Would obedience school at Petco/Petsmart resolve that?

[14rock]

LOL no puffer, those obedience classes are *mostly* a joke, especially for the breed we choose to own. I recommend that no body be walking their dog off leash no matter how well trained it is. What most people fail to recognize is correctly trained dog-trainers are not actually training the dog (the approach petsmart takes) they are training the handler to be able to train his dog correctly. This is why good trainers leave their premises to train dogs, and generally go to either a neutral area for training,or the owners home. A good trainer *generally* is not one who trains the dog at their place of business.

[Riptora]

He is very handsome, that wasn't Schutzhund, that was strictly protection work, I wonder why he taught the dog to go for the legs like that? A 198 out of 200 is fabulous, but that is in obedience which is simple routine. I would be concerned with the protection work, it's such a dangerous thing to be messing with and I'm really curious as to why he is training this dog to seize legs, that would cause some serious damage, hope he has some good insurance.

[El Mexicano]

im not even gona watch the video.....ppl shouldnt be using dogs for this stuff......carry a dam gun or somethin...too much stuff like that are givin every dog a bad name.

[Hillbilly Pit]

This type of video was basicaly talked about the other day. the dog looks good, but i to still think like others that a dog with this typ of skill and breed can be dangerous in the wrong hands. yes i know what some would say, that the dog want get in to the wrong hands. but there are people stelling thim every day.

[rocksteady]

Wait a minute.. If the same dog was off leash being used as a guide dog, no one would say anything. Whats the difference??? This dog IMO is far better trained than most guide dogs.. This dog was extremely obedient and well trained.. and this dog also demonstrated extreme self control. He stopped when told to stop (in chase mode) which is something most dogs cannot do as no one hardly teaches an emergency down stay...(used say if a dog bolts out a door to chase a cat, the dog regardless will drop and stay on command) regardless if one thinks he was showing off or not I say hats off and If a person has control of their dog and the dog has self control, then by all means let them be. I will say that it would have been better to have a vest on the dog saying "working" or something, but based on the titles that dog has won (most involve other dogs present for distraction..even in schutzhund)
As for showing off, how do you know thats what he was doing? maybe he was in training.. You have to keep up the training even after titles are won, you cant just train a dog, win titles and think the dog will always be perfect. You still have to refresh the dogs memory every now and again.

[rpk]

Awesome video and dog!

[LONGHORNS]

Very good dog.

[14rock]

Yes, it was a good dog and the owner did well training it. Still shouldn't of been of leash and I dont think guide dogs should either. I will say this guy seemed to have his stuff down pat.....but also, what is this teaching others? Sure this is one good video, but how many people will see this video and try to do the same and wind up with an unstable headline maker!

[rocksteady]

If you look where this video is actually located,
http://www.k9sts.com
you will find that it isnt on a kennel website or some self proclaimed "street dog trainer" or just in videos somewhere, its actually a video to demonstrate the experience and quality of training for a dog trainer / obedience center. I certainly would take my dog there after seeing that video..

And there are lots of dogs that have to work off leash.. retrieivers, pointers, hounds, some tracking is done off leash, flushers, Herding dogs (whom often work in pairs) ect etc. Service dogs whom retrieve things for their owners who cannot bend or grasp or reach, and seeing eye dogs do work in a harness with a hadnle for the person they are leading.. but again, had to go through off lead work both in a controled enviroment and one filled with distractions..

[Dawnely]

I agree, don't make your dog fight your battles!!!!im not even gona watch the video.....ppl shouldnt be using dogs for this stuff......carry a dam gun or somethin...too much stuff like that are givin every dog a bad name.

[Suki]

I'm impressed, regardless.

To get your dog to that level takes time, patience and skill. My very close friend, (trainer)has 5 dogs, and ALL are at that level, and believe me, I'm ALWAYS impressed....

[catcher T]

why would you pick this dog and his trainer apart,,this is an excellent example of a well trained dog,,the dog is more safe then most,,he is not going to bite out of instinct,,he waits for each hand signal,,who would not want a dog tained like that?

[SEAL]

i wana train mine to do all the heal work and follow and all that good stuff, but im not all that concerned with the bite work ive got something else for would be assailants peppa spray hehehe.

