Beanie

[beanieman]

The FFBs originally started their kennels with Staffordshire Bull Terriers, which in fact they still own. Their first bitch called Betty, was out of K .C. lines and was bred back to the notable Game Flash. After they had schooled her for some time, she was eventually put open for show. Her first contest was into a bitch called Panthera and despite the extremely hot conditions Panthera was stopped on her second scratch at 16 minutes with Betty making a good courtesy scratch. After this, she had her first contracted match, into a bitch from the Ghostbusters which ended in a draw in a little over the hour mark. Nevertheless, she proved to be a real gamish little bitch.
The kennels then began to experiment with the Old Time ( Irish ) Staffordshires with mixed results, some good and some bad. Eventually though, they began to gather some fair stock together, which enabled them to produce their own Stafford line.
Some years later they had the opportunity to import an Old Time Staffordshire bitch called Beanie from Bullpower Kennels, a friend of the FFBs and a dogman that they respected. Having seen the bitch perform in a test, he suggested that they buy her for their own Kennels as she was just what they were looking for. The FFBs took his advice and brought the dog back home, considering her to be the best Old Time Stafford that they had seen.
She was tested into a very good pitbull, going some pounds uphill. In the opinion of her new owners she proved to be a really deepgame bitch and in all probability a deadgame one, with good ability an mouth.
Beanie was originally bred by Jack C in Ireland and was given to Charlie L in North of the country. Initially called Suzie she was Sired by Scratch Kennels Hagler II out of a daughter of Ch Psycho dog. She had been tested hard on many occasions and was ultimately sold to the guy from Bullpower Kennels, who bred her twice. The first mating with Milo, produced Woods Ben and Bullpower Kennels Beanie II. The second mating was with East streets Jocko, which produced Bullpower Kennels Merlin, East streets Junior and Woods Rock.
Beanie was to produce a further two litters on the FFBs yard. The first Sired by Lee Strain Psycho crossed dog named Barney and the second with a son of the Milo dog, Pilot. Pups produced by these mastings have suggested good things for the FFBs yard. A third and final mating is planned with an Old Time Stafford dog called Paddy. He has good ability, average wind, has been tested hard and is out of Archie, over NFs Ruby, Paddy is game proven and lost his only outing to Yarrakins Stitchy Mahoner, but in really game fashion.

[beanieman]

Forgot to say this is a old article

[OnTheRocks]

There are atleast two significant matings of Beanie missing in that list. Rickey to Beanie, that produced Jack and Rickey jr. Then Jack back to Beanie, that produced Tanya etc. Jack was the most important stud out of Beanie, a great dog. Jack was bred several times producing some good dogs. Jacks last mating was to his half sister Fly, who is a double bred daughter to Rickey. There are still a few dogs out of Jack about...

[darlo]

hey fella can u pm me cheers
all the best
darlo

[beanieman]

There are atleast two significant matings of Beanie missing in that list. Rickey to Beanie, that produced Jack and Rickey jr. Then Jack back to Beanie, that produced Tanya etc. Jack was the most important stud out of Beanie, a great dog. Jack was bred several times producing some good dogs. Jacks last mating was to his half sister Fly, who is a double bred daughter to Rickey. There are still a few dogs out of Jack about...
correct this was an older article i got more about ffb together with the rest and more.
The rest with beanie is in the other article psycho/northford strain

[OnTheRocks]

hey fella can u pm me cheers
all the best
darlo

If it is me, PM´s dont seem to work for me at this board... Give me another way to communicate...

[ben brockton]

were any of these "old time staffs" exported to the us? from the kennels named in OP?

[darlo]

mrdenty69@yahoo.co.uk
nice one fella

[OnTheRocks]

were any of these "old time staffs" exported to the us? from the kennels named in OP?

Yes, several individuals where exported. But none where bred further as far as I know. There has been a limited amount of proper Staffords imported to the US! But very few, if any, where imported with a serious devotion to breed further. Not in recent years anyway.

[OnTheRocks]

mrdenty69@yahoo.co.uk
nice one fella

You got mail... Admins are also helping me sorting my PM problems, which is greatly appreciated...

[jmc]

Their was a good son from Jack x Dutch originally called boots that PP sent to a well known dogman in Canada who renamed him Paddy this dogman used him as a roll dog and he always showed good ability and was said to have stopped some of their prospects, but as mentioned above their has never been the right breeding with staffords outside of europe.

[Bulldoghistorian]

I always wondered how some of these breedings with beanie took place while dogs were either dead , or to old to even have pups


fly quit in 12 minutes into tanimfords shaia
someone advertised she was bred to Judas that breeding never happened
than they said she was bred to hamas
LOL hamas was 3 months old at the time
well I guess some believe and some know

[oldboy]

There are atleast two significant matings of Beanie missing in that list. Rickey to Beanie, that produced Jack and Rickey jr. Then Jack back to Beanie, that produced Tanya etc. Jack was the most important stud out of Beanie, a great dog. Jack was bred several times producing some good dogs. Jacks last mating was to his half sister Fly, who is a double bred daughter to Rickey. There are still a few dogs out of Jack about...

Jack was indeed a very game dog and the best producer coming down from old Beanie.


Jack's last mating was not his hafsister FFB Fly but a inbred daughter of Rickey also called R'sFly..I know it is getting confusing but Jack was mated to his halfsister Fly(Pilot x Beanie) few years before that and at the end of his life mated to R's Fly (daughter of Rickey) also a halfsister of him but on the sire side...

[oldboy]

Fly did not perform well into that bitch she was started for the first time and I know you know dogs when they are youngsters some act weird..Fly was a late starter and when she did she was good and game 2 dogged in a test...this is no fairy tale..
later on when exported to the UK she was checked again and proved...so..