[Riptora]

Still wondering why the dog is biting legs, does anyone know?

[catcher T]

the dog sometimes picks his spot..we train with the bite sleeve on the arm

[Rocky H. Balboa]

Well said!

Wait a minute.. If the same dog was off leash being used as a guide dog, no one would say anything. Whats the difference??? This dog IMO is far better trained than most guide dogs.. This dog was extremely obedient and well trained.. and this dog also demonstrated extreme self control. He stopped when told to stop (in chase mode) which is something most dogs cannot do as no one hardly teaches an emergency down stay...(used say if a dog bolts out a door to chase a cat, the dog regardless will drop and stay on command) regardless if one thinks he was showing off or not I say hats off and If a person has control of their dog and the dog has self control, then by all means let them be. I will say that it would have been better to have a vest on the dog saying "working" or something, but based on the titles that dog has won (most involve other dogs present for distraction..even in schutzhund)
As for showing off, how do you know thats what he was doing? maybe he was in training.. You have to keep up the training even after titles are won, you cant just train a dog, win titles and think the dog will always be perfect. You still have to refresh the dogs memory every now and again.
The dog is not your "ordinary" game-bred. Rather, if it was bred (as stated on the video) by the trainer, it was bred to do this type of work. I believe those exceptional scores and titles give the trainer the benefit of the doubt when training in public while off the leash.

"oh but what will people say,think?" There are three possible answers: "oh, there goes another dangerous 'pitt'", "oh, that's an obedient dog, what breed is it?", and last.."There goes a true Ambassador to our breed".

The only part that made me hesitant was when handler/dog where indoors and decoy attempted to grab him from behind....here I thought internally "man, what if a friend/relative wanted to surprise him (handler) by grabbing him from behind? or What if couple of teens happen to be running behind them and met them (passing by) from behind?" I would hope a dog with such good scores/titles has been trained to recognize the difference.

In regards to Schulzhund and protection training in general, IMO, any dog (regardless of breed) trained for this "sport" must be equally trained in companionship and any other training that will require a calm disposition.

[Rocky H. Balboa]

I am sorry to disagree with you. Those imbeciles (ones attempting to do as seen) should not be owning our breed or for that matter, dogs period.

what is this teaching others? Sure this is one good video, but how many people will see this video and try to do the same and wind up with an unstable headline maker!

[14rock]

You're right, they shouldn't be owning the breed....but since its so easily accesible to anyone with the $$ now-days no one is going to stop them from owning one. Out of your three things people could say when seeing a dog like this......the two positive ones will not help the breed much at all, it will give them recognition to a couple people but they will just say "Its all in how you raise them, his wasnt raised to fight so its a good dog". However, all it takes is that one idiot who watches this and tries to do the same and his dog bites an innocent citizen....and its a headline goldmine. That one idiot can do far more damage much quicker than a group of well trained dogs can save!

[SouthernDixie]

Whether or not the video had protection work in it or not, to see how well the trainer had worked with him was the impressive part to me. Granted I disliked seeing the dog off leash in public, yet it was still pretty neat to see that dog obey so well. The dog was well behaved and well trained and I enjoyed the video for that reason.

[Rocky H. Balboa]

Damn, sorry to disagree with you (again). If you think avoiding "that" incident will change people's (those who think all "pit bulls" are vicious) perception, my friend, you are sadly mistaken. As you know, true APBT attacks on humans are a very, very small percentage of all dog-to-people attacks. As you know, poodles, Dalmatians, and Retrievers hold the highest combine percentage when comparing to other breeds together. Yet, our breed is the only one being condemned. IMO, it is due to localities passing "muzzle-that-pit" policies, requiring insurance on breed-specified dogs, Media propaganda, and uneducated general public.

If anyone thinks that the general public's perception will change if we all muzzle and leash our dogs, you are sadly mistaken. In fact, muzzling (most of us will agree) our dogs in public will add to this misconception of "vicious dogs".

Educating the masses by taking time to explain and demystify will ultimate save our breeds.....not by removing our dogs from public view or by "closing the circle". We also have to thank our cousins (the Staffies) for looking nice and playing nice with others. Thanks to properly bred Staffies, the "neutral" public is making statements like "it depends on how you raise them" more frequently than when the "Pit Bull" scare began.