[Bulldoghistorian]

U might be right it was a first roll.

do u know who fly was bred to which litters were of her and bred to which stud

[dirty bastard]

I always wondered how some of these breedings with beanie took place while dogs were either dead , or to old to even have pups


fly quit in 12 minutes into tanimfords shaia
someone advertised she was bred to Judas that breeding never happened
than they said she was bred to hamas
LOL hamas was 3 months old at the time
well I guess some believe and some know

This ped you mean??
http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Public&file=printPedigree&dog_id=333481

[jmc]

When Fly (Pilot x Beanie) was bred to Jack a bitch was sent back to the FFB's called Fly II she was hard tested very rough little bitch looked promissing but unfortunatly she escaped from her kennels killed a pit x english bull then ran across the road and was killed by a truck!....

[beanieman]

This ped you mean??
http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Public&file=printPedigree&dog_id=333481
No not me !.
I never advertised about that, this is my old bitch and her ped is just up since a few months.
And more funny is that i changed it from gashouse urica (what was on the legal papers) to Fly this afternoon after Oldboy his post and boom there are you, who finds the need to post my old bitch her ped in your first post.
Sir you flatter me but get a life and do not get involved with an other man his lies.
BJ aka BMC aka Bulldoghistorian = the 1 that said to many people that the judas/fly breeding was the best he did but now years later he is telling something else real funny hahaha :D.
Some just would like to know to the best way how there dogs are bred and no it doesn't matter wich name is behind it as long as they know.

[Bulldoghistorian]

Think u got me mixed up but your fun , not bothered at all
Its common knowledge that when that statement was made , it was meant as a ridicule towards some people.
By emphasizing the fact that the litter was super he actually meant he was on to the swapping of papers.

especially since around that time it was common knowledge that fly had quit
just look at the pictures of the dogs from that litter and the dogs that judas normally produces
most of em were over 44 pounds and stood around at least 18 inch at the shoulders

if your attitude was different some might have been inclined to give u the right info, but since your attitude is one of confrontation and insult I guess we will just have a good laugh

[dirty bastard]

No not me !.
I never advertised about that, this is my old bitch and her ped is just up since a few months.
And more funny is that i changed it from gashouse urica (what was on the legal papers) to Fly this afternoon after Oldboy his post and boom there are you, who finds the need to post my old bitch her ped in your first post.
Sir you flatter me but get a life and do not get involved with an other man his lies.
BJ aka BMC aka Bulldoghistorian = the 1 that said to many people that the judas/fly breeding was the best he did but now years later he is telling something else real funny hahaha :D.
Some just would like to know to the best way how there dogs are bred and no it doesn't matter wich name is behind it as long as they know.

This was a reaction about the breeding fly x judas, could be also another pup from this litter. Accidentely it has been your old bitch witch i did not know. Just looking around and found this. I am sorry about it and don't understand the problem. Also the pm you send me, I did not understand. But if there is a problem, I apologize for it.

[jmc]

People never seem to beleive anythink is down from Judas, when in the UK people doubted the litter he sired aswell lol....

[Retired Geezer]

It wasn't only in the UK people were in doubt. The same happened in Canada and the US. Pebbles out of Rickey and Beanie was sent to Canada and it was claimed that she was artificially inseminated with sperm from Judas. I had a talk with Hersh a few months before he passed away and he told me that Pebbles ended up in the US with John Reuver and that they used an APBT named Archie on Pebbles and he had no idea where the story about Judas being the sire came from. I'll post a picture of Corkie out of that mating when I get to my other computer.

[Retired Geezer]

http://tiny.cc/dtz4w

If anyone is still claiming that this is out of a mating between Judas and Pebbles, Please share whatever you are smoking with me lol

[jmc]

Im pretty sure thats not of Judas lol is a nice looking bitch thow anyway.... but the breeding in the U.K to Gayle happend have the pictures to prove it....

[beanieman]

Think u got me mixed up but your fun , not bothered at all
Its common knowledge that when that statement was made , it was meant as a ridicule towards some people.
By emphasizing the fact that the litter was super he actually meant he was on to the swapping of papers.

especially since around that time it was common knowledge that fly had quit
just look at the pictures of the dogs from that litter and the dogs that judas normally produces
most of em were over 44 pounds and stood around at least 18 inch at the shoulders

if your attitude was different some might have been inclined to give u the right info, but since your attitude is one of confrontation and insult I guess we will just have a good laugh
LOL yes me and some others are mistaken you for sure :rolleyes:.
Wel let's say that's the case let me point out some things.

When did you ever had seem me asking about these dogs?
And if i did it would be in pm.
And when it comes to BJ the only thing i once asked him was about some of his caligula breeding behind shy that's it !.
Then he aproached me saying the beanie/pilot breeding never happend just like you did in your post and claimed Nero is the father.
Just like your post about silver and other dogs, when i speak to people who actualy had been around them i hear different story's.
No it seems like you have some knowledge.

When i first got my bitch i was told cassy was her mother, years later is was supossed to be her sister fly.
You wrote judas mated with her sister, his son mated with fly, according oldboy the breeding judas/fly did happend, seems like you al have a different look at history.
But i just post some things about those dogs that were past on to me and you al come out with the story's not me !.
i could not know before my time but i waste time checking it out.
Either it was the breeding was judas/fly, judas/fly's sister or judas's son with fly i do not care any more.
on legal papers it is handsworth psycho star (judas) x gashouse urica.
And that is how my peds wil be untill someone shows me proof otherwise.

Oh and about me beeing confronting and insulting, only to people who lie or make up story's based upon assumptions or second hand talk.
At least some stand up people from the past were willing to talk to me and shared what they know.
And i do not like to keep bothering them with these stupid questions about the past just because certain people needed to lie en still do untill this day on.

[beanieman]

Im pretty sure thats not of Judas lol is a nice looking bitch thow anyway.... but the breeding in the U.K to Gayle happend have the pictures to prove it....
yes i got that pic.
Funny a guy who has a son out of hamas x rowdy even denies it LOL
No that cannot be, judas was steril at that time bla bla bla
Just shows you how people are and i have to bother others with questions and every time i get a different story back with proof LOL

[Bulldoghistorian]

I remember that when u just came on the board u were ranting and raving about the droopy dog. your assumptions proved to be wrong.

Your posting a ped also that Judas was bred to skinny girl
its common knowledge skinny girl was put down as a 9 month old pup after having attacked someone.
Same happened to her brother DMW altough a 2xw was so hard to handle he was put down as well.

the person who made the breedings with fly was the same person who bred the red dog known as Beanie she was sold also being out of Hamas and Fly

I have learned a wise lesson from the past
any breeder who sells dogs to pay the next bill will tell u what u want to hear.

Retired Geezer is right there has never been a breeding of pebbles to Judas:rolleyes:

Now watch out Geezer them youngsters these days will challenge what u seen with your own eyes.
there so persistent that u will wonder if your brain has been fried
Once again they want to rewrite history , filling it with nonsense that they pass on to the next generation

[oldboy]

U might be right it was a first roll.

do u know who fly was bred to which litters were of her and bred to which stud

Well there is a bit of controversy...She was born on the yard of ffb...then send to friend of them called L T..he ask them if he could breed a litter of her and this was allowed he told them he wanted to use Judas, no questions asked a mating was done the owner of Judas must know if that mating really happened...about 2 years later the boys brought Fly back home was tested hard and send to one of their partners wich name I don't want to post on this forum.there she had her final spin.anyway she was mated to the best of beanie's sons (old Jack) only 3 pups survived...one of them was tested and looked verry promising but she escaped her kennel had a terrible kennelfight after finishing her business run across the street and was hit by truck..she did not survive. Fly and 1 of her pups where confiscated, the 3th ended up in a pethome....
to the best of my knowledge LT had one litter of her..and the FFB only had one mating with her to Jack..
The first mating with Judas is the only thing I'm not sure of but LT insisted it was that mating...

[oldboy]

Well there is a bit of controversy...She was born on the yard of ffb...then send to friend of them called L T..he ask them if he could breed a litter of her and this was allowed he told them he wanted to use Judas, no questions asked a mating was done the owner of Judas must know if that mating really happened...about 2 years later the boys brought Fly back home was tested hard and send to one of their partners wich name I don't want to post on this forum.there she had her final spin.anyway she was mated to the best of beanie's sons (old Jack) only 3 pups survived...one of them was tested and looked verry promising but she escaped her kennel had a terrible kennelfight after finishing her business run across the street and was hit by truck..she did not survive. Fly and 1 of her pups where confiscated, the 3th ended up in a pethome....
to the best of my knowledge LT had one litter of her..and the FFB only had one mating with her to Jack..
The first mating with Judas is the only thing I'm not sure of but LT insisted it was that mating...

also Judas owner at the time confirmed to my friend he was used over Fly...if both make this statement what can I say??? wasn't present at this first mating....

[Xibalba]

Judas owner = probaly Bulldoghistorian :rolleyes:

[beanieman]

Wel i just checked my own posts and i may have said some dumb shit in the past.
You wil never here me ranting and raving about droopy or any other of my dogs, like they are the shit !.
So get your facts toghether, again it is you al who comes out with those story's i just tell people the way they are bred, that's it.
And about skinny girl, her ped was send to me by Ace of diamond who has a dog Ace from the breeder who has the red beanie dog !.
I send it to him and he said that he was beeing honest to her.
And he did not corrected that ped.
So do not start crying to me about those peds or blame me for those.
I did not put them in to the world !
to quote your own sentence, One can only be as honest as the pedigrees handed to him.
But i do post them yes and maybe someday a person can give a normal anwser.
So instead of you ranting, raving and bitching about things of the past.
You could chose the way of the gentleman and correct it in a normal way.
But you chose to do it like this, like you are the all knowing oracle.
Still say enough but actualy saying nothing at al.
Like i said before, swapping papers doing this breedig or that breeding.
I do not care anymore, those people are a joke, the more and more i learn about them the more i start to laugh :D.
And maybe i am not getting thru to you but i like my dogs regarding the way they are bred.

[oldboy]

Judas owner = probaly Bulldoghistorian :rolleyes:

Well don't know but it's hard to believe it is him and it does not matter to me...

by the way nice profile picture..guess it's not you either lol;)

[Xibalba]

lol no not me :)

[Ace-of-Diamonds]

Wel i just checked my own posts and i may have said some dumb shit in the past.
You wil never here me ranting and raving about droopy or any other of my dogs, like they are the shit !.
So get your facts toghether, again it is you al who comes out with those story's i just tell people the way they are bred, that's it.
And about skinny girl, her ped was send to me by Ace of diamond who has a dog Ace from the breeder who has the red beanie dog !.
I send it to him and he said that he was beeing honest to her.
And he did not corrected that ped.
So do not start crying to me about those peds or blame me for those.
I did not put them in to the world !
to quote your own sentence, One can only be as honest as the pedigrees handed to him.
But i do post them yes and maybe someday a person can give a normal anwser.
So instead of you ranting, raving and bitching about things of the past.
You could chose the way of the gentleman and correct it in a normal way.
But you chose to do it like this, like you are the all knowing oracle.
Still say enough but actualy saying nothing at al.
Like i said before, swapping papers doing this breedig or that breeding.
I do not care anymore, those people are a joke, the more and more i learn about them the more i start to laugh :D.
And maybe i am not getting thru to you but i like my dogs regarding the way they are bred.