You're right, they shouldn't be owning the breed....but since its so easily accesible to anyone with the $$ now-days no one is going to stop them from owning one. Out of your three things people could say when seeing a dog like this......the two positive ones will not help the breed much at all, it will give them recognition to a couple people but they will just say "Its all in how you raise them, his wasnt raised to fight so its a good dog". However, all it takes is that one idiot who watches this and tries to do the same and his dog bites an innocent citizen....and its a headline goldmine. That one idiot can do far more damage much quicker than a group of well trained dogs can save!

[14rock]

Well we seem to agree to disagree. You might look at Staffies as saving our breed by being non-dog-aggressive. I think it is ruining it. People see these dogs and believe "its all in how you train them, you can love the fight out of a pitbull, I've seen it myself!" then they are merely on their way to being another irresponsible owner who will further that myth. Its the people who think this way that think dog parks and letting dogs run around off-leash are o'k...


If all owners made sure to inform everyone that they are playing the odds with a non-dog-aggressive dog and they are by far the exception-not the rule it would be a diffrent story. This video does not show that....the majority of people who watch this will come to the conclusion that all dogs are this way and this is a great thing. The fact is.....it takes a special dog to take to training this well and the dedication on the handlers part far exceeds what most people will go through.

[Rocky H. Balboa]

I cannot leave this thread without agreeing with you ;) . I totally agree.

.....it takes a special dog to take to training this well and the dedication on the handlers part far exceeds what most people will go through.

[Jenn]

Still wondering why the dog is biting legs, does anyone know?I think it's the difference in Schutzund vs. French Ring training? I'm sure someone could correct it if I'm wrong, but I think it's just part of the different methods of training between the two.

[rocksteady]

dogs are usually trained to bite arms simply because most people hold a weapon in their hand and the purpose of the dog is not to actually attack and maul a person, but to disable a person, hold a person down, catch a person and prevent injury to the handler. Dogs are a protective measure.. they arent attacking just to bite.

the dog may have been trained using several grab points.. whatever the reason I doubt the dog was poorly trained. Some of the best dogs in this type of work do scan the situation and act according..sometimes an arm hold isnt possible..not every situation a dog will encounter goes text book..

[Riptora]

I never heard of a dog going for the leg as a first target, usually they use a sequence where in advanced training they will go for the leg if the arm does not work. I would look into the Leergurg website for info. The French Ring is the superbowl of protection training and you can get a ton of info on that site, it is an obsticle course but even then the dogs have a bite sequence they do have to compensate for each exercise (they use fire, tunnels, doors, guns) but the bites are supposed to be predicted for what I understand. Leerburg explains everything and has an amazing reputation, he is a trainer of trainers, GOOD trainers and explains everything in great detail. Has anyone heard of muzzle fighting? Not the type I read about on this forum, it is for protection work where the dog (on duty) wheres a basket muzzle a litterly 'punches' people with it, they also have a sequence, they start with the stomach and move to groin I believe.

Am I wrong that it goes against the pit bull's nature to attack humans? I thought that was a major part of the breeds tempermental discription. Although I have read that many famus game dogs would bite humans.

Can we see some citizen touch that guy in public? Did the dog break the heel position at the store and start acting nervous or suspicious? Not sure myself. What do those titles mean? One is UDX obedience, what is the Sport competition? Bye the way I am only picking this guy apart because he decided to train his dog to bite people and I think all these questions are more than reasonable.

[missybee16]

This video shows impressive training skills, better than some. The dog looks & listens as his trainer speaks, some won't. I don't like this method of training, but when you have such good skills at it, doesn't hurt to show them off once in awhile.

[chinasmom]

Yes The Video Has It's Pro's And Con's, But The Way The Dog Looked To The Handler For Every Move Is Inspiring And Shows Great Respect And Loyalty On The Dogs Behalf.

[Riptora]

As is the pit bull, one of the more loyal breeds!

[Dameon]

-french ring has leg bites, you can train your dog to bite what ever body part that moves.

-some people are going to say some thing negitive about every thing. I thought it was just about "protection" work but some can only think negitive.