It's Ace of DiamondS. Maybe the breeder of my dog didn't knew this and he was as honest as te pedigrees handed to him. :D

Funny how you always when confronted with things supposed to be not true are very fast on telling where you get the information.

Now you can reply with insults about my dogs but first achieve something with yours please.

[Bulldoghistorian]

The only one who is posting the peds online is u Beanieman

funny the name why would anyone call themselves after a dog they had no association with,
never seen her go , never laid hands on and never ever seen in there entire life
why would anyone do such a thing

The same reason why you are posting peds and tell stories of dogs u never seen
make peds of info u got from A who heard it from C who told B
But B said this and C said that but beanieman posts it on the net

WOW

[beanieman]

yes indeed i posted the peds of my dogs, some people who have dogs of of me would like to now how they are bred and unlike most people i have not much to hide.
And if you get so upset that certain things are not right, then you should not have lied in the past.
the only thing not sure are the dogs from the BMC breeding.
About droopy's ped wel that is correct.

But if it upsets you so i wil take them down you big old cry baby, if that makes you happy.

And you want to talk pseudo names LOL.
Yes i do like the beanie dog from eyes only and i like what she produced.
A hell lot better then the judas dog ever did.
And i also like beenie man as an artist so i took the name in the mids of those 2 and you get beanieman.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2Odi5QWzEQ

No what is real funny is having the name Bulldoghistorian and not knowing the true facts about certain dogs and still gets involved cause he would like to be know as the man who knows everything.

Again if you do not have anything normal to add,
open a coke and shut the fuck up and stop with these childish behaviour.
What do you care what i call my self on a board, get a life.
Have you seen some of the other names of people LOL
go fit on them, if you have nothing better to do :D

[zuidwest]

ok yall gettin me confused here. now was judas ever mated to fly? and did the suzie bitch come from that litter? kind regards, C

[beanieman]

ok yall gettin me confused here. now was judas ever mated to fly? and did the suzie bitch come from that litter? kind regards, C
LMAO

Wel C you have 3 doors to choose from with my Suzie :D

Behind door
nr 1: Judas x Fly
nr 2 : Judas x Fly's sister
nr 3: a son of judas x Fly

to tell you the truth who give's a crap anymore C, only me and Flip knows really how suzie was and that's the most important thing.

[Bulldoghistorian]

LOL once upon a time there was a dog called Beavis
actually there were 2 dogs , 2 littermate bro's called beavis and butthead
beavis was the pride and joy and was bred to many a staff on a certain yard
only one problem he had no ped and there was BSL

peds were changed , stories were told
I guess beavis had a good time

well until he met a dog called tanimfords hatcher

[Bulldoghistorian]

by the way all ya know beenieman a batty bwoy

[zuidwest]

you lot are a breed apart thats for sure. guess ill just stick to what ive seen myself from here on. good luck to yall.

[Blanco]

That's the best thing you can do zuidwest.
Again,if you're happy with what you have than it's all good in da hood.
If not,change dogs and get something better from parents you've seen

[zuidwest]

nothing wrong with my dogs mate let that be clear.
i just like to know how dogs are bred and escpecially now since i have used a son of suzie for my last breeding, and now people starting to talk about wrong peds and such, getting me slightly irritated here, because judas being the backbone in my last breeding, sure would be nice to know where he sits in the pedigree then wouldnt it. but heey lets all just have laugh here.

[Bulldoghistorian]

common sense should have told u from the start some of the things were not adding up

1) Size. The background of Judas are dogs of 20 inches .Judas himself was around 18 inch
he produced mostly dogs bigger than he was .
On the contrary the size of the real sire was 16 inch, the line was known to produce lanky dogs and infact was widely known for producing the smallest known pitbuill at just 17 pounds

2) Colour Judas produced mostly white and or black with white dog , some of em having small blue spots
the real sire was red with white ,
It should raise an eyebrow that there is so much red in a line that's known to be predominantly white

U do the math use the eye. And the truth will reveal itself.
Remember one does not breed to a dog , but to a family
without the knowledge of that particular family one cannot breed consistent.

[Bulldoghistorian]

Also this whole lie about this bitch being out of Fly is garbage.
This bitch is out of brother sis combo out of Dino and silver
The brother and sister out of this combo were bitch being a red dog with blue nose, Barney being a white deaf dog

From this litter came a bitch called Kessie or suzie or something was given to LT. The reason for this was Both barney and his sister were nothing special
Papers were done without any permission and caused several riffs between people back than.
the only difference was those involved didnt rat like the so called dogman out today

here u go southwest now u know the papers on them dogs

[beanieman]

at the end of the day you were still involved with the swapping of the papers.
Enough said about the so called dog man of the past.

[Bulldoghistorian]

Red bitch was called coalminers scooby

[oldboy]

the mating with Barney x Scooby was done by a lad well known in Staff circles his name was T and after this the litter was sold..Scooby and Barney where indeed brother sister Scooby was cold and Barney quit
no secrets about that, Silver was a deepgame bitch never quit...Dino was tested and was a slow starter later on he was tested and scratched like a train his owner back then got into apbt and the dog was kept as a pet..
so pups from these combination where sold by T..don't know what happened with them but should be tatoo on them from JDVG...

[zuidwest]

ok so correct me if im wrong but suzie is down from barney X scooby and they are both down from dino X silver?