-my dog will not bite people for touching me due to a proper balance in training. I would strongly discourage anyone to TRY and take my wallet.

-as far as carry a gun or do you own fighting, get your head out of your a$$!!!!! some people have disabilities so their has don't work. I can't even hold a gun jack a$$...

[PamJ]

I think the dog done great work, as well as the handler. I also think people shouldn't be so negative, and if you don't know what you're talking about, you should probably keep your mouth shut, or just ask questions. Stick to what you know "Hog hunting"!

[Dameon]

disabilities so their HANDS don't work.

[Hoyden]

From my point of view, a person who is handicapped and training her pit bull to be a service dog for her own use, the obedience and heeling work was pretty impressive.

When they approached the store front and the dog waited for permission to greet the child, then resumed working on command was awesome to me. That is very important when working with a service dog.

While the heeling excercizes in the parking lot were great, I'd love to see them done in the mall or another busy place. Now THAT would show serious training.

As for the off lead comment, service dogs are trained to work on and off leash and must have excellent recall even in highly distracting environments.

[catcher T]

that dog would do just as well in a busy mall as he did in the parking lot,,no doubt in my mind. And you right,,can do much with them if their recall lacks in any way at all.

[Riptora]

Why choose this breed though? A breed not intended for this work? Does it not go against their nature to go after humans?
There is no way that you could bring-up this subject and not expect extreme responses, not because people don't believe in protection training, but for one, because this is a pit, and because it is such a sensative subject. You can not deny that there are too many so called 'trainers' who train in protection and create incredibly unstable canine time bombs.
I think that dogs should be utilitzed so much more in work than they are already, I think that the world would benfit if we relied more on working dogs. When it comes to protection though, it's touchy. Many fatal dog attacks are associatted with this 'training' by those who do not do it properly, including the Diane Whipple case in San Fran by the Presa Canario dogs. In my opinion it is hard to have the right dog, even in the breeds that are meant for this work because in my opinion it is unnatural for any dog to take-on a human.
You should be happy that the people in this forum does not take this subject lightly. Especially because this is a breed with a bad reputation that is not originally intended to strike humans.

[Dameon]

I think having a dog that is NOT human aggressive is idea for protection in public. I would rather train a dog to do some thing rather than try to train OUT a behaior (human aggressive) to take in public. My dog is not looking for trouble but he will turn it one with one word.

[Riptora]

I believe you have a great dog. Why did you chose a pit and not a breed meant and bred for the purpose?

[rocksteady]

simply because alot of the dogs "Bred for" this type of work arent always suited for this type of work. IF you take 20 German shepards all bred for "protection" maybe 10 will make it to the training. And out of those 10, maybe 5 will make it through training.

In the right hands, the right trainer who knows what to look for in a dog, the APBT excells in schutzhund, not to mention usually out preforms the Rottis and shepards. The problem is not to many people who take on the task know what they are doing and create more problems than good..

[PamJ]

For people that's supposed to be so crazy about APBT's, some of you seem to be selling them short. They are very intelligent animals and are capable of a whole lot more than weight pulling, fighting dogs, hogs and looking pretty in a show. They are awsome dogs and are capable of doing more than you all are giving them credit for. That includes "protection" and "service" animals. The strength, stamina and temprament of an APBT alone... how could you ask for a better working dog??? I think you all are making them out to be vicious killers by YOUR words. Other people are trying to show the world they can be useful and gentle beast.

[14rock]

No PamJ...the reason most every condones the job is not that APBT's CANT do it....its that we believe they SHOULDNT. The reasons for believing this differ....I will say mine is people see well trained APBT's like this and not the training that goes into it. Then you get idiots who do ghetto, unstable, bite work and say its "protection trained". The negatives for the breed as a whole greatly exceed the positives (IMO) gained by doing this.

[rocksteady]

For people that's supposed to be so crazy about APBT's, some of you seem to be selling them short. They are very intelligent animals and are capable of a whole lot more than weight pulling, fighting dogs, hogs and looking pretty in a show. They are awsome dogs and are capable of doing more than you all are giving them credit for. That includes "protection" and "service" animals. The strength, stamina and temprament of an APBT alone... how could you ask for a better working dog??? I think you all are making them out to be vicious killers by YOUR words. Other people are trying to show the world they can be useful and gentle beast.