[zuidwest]

the mating with Barney x Scooby was done by a lad well known in Staff circles his name was T and after this the litter was sold..Scooby and Barney where indeed brother sister Scooby was cold and Barney quit
no secrets about that, Silver was a deepgame bitch never quit...Dino was tested and was a slow starter later on he was tested and scratched like a train his owner back then got into apbt and the dog was kept as a pet..
so pups from these combination where sold by T..don't know what happened with them but should be tatoo on them from JDVG...

in what manner did barney quit? seeing as though he was bred at least 2 times one gotta think there was at least some worth in this dog.
and maybe any pictures on barney, scooby and dino?

[Bulldoghistorian]

the mating with Barney x Scooby was done by a lad well known in Staff circles his name was T and after this the litter was sold..Scooby and Barney where indeed brother sister Scooby was cold and Barney quit
no secrets about that, Silver was a deepgame bitch never quit...Dino was tested and was a slow starter later on he was tested and scratched like a train his owner back then got into apbt and the dog was kept as a pet..
so pups from these combination where sold by T..don't know what happened with them but should be tatoo on them from JDVG...

2 of em were at a fella called E
one of them was send to LT kennels and bred with the notorious Beavis

they were than being sold supposedly out of fly.

Most of them had the build of the and colouration of Beavis.
some were reddish brindle
how anyone could imagine them coming out of two white dogs is beyond me
One only needs the eye to understand the dogs don't represent there pedigrees

[blockbuster bob]

just like to say that when i bred of judas to gayle most of that litter turned out
up on the leg big dogs and were mostley white in colour

atb bob

[jt ellison]

The dogs MILO and RICKY both quit thats it togh shit whod want to own a dog with these dogs in a pedigree

[Finito]

Both dogs are close up on some of the more proven dogs of recent times.
They in turn have produced dogs of similar quality.
Rather than criticise them owners for deciding on that blood,i would give them credit. The dogs also.
Very few staffords have seen true work for a long time now,so there has never been the fortune of selection of bloodline or quality of ancestors. Therefore them yards worked with the best of what was available,in their opinion.
In your opinion JT,the staffords of today from certain lines are not gamebred. That ain't hard to understand as you have explained clearly enough on how a gamebred dog should be bred. I look in on your opinion as to how a gamebred dog should be bred & find it hard to believe that there has ever been such a stafford in history bred this way.
Your opinion of Milo on that day is well known & those i spoke to who were there also,share some of your feelings,but not all. Far as i know,he has never been touted as a great working stafford by his owner or anyone else for that matter. He walked away with the money & that was all that counted.
Maybe you can give your opinion on Ricky as you saw it or you can clear up the rumour that his owner blamed a rub & being further denied a re-run to prove the point.
I seem to recollect that Ricky pleased his last owners when he was an old dog,so maybe he finally matured when he got to pensioner stautus ?

[jt ellison]

You can talk to who you want about MILO the dog stood barking in his corner when released then walked over growling with his tail up , the owners pushed the dogs into each other to make them fight and they snapped and snarled like two street curs , walking round each other growling , the owner of Chainman then picked his dog up and threw him on top of MILO to make them fight , theyu snapped and growled then turned and snapped , each dog quit several times both were rank curs . As for taking the money thats all that counted that shows your understanding had i owned either dog then id have picked it up as money means nothing in gamedogs the reason we match them is to propve ones understanding of breeding conditioning and to see how game our dogs are , as for those you spoke to who were there that day then it shows there understanding if they thought either dog was worth a lollipop . As for Ricky he quit cold also that many have dogs with these curs in there pedigrees tells you plenty about the understanding of the fools that bred to these dogs its not MY opinion its FACTS that these dogs quit have false pedigrees thats not my doing i just wont LIE or agree with what those who were not there want to believe simply because some peddlar/dealer bred from dogs that were not game had false pedigrees and thats something todays owners have to live with as its FACTS . How is me telling about a match i refereed critising , what would you rather i do tell it different then the history of these dogs looks better , why should anyone get credit for breeding to a cur that wouldnt fight , i thought we were talking about GAMEDOGS obviously your opinion and mine thankfully differ when it comes to GAMENESS , i dont care how many dogs come down from these curs they are not GAMEBRED and you are not gonna change these FACTS as thats what they are , what i tell you is not a opinion its FACTS i was the referee and the referees decision is FINAL . How you can give credit to a person that breeds to a cur and give credit to a dog that wouldnt fight is beyond my understanding , no wonder these dogs are nopw a laughing stock in the gamedog scene when people like yourself make such ridiculous statements , you think that breeding from curs advances a breed , i cant actually believe anyones that dumb , yu must be winding me up or having a laugh

[Finito]

I was not praising them two dogs,but giving credit to the dogs & owners who are down from them.
I also never mentioned anyone giving praise to either dog that day.
No,i don't have a problem in you criticising them two dogs,but i do have a problem in you criticising the dogs down from them.
Gamebred,gameness or whatever your understanding,there still ain't "ever in the history of dogs" been a stafford which could be labelled that way on your basis. That is fact !!
In truth JT,i am winding you up & having a laugh. No doubt about it,you are the most entertaining dogman these isles have ever produced.
Rather than start a pissing match on the board for all to see,send me a pm.

I'll quote my gr-daughter when i keep telling her the same old tales of swimming with sharks & fighting the Argentinians..................
"oh no,here we go again"

[jt ellison]

Finito im not criticising those dogs or those decended from them simply telling the truth that they were curs and anything with either dog in there pedigree is cur bred thats not criticism but Facts and i dont give credit to dogs that wont fight or to breeders that breed from such dogs as were talking gamedogs not KC bred pets or showdogs , now coz most dogs have these curs in there pedigrees thats nothing to do with me but it is the fault of those that bred to the dogs now if you people cant handle that TRUTH ........... like ive said before look on the end of the chains its easy to understand why people dont like truth as for being entertaining then at least the entertainment is facts from my own personal experience and not from reading books and listening to opinions of people that never saw the dogs or were not even in dogs back in the day , yet today they are experts also ive swam with sharks and fought dogs in ARGENTINA and won

[Finito]

I believe the show went for 1.10 or around that. Tell me JT,if both dogs quit several times & all they done was snap,turn & growl throughout then who was the competent referee chosen on the day ?
Last but not least,how many scratches did each dog make ?