"Protection" is not the same as "service". I dont think anyone has a problem with these dogs acting in search and rescue, leader dogs, drug or bomb detection dogs, companion dogs, utility dogs, even hearding dogs..

Like 14Rock stated, these dogs were not ment to be attack or "protection" dogs. Far to many people are thinking they are training sound dogs (of any bree) out of their backyard when they are not (there is no requirement for being a dog trainer, an obeidence instructor, and attack dog trainer.. allthough some organizations have criteria and the trainer must be certified with them to train their dogs ) Other than that, joe blow can pic a mutt off the street, "train it" and say its a trained attack dog..

far to many people already want these dogs so they can simply look cool or tough or show off their "bad ass pitt thats mean "

[PamJ]

I do agree with you that there are idiots that are "training" their dogs in their yards or what ever and are doing the dogs damage, but there are also people who are doing it the right way and going to legitamate clubs and working with their dogs. These places stress obedience above all, and socialization of your animal. You not only have to be able to work with it at home but in places that your animal is unfamiliar with. This starts when your dog is 7 and 8 weeks old. I think the more people bad mouth the APBT, the more people should show them they are wrong, and they ARE wrong. There is nothing these dogs should be held back from, IMO.
And yes, a lot of people are walking around with a pit bull so they can say "HEY LOOK AT ME... I HAVE A TWO INCH PENIS!!!"

[ChAnimal]

I believe you have a great dog. Why did you chose a pit and not a breed meant and bred for the purpose?
Why cant he chose a pit? Why take the pit to conformation shows or weight pulls he wasnt bred for that. I think its great that he chose a pit and if i was doin the same thing im sure i couldnt have any other dog take the pits place. When the first conformation/weight pull shows were started by real dogmen others laughed, but if it were not for these shows where would the pit be now???????

[badger]

Why cant he chose a pit? Why take the pit to conformation shows or weight pulls he wasnt bred for that. I think its great that he chose a pit and if i was doin the same thing im sure i couldnt have any other dog take the pits place. When the first conformation/weight pull shows were started by real dogmen others laughed, but if it were not for these shows where would the pit be now???????

nice post! :D

[14rock]

Why cant he chose a pit?
Its America and theres no laws saying (yet) what breed of dog you can do service and Schutzland work with. Hell, someone could choose a Ball Python for their service animal....or a ferret for their "protection trained" animal....doesnt mean its a good choice or that everyone agrees with it!

Why take the pit to conformation shows or weight pulls he wasnt bred for that.
The Amstaff was bred for Curformation shows. But were our dogs? Nope, and thats why true fanciers of the breed only see these things as traits to *COMPLIMENT* an already proven game dog. Those things alone dont mean squat to me...and Schutzland alone doesnt mean squat to me! If a dog is a true to standard game dog that excels in Schutzland it makes him even greater, but that alone doesnt make a good dog.
I think its great that he chose a pit and if i was doin the same thing im sure i couldnt have any other dog take the pits place.
Why not some stock bred specifically for that for years and years? Just doesnt make sense to me. And what makes less sense is taking a dog bred to show absolutely no aggression towards humans and train them to bite a sleeve on a human.
.......................

[missybee16]

I think the dog done great work, as well as the handler. I also think people shouldn't be so negative, and if you don't know what you're talking about, you should probably keep your mouth shut, or just ask questions. Stick to what you know "Hog hunting"! Quite a few of us, do know what we are talking about here. I train in all methods & have for over 16yrs. This type of training is dangerous, and it's going to end up as a bad situation, sooner or later. Our dogs have a bad rap already, and do not need more due to this kind of training. When I send out a dog for work, it's not out there to hurt anyone, or kill. This shows me clearly, that it will have a bad out come if, the dog does not take command to stop. What if, the so-called trainer thought he could train his dog, and it ended up in a bad predicament. Oh sorry, won't cut it. So, what questions were you talking about, that we should ask? Do we dare?

[badger]

if,if,if! where a fith we would al be drunk! jmo

[missybee16]

if,if,if! where a fith we would al be drunk! jmo Let you tell it-HA HA HA.