Two questions is all that i have wrote.....................

[jt ellison]

You know who the referee was so why ask ? have you some ulterior motive ? you were not there were not involved so mind your own buisness , if you want to ask personal questions PM me anytime

[jt ellison]

I have just read through all the above post and have a question for those who own dogs from this line of dogs . Does anyone own a dog that has a genuine pedigree ? that they are able to trace back to the dogs that came from Ireland . All i see is people disputing the way dogs are bred on every thread on any board , do none of you keep genuine pedigrees for your dogs ? Now before you all start hissy fitting , this is a genuine question based on reading the above post that were all placed by owners of dogs from this line .

[little old me]

thats a good question to ask and i would like to ask you that one back on the line ofthose red dogs down from the dogs youwere close uo with and to qoute you direcly dont start haveing a hissy fit when we talk of genuine pedigrees but i persanly saw dogs close up on the ones with your name behind them with at least 1 1\2 incch wavey fur down there backs any idea were that comes from

[jt ellison]

Lets talk dogs and let me educate you about Gamedogs as from your post its obvious your understanding is limited , first i bet you own dogs bred like the ones i mentioned in my last post were i simply asked a question does anyone have a dog with a genuine pedigree ? Thats a simple question that now i put to you , do your dogs have genuine pedigrees ? Or are trhey bred from those crossbred curbred dogs with false papers and false KC registrations ? Now that not a difficult question to anyone with half a brain that can read and is honest ? Now to your question , you have NEVER seen a single dog that i owned , if you have then name the dog ? You have never seen a single dog that i bred , if you have then name the dog ? Lastly you have never seen a single dog bred from my yard or any dog Stafford or Pitbull that i have sold , if you have then name the dog ? Now as to the long haired dogs you saw the wise thing to do was ask the fools that owned the dogs or are you saying that i bred these dogs ? If you tell me how they were supposed to be bred and tell me which of my dogs feature in the pedigrees then i will answer you honestly on this board for all to see . Howevor you have never met me but try to insinuate that these dogs are the result of breeding from dogs i owned , well lets prove some truth . All my dogs i owned and bred from were not only purebred of the breeds be they Staffords , Wheatens or Pitbulls and all were game tested and deep game , i kept records of each mating i made and no were every single puppy i bred went to and of all breeding from them till they died , so i can research any dog you mention that was owned or bred by myself , so little old you lets prove some truth and i assure you anything i tell you will be TRUTH and FACTS

[jt ellison]

LITTLE OLD ME im still waiting for you to answer my questions concerning my dogs ? Or are you like those other Jokers on here who make foolish post talking shite from behind a pen name then disapear? I love proving TRUTH in the dog game , its amazing how people become experts about things they have no knowledge about , repeat stories that are pure FICTION simply because some other neverwas told them . The reason the gamedog scene is in the state its in is because foolish breeders place there foolish understanding on the dogs they listen to people that listened to people that were never real dogmen but basically dealers and puppy peddlars . They are told stories about dogs none of them saw , the dogs they are sold have false pedigrees , the records of certain dogs are changed as are the pedigrees and the deceit goes on and on until it becomes TRUTH . I wouldd love to know how dogs that are NOT purebred Staffords are now carrying KC recognition and being peddled for such high prices , we here so much criticism of the Yahoos at the KC but a falsely papered Blue or Red puppy fetches a higher price than any genuine bred fat little KC bred dog and peple on this board have the cheek to call the KC people . Once again does ANYONE own a dog with a true genuine authentic pedigree ?

[hammer head]

simple answer is to take all peds with a pinch of salt.........A ped should prove a certain level of quality. FBK stock will scratch but our mutts made them hit the wall. Most teams wont put into the kitty until they know the dog can win it back. Ask yourself if that grand in the biscuit tin is worth riding on that so-called belly dragging hard-mouthed super game box dog?

[little old me]

i told you not to have a hissy fit calm down i have owned a dog 100percent dred down from your dogs and that is a fact no lies i dont know how i got to own it because you dont sell dogs or puppy and never had a dog at stud and know were evry dog you bred ever ended up i wont name it because i can not be bothered to talk to some one so narrow minded i have spoke to you before on the phone and you were a nothing more than a gentalman giving good advice and you were very sincere so why become a ass hole with you audiance your not the first to own dogs and you wont be the last you seem to think you invented it you dident now i have to go i have a pan of beetroot on iam going to go and watch it boil its a little more interesting than readind you running over the same old ground we all know evrey thing you have done is better than what evrey thing evrey one else has done thats life your the best champ so when you have given me another hissy reply get your self settled on the sofa and pick up you local news paper and see if you can get your self another dog like you have done in the pass who knows it might make you another ch or grch

[7mmrowland]

i told you not to have a hissy fit calm down i have owned a dog 100percent dred down from your dogs and that is a fact no lies i dont know how i got to own it because you dont sell dogs or puppy and never had a dog at stud and know were evry dog you bred ever ended up i wont name it because i can not be bothered to talk to some one so narrow minded i have spoke to you before on the phone and you were a nothing more than a gentalman giving good advice and you were very sincere so why become a ass hole with you audiance your not the first to own dogs and you wont be the last you seem to think you invented it you dident now i have to go i have a pan of beetroot on iam going to go and watch it boil its a little more interesting than readind you running over the same old ground we all know evrey thing you have done is better than what evrey thing evrey one else has done thats life your the best champ so when you have given me another hissy reply get your self settled on the sofa and pick up you local news paper and see if you can get your self another dog like you have done in the pass who knows it might make you another ch or grch
very true LMAO!!

[jt ellison]

Once again you never had a dog from myself and certainly one that was bred as you say 100% my breeding and if this is so then post the pedigree or PM it to me as your talking BS , i speak to people as i find them and your talking like a asshole saying my dogs produced dogs with long hair once more name the dogs ? and when did you ever talk with me on a phone ? as for owning a dog that was 100% my breeding you certainly never had the dog from me . How is it you people come and make foolish claims then when asked to prove it you dont wanna talk no more , like i say tell me the dog you owned that was 100% my breeding if you dont wanna go public you shouldnt have done so in the first place PM me with the pedigree

[little old me]

the one i had was 100 percent your breeding and you are saying not to cover your tracks about not selling dogs while i did not get the dog fro you direcly it was for sure 100 percnt your breeding yes i did speake to you on the phone and i will say again your were a gentleman you should not give out your number willy nilly if you can not remember who you have said this to and who you have said that to thats why people pick up on what you say i wont be in contact with you on pm no more than i would give a tramp in the street my bank deatails it not worth the hassel also did you find any thing in the paper you never hissed about that one

[jt ellison]

Once again you never had a dog from me that was 100% my breeding in fact you cant name one person that has been and bouht a dog from me or bred to any of my Stafford studs the only two bitches were Lightfoot owned by DB of Birminham and a bitch owned by JL of Liverpool that never took . You never had any dog from me that you might have owned a dog bred DOWN with dogs in its pedigree has nothing to do with me , lots of people claimed they had dogs from my dogs even years after they were dead . Your just like hose others on here that talk about things they have NO knowledge of were NOT involved in but feel if you say something derogatory it makes you feel like a dogman or woman when in fact it shows ignorance . Im all for people having there say but when they LIE on a board then refuse to show the proof it shows everyone just how childish you are . As for me giving you good advice and someone giving you my private number and me behaving like a gentleman then why now would you come on a public board claiming MY dogs produced dogs with long hair , i say your a LIAR and a fool and NEVER did your dog come from me , the simple solution is to post the pedigree for all to see , if not keep your foolish opinions to yourself and stick to boiling beetroot , its easy to run your mouth of on a board thats a cowards or curs way .

[zuidwest]

so just for the record can i get the true ped on the droopy dog and the suzie bitch.
*edit*
it wont change the pups i got out of my breeding but i will get my insight on possible future breedings with these dogs.

thanks in advance C

[little old me]

it was you who gave me your private number you no one else that is the truth but the truth slips your mind quite easily good night and good bye

[jt ellison]

Not one single dog bred from the BLUE staffords in England has a genuine authentic pedigree without curs Pitbull , Bull Mastiff , Bull terrier or Wheaten blood thats a FACT there may be some in IRELAND butthose bred here in England by the dealers/peddlars back in the eighties had every kind of cross introduced and false papers hung on them . Hence anything descended from these dogs isnt worth the paper its written on , check out the post on the BEANIE thread all they do is argue about fake pedigrees now thats you people that own them , not me telling you this . I simply said i saw lots of litters on certain yards in the early eighties that had false pedigrees hung on them , this was seen by myself and a number of wellknown dogmen , so for the last time someone show me a TRUE GENUINE pedigree without any CURS . Thays my last word on this subject im sick of talking about CURBRED FALSE PEDIGREED dogs with FALSE KC registrations . As for you little old you you wouldnt know truth if one of those long haired staffords came and bit your arse with it , look at the dogs your all feeding theyve got false pedigrees are bred out of curs and theres nothing you can do to change it HA HAA HA HA

[jt ellison]

There are at least two significant breedings to Beanie left out Ricky to Beanie which produced Jack and Ricky Jnr , Jack was a good dog and his last mating was to Fly who was out of Ricky to his daughter according to Moderator , what he forgot to say was Ricky was a rank cur that quit cold so you have a good dog sired by a rank cur being bred to a bitch thats double bred on the same cur Ricky , this means the pups are 5/8ths Ricky and 5/8th cur bred i dont know the breeding of Beanie but am told she was a good bitch , so why breed her to a cur like Ricky and why inbreed on the Ricky dog ? but then again wasnt she bred to Milo or a double bred son of Milo ? Seems like you guys really know how to breed for them deepgame genes and you try to tell me that im wrong , this is all your own breedings when you check out all the post about false pedigrees posted by you people that keep these dogs then say IM wrong in what im saying read YOUR post and the history of these dogs by the so called experts that bred and keep them its a joke , now i might be wrong but i MYSELF wouldnt breed to a dog like Ricky and nor would i breed to his son no matter how game he was and a inbred son would certainly be a no no , but im not telling you how to breed GAMEDOGS as you obviously know just bry reading YOUR postings i can tell just were your coming from and were your all going and i wish you all the best of luck

[OnTheRocks]

just bry reading YOUR postings i can tell just were your coming from and were your all going and i wish you all the best of luck

You cannot tell anything about where I am coming from, or where I am going, based on my posts. My posts are pretty limited due to obvious reasons.

If anyone else has any interest to correct you on the production record of Rickey and Beanie and their offspring it is up to them, it’s easy enough. But I have no further interest in arguing with you. Have a nice day.

[evergreen]

Not one single dog bred from the BLUE staffords in England has a genuine authentic pedigree without curs Pitbull , Bull Mastiff , Bull terrier or Wheaten blood thats a FACT there may be some in IRELAND butthose bred here in England by the dealers/peddlars back in the eighties had every kind of cross introduced and false papers hung on them . Hence anything descended from these dogs isnt worth the paper its written on , check out the post on the BEANIE thread all they do is argue about fake pedigrees now thats you people that own them , not me telling you this . I simply said i saw lots of litters on certain yards in the early eighties that had false pedigrees hung on them , this was seen by myself and a number of wellknown dogmen , so for the last time someone show me a TRUE GENUINE pedigree without any CURS . Thays my last word on this subject im sick of talking about CURBRED FALSE PEDIGREED dogs with FALSE KC registrations . As for you little old you you wouldnt know truth if one of those long haired staffords came and bit your arse with it , look at the dogs your all feeding theyve got false pedigrees are bred out of curs and theres nothing you can do to change it HA HAA HA HA At least your man enough to admit you had a dog with a false ped, the great springview BLUE wolf

[jt ellison]

Your so dumb MA that you dont stop to think before you run your big mouth off , the Wolf dog had a genuine pedigree as posted by myself on this board for ALL to see, when i first got the dog he had a incorrect pedigree , which his breeder and Pinky from being a puppy till he came to PM then to myself . Why dont you tell us all about the matches you NEVER had and why the boys at Eastend Kennels call you the FORFEIT man or how you refused to match those great bitches you had out of the great Dutch import how you refused to match anyone, in fact you only matched one bitch and messed that up and lost to Peanuts then the boys you forfeited to beat Peanuts and gave you the name Forfeit man , i almost forgot the bitch yopu matched wasnt yours , even the Dutchman thinks your a fool and stated so in the TIMES . Cider Apple your a never was you never did anything and have done nothing since your one and only match which you LOST all those years ago , oh i remember the only dog you matched of your own it QUIT standing on all four feet the CHARLIE dog , he lost to PEACE who lost to SLEDGE who lost to MY CH Oneye dog , incidently GRCH Bruno stopped Charlie in ten minutes prior to you owning the dog thats why they sold him

[jt ellison]

Apologies the last post should read Pinky requested a male pup when he let Dann have Paddy and they sent him the WOLF dog he sold the dog to PM and then i had him of PM until his death . The rest of the post is correct CHARLIE quit for Cider APPLE and was his dog , the other a bitch was owned by others but still lost two matches two losses

[jt ellison]

For those who didnt know Springviews WOLF was sired by PADDY out of his litter sister Judy they were littermates to Malachy Judges Woodside Lad , WOLF was sent as a pup to Pinky who owned the Wolf Island prefix as he wanted a male pup out of Paddy when Dann bought the dog . The boys in Portsmouth (again) put MAX as the sire to WOLF and later the breeder of OLF told me he was out of PADDY this was later confirmed by Tom Haughey , Pinky , Peter Gorman and several other wellknown Irish dogmen , hence the pedigree was corrected , so CIDER APPLES once again your wrong and WOLF was bred as i stated and now tell me ONE single dog besides him today that has a GENUINE pedigree ?????

[GANGSTERUK]

ive read some of this thread re ricky being a cur!!!! n quitting cold..1 word bollocks..a big word "CUR" to hang on a dog... and ricky was 1 id have been proud to have on my yard....

[jt ellison]

Ok Ricky was a deepgame dog that never quit the one word is bollocks and Ricky didnt have any !!!!!

[OnTheRocks]

Ok Ricky was a deepgame dog that never quit the one word is bollocks and Ricky didnt have any !!!!!


They decided to let you back on again, and the first thing you do is to continue your bullshit. I cannot vouch for Rickey since I never saw him. But I saw a few of his offspring and they were good dogs to say the least.

And based on our previous conversations you are clearly not the man to talk about others lacking bollocks! You sure don’t have any…

[jt ellison]

It dont matter how many great dogs Bullyson produced he still QUIT the same as Ricky did nothing changes that , your a fake with many names , MODERATOR being only one of them ? As for being banned WOW SHOCK HORROW what am i gonna do my world has ended . I dont reply to silly challenges that might make you feel good regardless of what name your using today , your so full of bullshit you hide behind a pen name like a foolish internet warrior , you got so much balls that you use many names to run your mouth off , everyone knows who i am my number is in the phone directory i put my name to what i say and dont hide behind a pen name , what shall i call you today OXTAIL or OFF YOUR ROCKS , make your mind up and by the way next time you wanna run your mouth off on a public board for all to see please dont mention my name be it by PM or on a open board thats dangerous and as i told you before I DO NOT FIGHT DOGS and havent done for over twenty years . You are a fake and a liar as i and others know who you are , several people have told me exactly who you are so put your board and your curbred dogs with false pedigrees and Pitbull , Wheaten , Bull Mastiff , Bull Terrier blood in them that you call staffords ha ha ha and live in loolipop land

[OnTheRocks]

You are just a silly old fool. There is no secret about who I am, there are enough people who knows who I am on this board. But I am certainly not the same person as OxStaf, which you should have known if you had a clue about anything at all.

You have absolutely no knowledge about the dogs I feed. But I can assure you they are superior to anything you ever had! A lot has happened in 20 odd years. For the rest I think you are just littering this board with your crap…

[GANGSTERUK]

Ok Ricky was a deepgame dog that never quit the one word is bollocks and Ricky didnt have any !!!!!
did i say he was deepgame no i said he never quit "cold" and thats true he never quit cold....and it would be polite reply to pms..

[Fly]

JT can you explain me why there is nothing much left of your'e superior staffords? Please don't talk about people in your'e answer, i realy can't imagine that if they where that superior to the cur scatterbred dogs no serieous dogman wanted to go along with the superior dogs. It seems to me it's easier breeding good dogs out of superior stock then trying to breed good dogs out of scatterbred crus.